The Pope's condom (1 Viewer)

[shuamort]

Pope orders condoms study in Aids fight

Pope Benedict has asked senior theologians and scientists to prepare a document discussing the use of condoms as a means of preventing the transmission of HIV, a Vatican official has revealed.
The study comes only days after a contender in last year's papal elections, Cardinal Carlo Maria Martini, challenged the Roman Catholic church's official position by suggesting that condom use was the "lesser evil" in combating Aids.....

If the Pope reverse the RCC's stance on condoms, do you think this will be a slippery slope for other things to be condoned?

 

[Simon W. Moon]

Pope orders condoms study in Aids fight
If the Pope reverse the RCC's stance on condoms, do you think this will be a slippery slope for other things to be condoned?

Perhaps, but a slippery uphill slope.
The immense gravity of AIDS globally (no pun intended) weighs heavily on the consciences of folks like the Pope. The Pope should at least look into whether or not approving the use of condoms by Catholics and for distribution from Catholics can help alleviate the real suffering in many parts of the world where signifcant sections fo the population have been ravaged. The effects of so many people "missing" from the populace reach into the lives of the innocent and uninfected.

 

[jfuh]

Pope orders condoms study in Aids fight
If the Pope reverse the RCC's stance on condoms, do you think this will be a slippery slope for other things to be condoned?

Long over due. The entire backwards looking of condom usage is completely rediculous.

 

[wackestmc]

Thank God, literally.

 

[Kandahar]

Better late than never. This was John Paul II's greatest blunder.

 

[Jay R]

The Pope doesn't have much of a choice really, now does he? Unless he's really dumb. The RCC is well aware that its only significant areas of growth are in the developing world, which is being hit hardest by the AIDS problem. And that means if the Church wishes to remain as rich and powerful, maintain and develop its influence on the global stage then it needs to stop all those converts going to waste. Organised religion of the Catholic model has more in common with a global business than anything else, and the Africans and Asians are the RCC's new baby boomers.

 

[jimmyjack]

Pope orders condoms study in Aids fight
If the Pope reverse the RCC's stance on condoms, do you think this will be a slippery slope for other things to be condoned?

Condoms have not stopped the spread of AIDS, AIDS is still rife, the Pope is only looking into it, and the study will prove condoms are a joke. Just as the study into homosexuality proved it was only spreading AIDS.

 

[shuamort]

Condoms have not stopped the spread of AIDS

Correct, but they significantly slow them down.

According to the CDC, studies examining sexually active people at high risk for contracting HIV have found that “even with repeated sexual contact, 98-100% of those people who used latex condoms correctly and consistently did not become infected

AIDS is still rife, the Pope is only looking into it,

Wrong, the Pope is having a team looking into it.

and the study will prove condoms are a joke.

Which would be odd since that would be the antithesis of any other study out there. Got proof for this claim, and if so, please show peer-reviewed documented proof? (There's a question that you'll need to answer)

Just as the study into homosexuality proved it was only spreading AIDS.

That doesn't even make sense. Especially in Africa.

 

[JustineCredible]

Correct, but they significantly slow them down.

According to the CDC, studies examining sexually active people at high risk for contracting HIV have found that “even with repeated sexual contact, 98-100% of those people who used latex condoms correctly and consistently did not become infected



Wrong, the Pope is having a team looking into it.

WHAT???!! Facts and figures to go along with your wild claims!? Say it ain't so.

I'm not sure which is worse, Jimmyjack's blatent ignorance of proven fact or these wild claims that condoms slow or even prevent the progression/transmission of HIV.
:roll:

Which would be odd since that would be the antithesis of any other study out there. Got proof for this claim, and if so, please show peer-reviewed documented proof? (There's a question that you'll need to answer)

That doesn't even make sense. Especially in Africa.

"Making Sence" and "Jimmyjack" aren't the first two things I come up with for synonyms. Sorry, but the two don't go hand in hand anywere on this site. At least not that I've seen.
I'm sorry Shuamort, I'm in a cynical mood...must be the weather...

 

[jimmyjack]

Correct, but they significantly slow them down.

According to the CDC, studies examining sexually active people at high risk for contracting HIV have found that “even with repeated sexual contact, 98-100% of those people who used latex condoms correctly and consistently did not become infected.

Incorrect, only abstinence slows down the spread of AIDS.

This is well documented.

Wrong, the Pope is having a team looking into it.

Incorrect, the pope is looking into it, and he has appointed a team to gather the information and report to him on it.

The pope has the final say.

Which would be odd since that would be the antithesis of any other study out there. Got proof for this claim, and if so, please show peer-reviewed documented proof? (There's a question that you'll need to answer)

Condoms, do not stop AIDS, we have condoms in the UK, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in the USA, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in China, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in South America, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in Asia, AIDS is still spreading. Only Abstinence can stop the spread of AIDS. -FACT!

That doesn't even make sense. Especially in Africa.

Facts are facts.

There appears to be a lot of things that don’t make sense to you, most of all life itself.

 

[Pacridge]

Incorrect, only abstinence slows down the spread of AIDS.

This is well documented.



Incorrect, the pope is looking into it, and he has appointed a team to gather the information and report to him on it.

The pope has the final say.



Condoms, do not stop AIDS, we have condoms in the UK, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in the USA, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in China, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in South America, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in Asia, AIDS is still spreading. Only Abstinence can stop the spread of AIDS. -FACT!



Facts are facts.

There appears to be a lot of things that don’t make sense to you, most of all life itself.

All too often you make little or no sense. You want to ignore facts you don't seem to like while inflating evidence that does, even if ever so slightly, forward your argument. Trying to use logic in this manner while debating is worthless.

After reading through several of your post I'm left with the conclusion you're either very childish or simply not that bright. Of course there is a third option and that is you really are very bright, yet choose to play dumb enabling you to disregards facts whenever you wish. Either way, your tactics and your attempt to misrepresent evidence isn't helping you here.

Maybe you'd be happier at a site where all the members agree with your views?

 

[JustineCredible]

Incorrect, only abstinence slows down the spread of AIDS.

This is well documented.

SHOW US these so called "documents." Oh, that's right...you can't. Or won't.

Incorrect, the pope is looking into it, and he has appointed a team to gather the information and report to him on it.

The pope has the final say.

Now you're just arguing symantics. Whether he's looking into it or having a team look into it...which ever..it matters not.

Condoms, do not stop AIDS, we have condoms in the UK, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in the USA, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in China, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in South America, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in Asia, AIDS is still spreading. Only Abstinence can stop the spread of AIDS. -FACT!

"Having" condoms and using them properly and consistently are NOT the same thing. I can HAVE condoms, but if it don't USE them, they aren't going to do me much good now are they?
I can HAVE condoms and even USE them, but if they aren't used PROPERLY they still aren't going to do me a lot of good either.

So, with your plea of abstinence, I guess that means you're a virgin and have never and will never have sex...right? I mean since you can ONLY stop the spread of HIV/AIDS by not ever having sex...

Facts are facts.

Unfortunately, you've ignored all of them even when they're stairing you in the face.

There appears to be a lot of things that don’t make sense to you, most of all life itself.

POT CALLS KETTLE BLACK!!!! NEWS FLASH!!!

I believe the one who's still confused about life in general is you...I'd watch my words very carefully if I were you....

...but since I'm not....{whew}...I don't think I will!

 

[jimmyjack]

All too often you make little or no sense.

Prove it.

You want to ignore facts you don't seem to like while inflating evidence that does, even if ever so slightly, forward your argument.

Prove it.

You really are very bright,

Correct.

yet choose to play dumb enabling you to disregards facts whenever you wish.

Prove it.

Maybe you'd be happier at a site where all the members agree with your views?

Nice of you to express your opinion.

 

[JustineCredible]

Prove it.
Prove it.

Prove it.

Nice of you to express your opinion.

I guess you haven't noticed, but Pac is a member of the moderator team...challenging him is a really bad idea...but if you feel you must...we'll be putting our money on Pac!

 

[shuamort]

POT CALLS KETTLE BLACK!!!! NEWS FLASH!!!

Hey hey hey. That would make me the kettle and I'm not black. Get your idioms right! lol.

Incorrect, only abstinence slows down the spread of AIDS.

Only abstinence? Wrong.

This is well documented.

Well then, document away. Show peer-reviewed recent (as in the last two years) sources. I've requested these before.

Incorrect, the pope is looking into it, and he has appointed a team to gather the information and report to him on it.

Wrong again. Read the article.

The pope has the final say.

According to the Pope, "God" has the final say.

Condoms, do not stop AIDS, we have condoms in the UK, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in the USA, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in China, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in South America, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in Asia, AIDS is still spreading.

You're conflating again. Go ahead and prove your claim that AIDS don't slow down the spread of AIDS. Show peer-reviewed recent (as in the last two years) sources.

Only Abstinence can stop the spread of AIDS. -FACT!

Wait, above you said abstinence slows down the spread of AIDS. Now it stops it? Let me take a baseball bat and start hitting you on the head. Do you want me to slow down or stop? There would be a difference. Assumably. So which is it, jimmyjack. Does it stop like YOU SAID or does it slow down like YOU SAID. Can't have both. Go ahead and prove your claim. Show peer-reviewed recent (as in the last two years) sources.

Facts are facts.

Let us know when you find one.

There appears to be a lot of things that don’t make sense to you, most of all life itself.

A personal insult is not a way to win your debate. Tsk tsk.

 

[MSgt]

To Moderator Shuamort....

There appears to be a lot of things that don’t make sense to you, most of all life itself.

To Moderator Pacridge...

Prove it.

Prove it.

Correct.

Prove it.

Nice of you to express your opinion.

Moderator's Warning:

Negative. :smash: This will not do. You made a personal attack on a Moderator. Pacridge saw the offense and attempted to gracefully warn you to back off and that your abrasions are not expressly welcome. You then threw this back at him and thanked him for his opinion. This would be further disrespect towards a second Moderator. Against two Moderators two Moderators, you are in violation of rule number 6... 6. Moderators - Moderators are the key to the success of any board. They are expected to live up to a higher standard as such we expect you to treat them with a higher standard. Any rule broken against a moderator could result in immediate banning. Publicly disrespectful behavior from a member toward a moderator regarding moderator actions or decisions may result in a summary suspension of that member's posting privileges. I am now exercising, with less grace, my responsibilities and officially warning you to back off. You will not receive a second warning.

 

[jimmyjack]

This will not do. You made a personal attack on a Moderator. Pacridge saw the offense and attempted to gracefully warn you to back off and that your abrasions are not expressly welcome. You then threw this back at him and thanked him for his opinion. This would be further disrespect towards a second Moderator.

Against two Moderators two Moderators, you are in violation of rule number 6...

6. Moderators - Moderators are the key to the success of any board. They are expected to live up to a higher standard as such we expect you to treat them with a higher standard. Any rule broken against a moderator could result in immediate banning. Publicly disrespectful behavior from a member toward a moderator regarding moderator actions or decisions may result in a summary suspension of that member's posting privileges.

I am now exercising, with less grace, my responsibilities and officially warning you to back off. You will not receive a second warning.

There has been no offence or disrespect to any moderators; my observations are purely based on the comments that have come from the moderators themselves. Identifying a fact from an opinion is not an insult nor is it disrespectful.

 

[tecoyah]

Default Re: The Pope's condom
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacridge
All too often you make little or no sense.

Prove it.

"Condoms have not stopped the spread of AIDS, AIDS is still rife, the Pope is only looking into it, and the study will prove condoms are a joke. Just as the study into homosexuality proved it was only spreading AIDS."
Though this statement alone should be the proof needed, I will clarify the reasoning behind said proof.A joke is a humorous statement or action, which a Condom is not. Condoms have been shown to be highly effective as a barrier against most STDs including HIV, and I dont think placing the Data here will allow you to understand this, So I wont bother. HIV can indeed be transmitted thru Homosexual activities, just as through Heterosexual activities....again, the science behind this is irrefutable, and need not be wasted on someone refusing to look at it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacridge
You want to ignore facts you don't seem to like while inflating evidence that does, even if ever so slightly, forward your argument.

Prove it.
"Condoms, do not stop AIDS, we have condoms in the UK, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in the USA, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in China, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in South America, AIDS is still spreading, there are condoms in Asia, AIDS is still spreading. Only Abstinence can stop the spread of AIDS. -FACT!"
It is true Aids is spreading in all cases listed, as will any Virus with no known cure, and a way of finding more hosts. The denial of a slowdown through Condom use shows a lack of willingness to accept something obvious, that might not benefit your belief structure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacridge
You really are very bright,

Correct.
The selctive use of opposition statements out of context is a weak ploy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacridge
yet choose to play dumb enabling you to disregards facts whenever you wish.

Prove it.
Admit It

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacridge
Maybe you'd be happier at a site where all the members agree with your views?

Nice of you to express your opinion.
Likely a true statement....though it is also likely you would be quite bored after a few hours.

 

[MSgt]

There has been no offence or disrespect to any moderators; my observations are purely based on the comments that have come from the moderators themselves. Identifying a fact from an opinion is not an insult nor is it disrespectful.

There's no argument. You were blatant in your infraction. You are still here and you are still posting. Please continue to contribute.

 

[jimmyjack]

Though this statement alone should be the proof needed, I will clarify the reasoning behind said proof.A joke is a humorous statement or action, which a Condom is not.

joke (jōk)
n.
1. Something said or done to evoke laughter or amusement, especially an amusing story with a punch line.
2. A mischievous trick; a prank.
3. An amusing or ludicrous incident or situation.
4. Informal.
a. Something not to be taken seriously; a triviality: The accident was no joke.
b. An object of amusement or laughter; a laughingstock: His loud tie was the joke of the office.

I dont think placing the Data here will allow you to understand this, So I wont bother.

Typical.

HIV can indeed be transmitted thru Homosexual activities, just as through Heterosexual activities....again, the science behind this is irrefutable, and need not be wasted on someone refusing to look at it.

Have you considered the effect banning heterosexual sex would have?

It is true Aids is spreading in all cases listed, as will any Virus with no known cure, and a way of finding more hosts. The denial of a slowdown through Condom use shows a lack of willingness to accept something obvious, that might not benefit your belief structure.

The promotion of Abstinence has curbed the spread of AIDS in Africa where it has been promoted, not the use of condoms.

Source.

The selctive use of opposition statements out of context is a weak ploy.

Then don’t do it, however I disagree.

Admit It

Prove it.

Likely a true statement....though it is also likely you would be quite bored after a few hours.

There is no need to preach to the learned.

 

[shuamort]

The promotion of Abstinence has curbed the spread of AIDS in Africa where it has been promoted, not the use of condoms.

Source.

Your source doesn't prove your claim. In fact, it doesn't even show that AIDS has been curbed anywhere in Africa. lol

 

[MSgt]

Might I offer some advice here?.....

'Medussa' is South African and is local and probably has some enlightening input here.

 

[jimmyjack]

Your source doesn't prove your claim. In fact, it doesn't even show that AIDS has been curbed anywhere in Africa. lol

...The Bush Administration has supported the abstinence-only (in practice) AIDS program in Uganda, a country that has seen great success and boasts one of the lowest infection rates in Africa. Uganda's infection rate is far lower than Botswana, for example, which promotes condoms and has the world's worst HIV infection rate....

 

[shuamort]

...The Bush Administration has supported the abstinence-only (in practice) AIDS program in Uganda, a country that has seen great success and boasts one of the lowest infection rates in Africa. Uganda's infection rate is far lower than Botswana, for example, which promotes condoms and has the world's worst HIV infection rate....

Ahh, missed that. To bad it's bad logic. The abstinence only plan is from later 2004-2005 after many years of ABC (Abstinence, Be Faithful, use Condoms) was used. We should see the devastating affects as the rates increase due to this ignorant and stupid idea of abstinence only education infects a new generation.

Uganda gained a reputation in the 1990s for its high-level leadership against HIV/AIDS and acceptance of sexually candid HIV-prevention messages. But public health experts and Ugandan AIDS organizations fear that the shift toward abstinence-only programs will reverse this success. Abstinence programs have been used since 1981 in the United States, where they have proven in numerous independent studies to be ineffective and potentially harmful

 

[jimmyjack]

Ahh, missed that. To bad it's bad logic. The abstinence only plan is from later 2004-2005 after many years of ABC (Abstinence, Be Faithful, use Condoms) was used. We should see the devastating affects as the rates increase due to this ignorant and stupid idea of abstinence only education infects a new generation.

If it is spreading, they are not being abstinent, are they?