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The Qur'an in three verses

stevecanuck

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The Qur'an has two very distinct 'Testaments'. The first is comprised of the surahs created in the first 12 years (610 - 622 CE) when Mohamed lived in his home city of Mecca. He spent those years trying to convert the pagans to monotheism and to accept him as God's messenger. His recruitment method was to endlessly recite Old Testament stories of God's wrath to them in a failed attempt to scare them into compliance. During that time he introduced almost nothing new to those stories, which meant that Islam to that point was indistinguishable from Judaism except for the fact that he was God's final prophet. The entire period can be defined by verse 29:68 "Who does more wrong than he who invents a lie against Allah or rejects the Truth when it reaches him? Is there not a home in Hell for those who reject Faith?".

The second (622 - 632 CE) began when Mohamed relocated to Medina, turned Islam into a warrior religion, and introduced all the rules that finally made Islam definable as a unique entity. He began raiding Meccan caravans and the wars were on. Verse 9:111 sums up God's expectations of his servants, "Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain.".

One thing that did not change was God's hatred of all things and people infidel the entire time. Verse 2:98 says it all, "Allah is the enemy of unbelievers".
 

zyzygy

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The Qur'an has two very distinct 'Testaments'. The first is comprised of the surahs created in the first 12 years (610 - 622 CE) when Mohamed lived in his home city of Mecca. He spent those years trying to convert the pagans to monotheism and to accept him as God's messenger. His recruitment method was to endlessly recite Old Testament stories of God's wrath to them in a failed attempt to scare them into compliance. During that time he introduced almost nothing new to those stories, which meant that Islam to that point was indistinguishable from Judaism except for the fact that he was God's final prophet. The entire period can be defined by verse 29:68 "Who does more wrong than he who invents a lie against Allah or rejects the Truth when it reaches him? Is there not a home in Hell for those who reject Faith?".

The second (622 - 632 CE) began when Mohamed relocated to Medina, turned Islam into a warrior religion, and introduced all the rules that finally made Islam definable as a unique entity. He began raiding Meccan caravans and the wars were on. Verse 9:111 sums up God's expectations of his servants, "Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain.".

One thing that did not change was God's hatred of all things and people infidel the entire time. Verse 2:98 says it all, "Allah is the enemy of unbelievers".

Like Christianity.
 

ecofarm

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There are about half a dozen of you who I expect to 'contribute' whataboutism to this thread. That's one down.

You shouldn't expect anything else to result from your hate-based BS.
 

zyzygy

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There are about half a dozen of you who I expect to 'contribute' whataboutism to this thread. That's one down.

You are right, Christianity has always been such a peaceful religion. Just post 'I hate Muslims', it will save time.
 

stevecanuck

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You are right, Christianity has always been such a peaceful religion. Just post 'I hate Muslims', it will save time.

Christianity HAS always been a peaceful religion. Christians, not so much.
 

zyzygy

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I am still waiting for the local Muslims to start obeying the Koran and kill all us infidels. They really are a bunch of backsliders, perhaps someone. should have a word with them
 

ecofarm

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I am still waiting for the local Muslims to start obeying the Koran and kill all us infidels. They really are a bunch of backsliders, perhaps someone. should have a word with them

You think spewers of hate such as in the OP have not seen all the counters before? It's a cult. They'll never hear you. Ironic, isn't it.
 

stevecanuck

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Try reading some history! :lamo:lamo

History is exactly what I'm talking about. It doesn't change the fact that Jesus (according to Christian belief) taught love and peace. History tells us the message was ignored for at least 1500 years.
 

ecofarm

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What did I get wrong? Did I misquote? Did I mischaracterize? Please be specific.

Your characterization of both a religion and its adherents is hate based. That's clear to everyone not in the Islamophobic victim-boy cult.
 

zyzygy

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History is exactly what I'm talking about. It doesn't change the fact that Jesus (according to Christian belief) taught love and peace. History tells us the message was ignored for at least 1500 years.

So carry on ignoring it.
 

OrphanSlug

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The Qur'an has two very distinct 'Testaments'. The first is comprised of the surahs created in the first 12 years (610 - 622 CE) when Mohamed lived in his home city of Mecca. He spent those years trying to convert the pagans to monotheism and to accept him as God's messenger. His recruitment method was to endlessly recite Old Testament stories of God's wrath to them in a failed attempt to scare them into compliance. During that time he introduced almost nothing new to those stories, which meant that Islam to that point was indistinguishable from Judaism except for the fact that he was God's final prophet. The entire period can be defined by verse 29:68 "Who does more wrong than he who invents a lie against Allah or rejects the Truth when it reaches him? Is there not a home in Hell for those who reject Faith?".

The second (622 - 632 CE) began when Mohamed relocated to Medina, turned Islam into a warrior religion, and introduced all the rules that finally made Islam definable as a unique entity. He began raiding Meccan caravans and the wars were on. Verse 9:111 sums up God's expectations of his servants, "Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain.".

One thing that did not change was God's hatred of all things and people infidel the entire time. Verse 2:98 says it all, "Allah is the enemy of unbelievers".

All that this really showcases is of the three Abrahamic Religions it is Islam that is the easiest to use as a means to go kill someone.

The text of Judaism / the Old Testament for Christianity has similar tone here and there but not quite phrased the way that Mohammad went with to make similar points. Also the two periods we are talking about were in relation to the earliest being around conversion but later Mohammad faced what always happens in that part of the world. Conquest, warfare, etc. It is why later text went off the deep end in terms of rhetoric and for the most part lunacy.

All the Abrahamic Religions, which is to say all the text from the period in this regard, all shared some means to deal with nonbelievers up to and including violence and killing.

The issue we have is Islam also is the furthest behind the evolutionary curve, presents the most obstacles to evolution (especially from the outside,) and perhaps the most socially conservative and theocratic of the three.

Anyone can, and enough do, weaponize religion as a reason to harm someone. Islam is arguably better at it.
 
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zyzygy

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Your characterization of both a religion and its adherents is hate based. That's clear to everyone not in the Islamophobic victim-boy cult.

Every now and again Steve seems to feel the need for a Muslim hate fest.
 

stevecanuck

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Your characterization of both a religion and its adherents is hate based. That's clear to everyone not in the Islamophobic victim-boy cult.

"And it's adherents"?????? Show me where I've done that.
 

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The Qur'an has two very distinct 'Testaments'. The first is comprised of the surahs created in the first 12 years (610 - 622 CE) when Mohamed lived in his home city of Mecca. He spent those years trying to convert the pagans to monotheism and to accept him as God's messenger. His recruitment method was to endlessly recite Old Testament stories of God's wrath to them in a failed attempt to scare them into compliance. During that time he introduced almost nothing new to those stories, which meant that Islam to that point was indistinguishable from Judaism except for the fact that he was God's final prophet. The entire period can be defined by verse 29:68 "Who does more wrong than he who invents a lie against Allah or rejects the Truth when it reaches him? Is there not a home in Hell for those who reject Faith?".

The second (622 - 632 CE) began when Mohamed relocated to Medina, turned Islam into a warrior religion, and introduced all the rules that finally made Islam definable as a unique entity. He began raiding Meccan caravans and the wars were on. Verse 9:111 sums up God's expectations of his servants, "Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain.".

One thing that did not change was God's hatred of all things and people infidel the entire time. Verse 2:98 says it all, "Allah is the enemy of unbelievers".

So what? All the major religions preach hate and intolerance while simultaneously preaching love and tolerance. You have to cherry pick the latter out of the former to argue any of them are peaceful religions.
 

zyzygy

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"And it's adherents"?????? Show me where I've done that.

Most Muslims are peaceful, most Christians are peaceful, with the possible exception of the US, so what is the problem?
 

ecofarm

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Most Christians and Muslims ignore the hateful parts of their holy book.

Those preserving their organized metaphysical expression reinterpret. That lasts longer.
 

stevecanuck

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All that this really showcases is of the three Abrahamic Religions it is Islam that is the easiest to use as a means to go kill someone.

That's because it explicitly says to, and not just in the moment, but in an ongoing sense.

The text of Judaism / the Old Testament for Christianity has similar tone here and there but not quite phrased the way that Mohammad went with to make similar points. Also the two periods we are talking about were in relation to the earliest being around conversion but later Mohammad faced what always happens in that part of the world. Conquest, warfare, etc. It is why later text went off the deep end in terms of rhetoric and for the most part lunacy.

Mohamed did not face a single physically hostile act until he started raiding Meccan caravans.

All the Abrahamic Religions, which is to say all the text from the period in this regard, all shared some means to deal with nonbelievers up to and including violence and killing.

Not anything to do with Jesus. He told a parable about the 10 minas, but that doesn't translate to a command to attack and subjugate for Christians. There is nothing in the NT even remotely like verse 9:29 of the Qur'an, "Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.".

The issue we have is Islam also is the furthest behind the evolutionary curve, presents the most obstacles to evolution (especially from the outside,) and perhaps the most socially conservative and theocratic of the three.

Anyone can, and enough do, weaponize religion as a reason to harm someone. Islam is arguably better at it.

Unfortunately, Islam's curve ended with the death of Mohamed. Islam is not USED as a reason. It IS the reason. That is the difference that people just hate to recognize.

PS. Thanks for showing people what a reasoned response looks like.
 

stevecanuck

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Most Muslims are peaceful, most Christians are peaceful, with the possible exception of the US, so what is the problem?

There are enough Muslims who are NOT peaceful to be a problem. THAT is the problem.
 
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