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The Price of Freedom

Kal'Stang

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What exactly IS the Price of Freedom?

It varies.

For our freedom of speech we have to deal with words that we find offensive. Without that freedom of speech we could only say what was "acceptable" based on someone's personal views. Who that someone is may vary. What they find acceptable will vary also. Which means that at any time whatever you say could be found "offensive" and you will be punished for it.

For our freedom of defense we have to put up with bad people doing bad things and killing people. Without it then we could be subjected to all kinds of abuses by both the criminal element and a tyrannical government. With no chance of defending ourselves in either situation.

Our Right to be judged by our peers allows for criminals to sometimes go free while innocents get prison or even the death penalty. But without that Right we'd be subject to a system that takes no account whatsoever on the different circumstances that may have led to whatever crime it is you're accused of. Such as killing the person who you caught raping your child.

What IS the price of freedom? It's having to deal with all the negatives that go along with those freedoms. There is no perfect world. There never will be. There will always be situations that you'd rather not have to deal with. But deal with them you must. Because not dealing with them could very well make the situation far far worse. That is the Price of Freedom. And no matter how much people will say "Freedumb" it will not change this fact.
 

Deuce

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Five Three easy payments of $19.95
 

TheParser

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What exactly IS the Price of Freedom?

It varies.

For our freedom of speech we have to deal with words that we find offensive. Without that freedom of speech we could only say what was "acceptable" based on someone's personal views. Who that someone is may vary. What they find acceptable will vary also. Which means that at any time whatever you say could be found "offensive" and you will be punished for it.

Correct. "Freedom of speech" does not actually exist.



In China, you may not even mention, for example, the term "judicial independence." Thousands of Web censors will immediately delete it.

In Europe, there is serious talk of criminalizing any criticism of immigration.


And in our country, certain comments about protected classes will be sanctioned (banned from forums, fired from one's job, etc.).


We all learn from an early age to keep our mouths shut -- or else.


P.S. One wag once said that our highly vaunted concept of "freedom of the press" exists only for those who actually own a press.
 

Grokmaster

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What exactly IS the Price of Freedom?

It varies.

For our freedom of speech we have to deal with words that we find offensive. Without that freedom of speech we could only say what was "acceptable" based on someone's personal views. Who that someone is may vary. What they find acceptable will vary also. Which means that at any time whatever you say could be found "offensive" and you will be punished for it.

For our freedom of defense we have to put up with bad people doing bad things and killing people. Without it then we could be subjected to all kinds of abuses by both the criminal element and a tyrannical government. With no chance of defending ourselves in either situation.

Our Right to be judged by our peers allows for criminals to sometimes go free while innocents get prison or even the death penalty. But without that Right we'd be subject to a system that takes no account whatsoever on the different circumstances that may have led to whatever crime it is you're accused of. Such as killing the person who you caught raping your child.

What IS the price of freedom? It's having to deal with all the negatives that go along with those freedoms. There is no perfect world. There never will be. There will always be situations that you'd rather not have to deal with. But deal with them you must. Because not dealing with them could very well make the situation far far worse. That is the Price of Freedom. And no matter how much people will say "Freedumb" it will not change this fact.

Freedom is messy, no doubt, but here is the REAL PRICE:

Saluting-casket.jpg
 

Myview

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Among several thoughts that come to me about the price of freedom the first that comes to me is America's gun culture. The right to bear arms is enshrined in our constitution so I don't believe it is under threat. Still although the gun culture encompasses a sizeable minority of Americans it is still a minority. For political reasons and because the gun culture is willing to fight fiercely for it's freedom even the most basic of common sense gun regulation is viewed as a threat to gun right freedoms. Conversely the majority of Americans who agree to the most basic of gun regulations are not willing to fight fiercely to put those regulations in place. Only those who have had children and family members fall victim to gun violence are willing to fight fiercely. The rest of us believe it will not happen to us. I see gun violence as just another price of freedom that so far a majority of people are willing to endure. Eventually the most basic of common sense gun regulation will be in place but the peoples right will carry on and a price will be paid for that freedom.

The most basic of government responsibility to American citizens is to keep us protected from foreign threats or invasion. From time to time we have been involved in wars that were of a questionable nature. Some wars are clearly
against foes that present a threat to American interests, allies, or citizens. Many of our young men and women answer the call to serve in our armed forces to protect us from foreign threat. Some give the ultimate sacrifice, others are injured, some in life altering ways. That is another price we pay for freedom.

We must be a tolerant society. Sometimes being tolerant is not something we like because it conflicts with our personal views on religion, race, culture, money, land use, gender, and any number of social demographics. For our society to work the rights of minorities are protected. This includes religions, races, cultures, sexual orientation, and political view point. You may preach to your choir if you want to be intolerant. It may get you elected in your district.
I would suggest that eventually intoleration will get you defeated the higher the office is that you want to posses. So for some of us the price of living in a society where the rights of minorities are protected is a price of living in a free open society. Some rebel against toleration believing that their freedom ends when some one else's begins. Freedom in America means respecting others freedom as well as your own freedom. That is a price we pay for freedom.

As a nation we sometimes experiment politically because we have the right to that. Our experiments always work to a lessor or greater degree depending on our political ideas. There is actual real damage done to our country and there is damage that we politically imagine depending again on political orientation. Eventually the damage we do to ourselves can be repaired and we move on to other experiments. Our freedom to change political leaders from time to time can be viewed as both boon or bust to freedoms call. When we make a mistake it is a price we pay for freedom. History is the best definer of how things worked out; for that we have to wait a while.
 

OlNate

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What exactly IS the Price of Freedom?

It varies.

For our freedom of speech we have to deal with words that we find offensive. Without that freedom of speech we could only say what was "acceptable" based on someone's personal views. Who that someone is may vary. What they find acceptable will vary also. Which means that at any time whatever you say could be found "offensive" and you will be punished for it.

For our freedom of defense we have to put up with bad people doing bad things and killing people. Without it then we could be subjected to all kinds of abuses by both the criminal element and a tyrannical government. With no chance of defending ourselves in either situation.

Our Right to be judged by our peers allows for criminals to sometimes go free while innocents get prison or even the death penalty. But without that Right we'd be subject to a system that takes no account whatsoever on the different circumstances that may have led to whatever crime it is you're accused of. Such as killing the person who you caught raping your child.

What IS the price of freedom? It's having to deal with all the negatives that go along with those freedoms. There is no perfect world. There never will be. There will always be situations that you'd rather not have to deal with. But deal with them you must. Because not dealing with them could very well make the situation far far worse. That is the Price of Freedom. And no matter how much people will say "Freedumb" it will not change this fact.

If you need to include evil in the cost of freedom, you are not truly free, as you can never be sure that evil won't be turned against you. Freedom is a noble concept, and therefore can tolerate no treachery. That is something you guys lost somewhere along the way...and why you guys are no longer "free".
 

Xelor

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God, give us grace to accept with serenity the things that cannot be changed,
Courage to change the things which should be changed,
and the Wisdom to distinguish the one from the other.
-- Reinhold Niebuhr, "Serenity Prayer"​



While God may grant one grace, courage and wisdom, as with all gifts, one must receive them and, in turn, avail oneself of them. What does it cost to avail oneself of grace, courage and wisdom? It varies from person to person, but for all who would be free, part of the cost is, as Roosevelt noted, accepting responsibility of being a person of fine character. What does it take to be a person of fine character?
  • Learning humility and rejecting pride.
  • Showing kindness and abjuring envy.
  • Practicing abstinence and forsaking gluttony.
  • Exercising chastity rather than indulging one's lust.
  • Developing patience and restraining anger.
  • Exhibiting liberality and constraining one's avarice.
  • Sallying forth with diligence when it's easier be slothful.
The price of freedom, our ultimate luxury, is whatever one must pay so one's virtue vanquishes one's vulgarity.



Some people think luxury is the opposite of poverty. It is not. It is the opposite of vulgarity.
-- Coco Chanel​
 

Thoreau72

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Freedom is messy, no doubt, but here is the REAL PRICE:

View attachment 67245341

I would like to know how the deaths of soldiers in the War On Terror, or the deaths of soldiers in Southeast Asia all those years ago contribute any way to freedom?

How have the Vietnamese, or Iraqis, or Afghanis or Libyans tried to take our freedoms away?
 

apdst

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If you need to include evil in the cost of freedom, you are not truly free, as you can never be sure that evil won't be turned against you. Freedom is a noble concept, and therefore can tolerate no treachery. That is something you guys lost somewhere along the way...and why you guys are no longer "free".

How have we tolerated treachery?
 

OlNate

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How have we tolerated treachery?

lmfao...in which direction would you like me to begin? Foreign policy? Domestic policy? Trade? Warfare? Economy? Social issues?

Seriously, go back to your corner, asking questions like that. :lol:

Or, maybe it's just become so ingrained that you don't even see it anymore...like, moving next to a pig farm - eventually you don't notice the smell of ****.
 

apdst

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lmfao...in which direction would you like me to begin? Foreign policy? Domestic policy? Trade? Warfare? Economy? Social issues?

Seriously, go back to your corner, asking questions like that. :lol:

Or, maybe it's just become so ingrained that you don't even see it anymore...like, moving next to a pig farm - eventually you don't notice the smell of ****.

Well, when you trash my country, I'm going to challenge you.

Now, clarify your point.
 

OlNate

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Well, when you trash my country, I'm going to challenge you.

Now, clarify your point.

Oh...you're making demands? :lol: Shall I mail you your invitation to kiss my ass, or will sending it to you here suffice?

Ap. You are infamous on this forum as a hard right troll. I tend to like you, because you are good at it, but I will not be wasting my entire day educating you on things you probably already know, and would robotically deny, whether you know them to be true or not.

And I don't have to, because I was responding to the OP, which makes the claim:

For our freedom of defense we have to put up with bad people doing bad things and killing people.

I disagree, which is what the first post that you quoted was saying. You wanna dig deeper, Google's a great place to start...or Bing, if you've done your partisan duty and sworn off of Google...lolz

One more thing: I'm not trashing your country. I'm merely calling out what everyone around the world already knows. Telling the truth is not trashing. Maybe talk to the folks who are taking these actions around the world, as they're the ones trashing your country. Starting with Donald J Trump. :kissy:
 

apdst

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I would like to know how the deaths of soldiers in the War On Terror, or the deaths of soldiers in Southeast Asia all those years ago contribute any way to freedom?

How have the Vietnamese, or Iraqis, or Afghanis or Libyans tried to take our freedoms away?

Terrorists took away the civil rights of 3,000 people on 9/11.
 

Deuce

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OrphanSlug

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What exactly IS the Price of Freedom?...

What IS the price of freedom? It's having to deal with all the negatives that go along with those freedoms.

Tolerance and uncertainty.

The price of freedom (or liberty) means far more than simply having to hear and see what one does not agree with. It means having to engage in tolerance for all those views and differences from all the influences into one's ideology. It impacts everything from expression to determination. The assumption is freedom can remain assuming no one uses their freedoms as a weapon against someone else's freedoms, but we know that line tends to get blurry when it comes to governance and law. What bring the uncertainty is what others will do that may or may not impact how anyone does economically and/or socially.

To be brutal, any vision for society has some set of consequences. Freedom is no different, to your point there will be negatives.

Our issue will always be the same, dealing with those who suggest there is a better view for society with less consequences. We never really know if that is factual.
 

Thoreau72

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Terrorists took away the civil rights of 3,000 people on 9/11.

Yes they did, and their elected representatives nullified the 4th Amendment by way of legislative BS called the USA Patriot Act just months later, with the help of some judiciously placed anthrax.
 
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