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the regressive left pandering to Islam.

CLAX1911

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In the wake of the massacre in Orlando, I've looked into Islam, and honestly I find it profoundly disturbing. Every Muslim believes the Quran, they also believe the punishments prescribed by Allah are correct. This means death to LGBT. So all true Islamic believers rejoiced at the slaying in Orlando.

So my question is, why defend Islam? It's everything that the worst or the worst of Christianity brings on its best day. After hearing so many criticisms of Christianity for nothing close to Islam for these same people to defend Islam is not just confusing but profoundly hypocritical.

And to my LGBT brothers and sisters that are left spectrum of politics, how can you defend a religion that rejoiced at this brutality?
 

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In the wake of the massacre in Orlando, I've looked into Islam, and honestly I find it profoundly disturbing. Every Muslim believes the Quran, they also believe the punishments prescribed by Allah are correct. This means death to LGBT. So all true Islamic believers rejoiced at the slaying in Orlando.

So my question is, why defend Islam? It's everything that the worst or the worst of Christianity brings on its best day.
Because in the real world it comes down to individuals and their actions and reactions. What gets missed are the human beings who live in communities beside us and with us. Why would I condemn them? They have done me no harm and in many cases, much good. Why would I add to the hysteria that leads to persecution of innocents?


After hearing so many criticisms of Christianity for nothing close to Islam for these same people to defend Islam is not just confusing but profoundly hypocritical.
It sickens me that people professing to be Christian want to hurt men, women, and children because they differ in belief and their radicals are crazy.

It sickens me that to defend a fellow human being I am cast into some crazy pool and labelled and belittled without question and told what I believe. THAT's why.

And my anger at that injustice grows.

I don't defend violence ever so why am I told I do? Because crazies generalize....that's why.

The constant whining of "poor me" and finger pointing at a whole group of other people lumped together is tiresome.
 

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Because in the real world it comes down to individuals and their actions and reactions. What gets missed are the human beings who live in communities beside us and with us. Why would I condemn them? They have done me no harm and in many cases, much good. Why would I add to the hysteria that leads to persecution of innocents?


It sickens me that people professing to be Christian want to hurt men, women, and children because they differ in belief and their radicals are crazy.

It sickens me that to defend a fellow human being I am cast into some crazy pool and labelled and belittled without question and told what I believe. THAT's why.

And my anger at that injustice grows.

I don't defend violence ever so why am I told I do? Because crazies generalize....that's why.

The constant whining of "poor me" and finger pointing at a whole group of other people lumped together is tiresome.

That kind of equanimity should enrage any honest populist.
 

CLAX1911

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Because in the real world it comes down to individuals and their actions and reactions. What gets missed are the human beings who live in communities beside us and with us. Why would I condemn them? They have done me no harm and in many cases, much good. Why would I add to the hysteria that leads to persecution of innocents?
I am not talking about hysteria. I'm talking about the actual teachings if this religion. It's the goal of every Muslim to convert the planet. They aren't going to spare you because you gave them the benefit of the doubt. How many imams preach death to gays? Even if that isn't what sparked the Orlando massacre, (pretty sure it is), the fact that all over our nation Muslims rejoiced at this massacre is frightening.

It would be if they were Christian or Hindu also but they're not. So who is being hysterical?


It sickens me that people professing to be Christian want to hurt men, women, and children because they differ in belief and their radicals are crazy.
But not if they're Muslim. That's sickening.

It sickens me that to defend a fellow human being I am cast into some crazy pool and labelled and belittled without question and told what I believe. THAT's why.
Islam isn't a human being, it's a backward despicable idolatry. They are commanded to kill us. It's blatant in their book. How can you defend this?

And my anger at that injustice grows.
The injustice was done to those 49 people slaughtered in that club in Orlando. Their families, mother's that will never see their sons and daughters again. Every Muslim in the United states should stand up and denounce this act, but they don't, they rejoice, the Quran commands that moderate Muslims be killed.

I'm saying this hateful murderous ideal that rejoiced at the massacre in Orlando is not suffering injustice.

I don't defend violence ever so why am I told I do? Because crazies generalize....that's why.
You are.

The constant whining of "poor me" and finger pointing at a whole group of other people lumped together is tiresome.
The constant defending of people that have spoken themselves and said that they think homosexuality should be illegal, that the punishment for it should be death, that women must obey their husbands, is insane.

I am at a loss for words, I can only come to the conclusion that because you defend the vary people that would rejoice at my death you are my enemy as well, an enemy to the LGBT.
 

calamity

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In the wake of the massacre in Orlando, I've looked into Islam, and honestly I find it profoundly disturbing. Every Muslim believes the Quran, they also believe the punishments prescribed by Allah are correct. This means death to LGBT. So all true Islamic believers rejoiced at the slaying in Orlando.

So my question is, why defend Islam? It's everything that the worst or the worst of Christianity brings on its best day. After hearing so many criticisms of Christianity for nothing close to Islam for these same people to defend Islam is not just confusing but profoundly hypocritical.

And to my LGBT brothers and sisters that are left spectrum of politics, how can you defend a religion that rejoiced at this brutality?

My greatest concern with Islam is that, unlike Christianity and many other religions where life is augmented by the religion, Islam is the way of life. Followers of Islam live it. The food they eat, the clothes they wear, the law they follow, the friends they keep, everything hinges on the religion. Look at life in any Islamic state. It's right there for all eyes to see.

As for tolerance, or I should say, the lack of it. Islam, IMO, is Jehovah Witness like, but with a billion followers...and, a strong dose of violence.
 

CLAX1911

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My greatest concern with Islam is that, unlike Christianity and many other religions where life is augmented by the religion, Islam is the way of life. Followers of Islam live it. The food they eat, the clothes they wear, the law they follow, the friends they keep, everything hinges on the religion. Look at life in any Islamic state. It's right there for all eyes to see.
But people are blind to it. They want to blather about Christianity. For Christ's sake the western world had a ****ing renaissance. They abandoned biblical teachings largely. It's not even close. Even if some bat **** nuts thumpers call for death to homos. They represent a tiny minority.

As for tolerance, or I should say, the lack of it. Islam, IMO, is Jehovah Witness like, but with a billion followers...and, a strong dose of violence.
No, jws are pacifists even though they belong to a brainwashed cult they aren't even close.
 

calamity

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But people are blind to it. They want to blather about Christianity. For Christ's sake the western world had a ****ing renaissance. They abandoned biblical teachings largely. It's not even close. Even if some bat **** nuts thumpers call for death to homos. They represent a tiny minority.
We discussed this issue briefly yesterday at a family gathering. My comment was, "We need to find a way to drag these people into the 21st century." Of course, I also had to admit that I had no idea how that would be done.

No, jws are pacifists even though they belong to a brainwashed cult they aren't even close.
Agreed on violence, the JW are not even remotely comparable. I was referring more their intolerance and the way the religion infiltrates their entire way of life, including rejection of family members who leave the cult or do not want to join it. When it comes to violence, I cannot think of any religion which is on par with Islam.
 

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The hardest part of dealing with any religion based entirely on a very outdated text is convincing its strict adherents that not all parts of that "word of god" are intended to be taken literally. If some of that sacred text is wrong or should be ignored based on laws made by those outside the fiath then what of the rest of it?

The only way out of that sticky situation is by forcing reform from within. The hope for change of attitude of regressives excludes he use of force - if simply given enough time (keep saying that Islam is largely a religion of peace) then Islam will surely change for the better. Of course, that means many "infidel" lives must be sacrfiiced (for a few more decades at a bare minimmum) but under no circumstaces can regressves admit that is their "plan of action". Others see only the use of military force as a viable catylist for making that change happen much sooner.
 

CLAX1911

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We discussed this issue briefly yesterday at a family gathering. My comment was, "We need to find a way to drag these people into the 21st century." Of course, I also had to admit that I had no idea how that would be done.
I posit that we can't. The pagans couldn't drag the Christians into enlightenment, but we don't have to be slaughtered and conquered like the pagans were.


Agreed on violence, the JW are not even remotely comparable. I was referring more their intolerance and the way the religion infiltrates their entire way of life, including rejection of family members who leave the cult or do not want to join it. When it comes to violence, I cannot think of any religion which is on par with Islam.
Eastern Christianity is pretty nasty.
 

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It sickens me that people professing to be Christian want to hurt men, women, and children because they differ in belief and their radicals are crazy.

It sickens me that to defend a fellow human being I am cast into some crazy pool and labelled and belittled without question and told what I believe. THAT's why.

And my anger at that injustice grows.

I don't defend violence ever so why am I told I do? Because crazies generalize....that's why.

The constant whining of "poor me" and finger pointing at a whole group of other people lumped together is tiresome.

First off, where is it that "people professing to be Christian want to hurt men, women, and children because they differ in belief and their radicals are crazy."?

I am not a Christian, so I have no particular dog in that fight... but I do not see that statement as being one attempting to get at truth. In what ways are they wanting to hurt folks? Is it in their honest opinion that a lifestyle that, just based on the numbers involved if nothing else, deviates from the norm and so, by definition, is not normal... and should not be promoted as such? Is that the extent of the hurt you are talking about? And isn't that a generalization?

It may be, and all generalizations are not false if they apply generally, right?

Or are you talking about their radicals? I have seen no real demonstration that Christian radicals are anywhere near close to being as dangerous individually or a group as have the radical ranks in Islam...

In radical Islam they form groups, armed and trained to kill those that are not them, to terrorize to the point of cutting off heads, en masse, burning live people in cages, rape and pillage even their own, get innocent people to jump off 110 story buildings ... Any radicals, zealots are somewhat suspect... but the Christians seem to keep it somewhat in bounds, you must confess, and it is more their first amendment rights of which, granted, some push the envelope way too far at times... but those extreme cases [Westboro Baptist Church] are roundly, openly and loudly excoriated/criticized/looked down upon by almost all others of that faith...

That surely is not a valid comparison to Islam, its adherents and especially its tens of millions deep radical elements. When you have that many millions who are that ardent, is it still just a generalization... or something that we truly have to conscious of and guard against? Especially if those not radical are not really doing much about it themselves?

If it were an infection, and this is infection like as its radical adherents like a virus are growing world wide, would you not have an Ellis Island like approach in America, quarantine until you can determine which are diseased and which are not? Is that not a first priority of a national government, to protect its citizens first?
 

CLAX1911

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The hardest part of dealing with any religion based entirely on a very outdated text is convincing its strict adherents that not all parts of that "word of god" are intended to be taken literally. If some of that sacred text is wrong or should be ignored based on laws made by those outside the fiath then what of the rest of it?
I disagree with the last bit. Laws made by people outside the faith rearly have any impact. I'd say it's the understanding that obedience isn't morality.

The only way out of that sticky situation is by forcing reform from within. The hope for change of attitude of regressives excludes he use of force - if simply given enough time (keep saying that Islam is largely a religion of peace) then Islam will surely change for the better. Of course, that means many "infidel" lives must be sacrfiiced (for a few more decades at a bare minimmum) but under no circumstaces can regressves admit that is their "plan of action". Others see only the use of military force as a viable catylist for making that change happen much sooner.
Really? You think that is what they think?
 

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I disagree with the last bit. Laws made by people outside the faith rearly have any impact. I'd say it's the understanding that obedience isn't morality.


Really? You think that is what they think?

what is it exactly you would like to see done?
 

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I posit that we can't. The pagans couldn't drag the Christians into enlightenment, but we don't have to be slaughtered and conquered like the pagans were.
THey have to pull themselves out of it. First step is to get the religion out of government. Good luck with that though. It took a solid 1700 years to finally kick the Vatican out of Europe's power structure. So, with Islam being about 600 years behind the times....I won't be holding my breath.


Eastern Christianity is pretty nasty.
I guess, if we look at places like Bosnia, where Bosnian Serbs slaughtered anyone not belonging to their ethnicity....yeah, it certainly can be, even in modern times. In days gone by though, I'd say both Eastern and Western Christians had their issues. I'm not sure I'd trust either to run a country without a secular government keeping them in check.

All that "Jesus forgives" crap is just lip service when Christians have free reign. They can be just as brutal to LGBT as are the Taliban. All we need do is look at Uganda.
 

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I disagree with the last bit. Laws made by people outside the faith rearly have any impact. I'd say it's the understanding that obedience isn't morality.


Really? You think that is what they think?

How many witches were burned recently? Now many states no longer permit SSM? Laws, if enforced, clearly have a lasting impact. Yes, I think that Obama actually believes that zapping the occasional "high ranking" terror dude, while pretending that their many followers are not worthy of our direct attention, will change (1.6 billion?) hearts and minds eventually.
 

CLAX1911

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THey have to pull themselves out of it. First step is to get the religion out of government. Good luck with that though. It took a solid 1700 years to finally kick the Vatican out of Europe's power structure. So, with Islam being about 600 years behind the times....I won't be holding my breath.



I guess, if we look at places like Bosnia, where Bosnian Serbs slaughtered anyone not belonging to their ethnicity....yeah, it certainly can be, even in modern times. In days gone by though, I'd say both Eastern and Western Christians had their issues. I'm not sure I'd trust either to run a country without a secular government keeping them in check.

All that "Jesus forgives" crap is just lip service when Christians have free reign. They can be just as brutal to LGBT as are the Taliban. All we need do is look at Uganda.
Secular government is necessary but impossible with Islam.
 

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In the wake of the massacre in Orlando, I've looked into Islam, and honestly I find it profoundly disturbing. Every Muslim believes the Quran, they also believe the punishments prescribed by Allah are correct. This means death to LGBT. So all true Islamic believers rejoiced at the slaying in Orlando.

So my question is, why defend Islam? It's everything that the worst or the worst of Christianity brings on its best day. After hearing so many criticisms of Christianity for nothing close to Islam for these same people to defend Islam is not just confusing but profoundly hypocritical.

And to my LGBT brothers and sisters that are left spectrum of politics, how can you defend a religion that rejoiced at this brutality?

Because it part of the Leftist narrative. It's a package deal.

I don't understand it either.
 

CLAX1911

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How many witches were burned recently? Now many states no longer permit SSM? Laws, if enforced, clearly have a lasting impact. Yes, I think that Obama actually believes that zapping the occasional "high ranking" terror dude, while pretending that their many followers are not worthy of our direct attention, will change (1.6 billion?) hearts and minds eventually.
What of us will be left? How many more mother's have to lose their sons and daughters?

I don't think it's our business to drag these troglodytes into the sixteenth century. We have plenty to deal with at home.
 
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