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The Problem With the America Police System: pt2

jaypatriot said:
Do you have any suggestions as to how we can make cops do better?
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Several. End qualified immunity. End civil asset forfeiture. Have independent investigations of police misconduct (too often, it is the police that are tasked with policing themselves). Mandatory body cameras that they are not able to mute or turn off. More accountability in terms of police not being able to deny access to that body camera footage.

jaypatriot said:
Was Colin Kaepernick right to use a national soapbox and ruin his entire NFL career to tell us there are bad cops out there who need to be policed?
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Sure. Why not? It was pretty damn harmless.

jaypatriot said:
Are police, in general, bad in your opinion.?
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Nope.

jaypatriot said:
Are are they simply like today's politicians? Some are venal, duplicitous, and deserve to be investigated and thrown in jail?
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I support good cops. Bad cops endanger the lives of good cops.
 
Drowning Man said:
Several. End qualified immunity. End civil asset forfeiture. Have independent investigations of police misconduct (too often, it is the police that are tasked with policing themselves). Mandatory body cameras that they are not able to mute or turn off. More accountability in terms of police not being able to deny access to that body camera footage.



Sure. Why not? It was pretty damn harmless.



Nope.



I support good cops. Bad cops endanger the lives of good cops.
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You're not Drowning, Man. You're on the surface making common sense.
 
code1211 said:
How would the responding officer know there was no need to run warrants if the warrants were not run? Are you suggesting that an armed and dangerous child molester in custody should be released?
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You accept a police state... I don't.
code1211 said:
Again, if they have the person in their hands, why not check to see if they have the person in their hands?
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There are a myriad of reasons... the main one being that the cop will be harassing millions of innocent civilians.
code1211 said:
I was told once that on the application for used in Minnesota to buy a gun, the sellers are required to ask this question:

"Are you currently in flight from Federal Authorities?"

Seems almost comical to ask the question, but if the answer was, "Yes", I was told the seller was prohibited from continuing with the sales process.
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Buying a gun is not being innocent and detained by police.
 
code1211 said:
Did you watch the video?

Nobody pointed a gun at anybody at any time for any reason.

What are you talking about?
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At 25 seconds the cop gets out of his car and points his firearm directly at the little girl in white by the drivers side door. He semi-lowers the gun the aims it a second time.
 
Drowning Man said:
You're not even trying...

It's the JOB of the police to deal with the criminal elements of society. Of course they are going to have a more dangerous job and be in contact with more dangerous people than the ordinary citizen will. And most people don't have all that many interactions with cops. So, your stats are completely skewed.

And even under your completely skewed stats, you don't even try. I mean, I showed how the 502 deaths in 2021 for police on the job included things like COVID (341 deaths) and the weather...but you lumped them all together as the populace being a threat to cops...

It really looks like you're done.
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He says that he watched the video and won't even admit the copped aimed his gun... FFS.



@code1211
 
Drowning Man said:
Actually, you're wrong there, too. They don't have to appear. The police have fought and won the right to NOT be responsible for protecting people, which would include not appearing if called.



Irrelevant. They must first follow the law...you know...as law enforcement officers? If they were just armed thugs, I'd agree. But they're supposed to be better than that.



Considering how often cops are actually harmed on the job by criminals, I rather think you're projecting.
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Your position is not reasonable.

That's okay.
 
Drowning Man said:
You're not even trying...

It's the JOB of the police to deal with the criminal elements of society. Of course they are going to have a more dangerous job and be in contact with more dangerous people than the ordinary citizen will. And most people don't have all that many interactions with cops. So, your stats are completely skewed.

And even under your completely skewed stats, you don't even try. I mean, I showed how the 502 deaths in 2021 for police on the job included things like COVID (341 deaths) and the weather...but you lumped them all together as the populace being a threat to cops...

It really looks like you're done.
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I used your statistics. If you would like to use different stats, please link to them and we can use them.
 
code1211 said:
I used your statistics. If you would like to use different stats, please link to them and we can use them.
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:rolleyes:

Again, you're not getting it. You're acting as if EVERY single person in the US has an interaction with the police each year. That's clearly false.
You're also acting like EVERY police death (even Covid and natural disasters) should be included in how police see danger from the populace. That's clearly false.

You're playing games and being intellectually dishonest in your arguments.

Is this all you have left?
 
Bodhisattva said:
You accept a police state... I don't.

There are a myriad of reasons... the main one being that the cop will be harassing millions of innocent civilians.

Buying a gun is not being innocent and detained by police.
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When. the police are called, they must assume that the situation is cause for concern and the news of the day dictates caution as they are exposed to potentially grave danger.

That's the way it is.
 
Bodhisattva said:
At 25 seconds the cop gets out of his car and points his firearm directly at the little girl in white by the drivers side door. He semi-lowers the gun the aims it a second time.
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The cop that I saw near the start of the video was waving with one hand raised and the other hand, the one down by his side, was down by his side.

Again, what are you talking about.
 
Bodhisattva said:
He says that he watched the video and won't even admit the copped aimed his gun... FFS.



@code1211
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What you imagine you saw and what was on the actual video in the real world are apparently not the same thing.
 
code1211 said:
The cop that I saw near the start of the video was waving with one hand raised and the other hand, the one down by his side, was down by his side.

Again, what are you talking about.
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If you refuse to be honest about the cop pointing a gun at the car and little girl then there is no point debating you about any of this.
 
Bodhisattva said:
More on this case




PULLING GUNS ON a 14 year old ... 7 year old a 2 YEAR OLD GIRLSS

What in the **** is wrong with policing and the Chief thinks it was handled well?
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@code1211

Go to the 1:17 time mark of this video. Even the reporters say (as they show it) that the cop pointed his gun at them.
 
Drowning Man said:
Your "reasonableness" has nothing to do with the law.

That's okay.
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Many times the law and reasonableness do not intersect.

Responding to calls when received is what cops do. Same as firemen.
 
Drowning Man said:
:rolleyes:

Again, you're not getting it. You're acting as if EVERY single person in the US has an interaction with the police each year. That's clearly false.
You're also acting like EVERY police death (even Covid and natural disasters) should be included in how police see danger from the populace. That's clearly false.

You're playing games and being intellectually dishonest in your arguments.

Is this all you have left?
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We used YOUR statistics and I showed you that police are a threatened group and that they are being assassinated by miscreants for no other reason than that they are wearing police uniforms.

I don't know what your denial of the facts delivers to you.
 
Bodhisattva said:
If you refuse to be honest about the cop pointing a gun at the car and little girl then there is no point debating you about any of this.
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There was no gun pointed.
 
Drowning Man said:
@code1211

Go to the 1:17 time mark of this video. Even the reporters say (as they show it) that the cop pointed his gun at them.
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Again, I'm not seeing a gun. If you are seeing a gun, it could be because you REALLY, REALLY want to see a gun.

I don't know.

In the part of the video showing the two officers approaching the guy in the sweat pants, they both seem to be holding up empty hands with fingers spread.

No tree branches to obstruct the view in these images.
 
Yeah…I put him in timeout. Life is too short to waste time on people like that.
 
Drowning Man said:
Yeah…I put him in timeout. Life is too short to waste time on people like that.
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It is pretty pathetic to just blatantly lie like he is.

It is like a kid... did you take a cookie? No daddy. But son, you are holding it in your hand. No I am not.

LOL
 
Bodhisattva said:
So you refuse to be honest. Thank you for making that very clear.
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I have studied that video.

I did not see a gun.

Viewed through the branches of the tree, it appears that the cop is wiggling his fingers of his empty hand.

As the two cops approach the man subsequently hand cuffed, and the body cam view is posted, both cops have empty hands raised with fingers spread.

I'm sorry. What you are claiming to be evident and apparent is not there.
 
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