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the ORIGINAL 13th amendment

Master PO

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Redress

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i bet you didn't even look at the books that have been published, from 1818 to 1876 with the original 13th amendment in then........you just choose to make a general statement, and be on your way.
I bet you did not read the article I linked. Hint: you might want to, it addresses that. This is conspiracy nonsense.
 

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and some are the blind at they cannot see...
I did see. I did what you should have and fact checked. You still have not read the supplied source since it refutes what you want to believe.
 

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I did see. I did what you should have and fact checked. You still have not read the supplied source since it refutes what you want to believe.
tell me, does an article, ...rebuke printed books which cover a 60 year span of time, of books which cover state, private, federal government books which show the amendment.

are you saying they published the 13th amendment for 60 years, when it did not even exist?
 

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tell me, does an article, ...rebuke printed books which cover a 60 year span of time, of books which cover state, private, federal government books which show the amendment.

are you saying they published the 13th amendment for 60 years, when it did not even exist?
Maybe you should actually read the article...
 

ecofarm

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From your link:

In August 1991, an extremist small-press magazine entitled AntiShyster published a series of articles by David Dodge,(21) who claimed to have discovered that TONA in fact had been ratified and later suppressed.(22) Dodge's articles have found a ready audience in many extremist organizations,(23) and have found their way onto the Internet, where they are available from world wide web sites, along with additional commentary and information from TONA proponents.(24) Following Dodge, TONA proponents put forward an assortment of "constitutional nonsense," such as the claim that the amendment would exclude lawyers ("esquires") from public office.(25) Some even use TONA to justify "sentencing" state officials to death or murdering police officers.(26)
Let me guess, the OP thinks Obama is guilty.
 

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I bet you did not read the article I linked. Hint: you might want to, it addresses that. This is conspiracy nonsense.

your article rest its case that Virginia did not ratify the amendment.

Nevada state court superior court common law venue original and exclusive jurisdiction united States of America Nevada Republic (organic)
Nevada state court
Nevada Republic To: 1. COUNTY OF CLARK (sic) united States of 2. STATE OF NEVADA (sic) America 3. UNITED STATES (sic)
FINDINGS OF FACT
Comes now Brent Hadlon; Gundersen and hereby presents the following facts of truth to the Common Law Justices on the 18th day of October, 2004 for their consideration of truth and fact.
Facts
1. There are ongoing unlawful attempts by legislators, judges and bureaucrats to abrogate and modify our Constitution. Our freedom is under attack. Not from an armed outside enemy, but from trusted officials whom we have elected, or appointed, to watch over our Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. The no more insidious assault than an attack by trusted individuals from within the system. These people have violated their Constitutional duties.
2. “Titles of nobility" were prohibited in both Article VI of the Articles of Confederation (1777) and in Article I, Sections 9 and 10 of the Constitution for the united States (1787);
Articles of Confederation: Article VI. No State, without the consent of the United States in Congress assembled, shall send any embassy to, or receive any embassy from, or enter into any conference, agreement, alliance or treaty with any King, Prince or State; nor shall any person holding any office of profit or trust under the United States, or any of them, accept any present, emolument, office or title of any kind whatever from any King, Prince or foreign State; nor shall the United States in Congress assembled, or any of them, grant any title of nobility.
Constitution: Article I, Section 9: No Title of Nobility shall be granted by the United States: And no Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under them, shall, without the Consent of the Congress, accept of any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince, or foreign State.
Section. 10. No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.
3. Although already prohibited by the Constitution, an additional "title of nobility" amendment was proposed in 1789, and again in 1810, known as the 13th Amendment. The Founding Fathers wanted an Amendment
Παγε 1 οφ 7
Παγε 2 οφ 7
that provided a punishment for those who defied the Law. The 1810 Amendment was properly ratified by the States and thus became a part of the Constitution, and thereby the law of the land.
4. The founding fathers saw such a serious threat in "titles of nobility" and "honors" that anyone receiving them would forfeit their citizenship, and never again be able to hold any office in either the federal or State government. Since the government prohibited them several times over four decades, and went through the amending process (even though "titles of nobility" were already prohibited by the Constitution), the Amendment carries much more significance for our Founding Fathers than is readily apparent today.
5. In an attempt to unlawfully change the Constitution, the predecessors of the above listed individuals quietly removed a valid Amendment to the Constitution for the united States of America. Their actions were timed to coincide with the tumult and confusion of the War of 1812, when the Capital Building and many of the original records were destroyed by the British. The removal was completed following the Civil War. This Amendment, the 13th, was properly ratified in 1812. It has never been reversed, and so, it is still the law of the land, Today. The 13th Amendment bars all individuals who claim a title of nobility from holding any office of honor or trust.
"If any citizen of the United States shall accept, claim, receive, or retain any title of nobility or honour, or shall without the consent of Congress, accept and retain any present, pension, office, or emolument of any kind whatever, from any emperor, king, prince, or foreign power, such person shall cease to be a citizen of the united States, and shall be incapable of holding any office of trust or profit under them, or either of them." The true 13th Amendment to the Constitution for the united states of America
6. When the Proposed Amendment was passed by the Congress there were 17 States. Ratification requires ¾ of the then existing States accept the Amendment. Thirteen States were required to Ratify the Amendment.

The order of ratification is:
December 25, 1810: Maryland ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 1st state. January 31, 1811: Kentucky ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 2nd state. January 31, 1811: Ohio unanimously ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 3rd state. February 2, 1811: Delaware ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 4th state. February 6, 1811 Pennsylvania ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 5th state. February 13,1811: New Jersey ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 6th state. October 24, 1811: Vermont ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 7th state. November 21, 1811: Tennessee ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 8th state. November 22, 1811: Georgia ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 9th state. December 23, 1811: North Carolina ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 10th state. February 27, 1812: Massachusetts ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 11th state. March 12, 1812: New York fails ratification of the 13th Amendment. April 30, 1812: Louisiana becomes the 18th state in the Union, but is not consulted on the pending constitutional amendment. June 12, 1812: The War of 1812 begins. June 12, 1812: Governor Plumer of New Hampshire send letter to New Hampshire Legislature accompanied by letters from the Chief Executive Officers of Georgia, North Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, and Vermont indicating ratification of the 13th Amendment by their State. Virginia thus is shown to be the 12th State to ratify the Amendment. December 9, 1812: New Hampshire ratifies the 13th Amendment, the 13th of the 13 states required.
 

Trip

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Well, yes and no.

The intent of prohibiting titles of nobility was to prohibit the creation of a class of cf citizenry with privileges or authority above those of other citizens.

While we managed to keep the "titles" themselves out, we have still managed to recreate those privileged persons expecting of special treatment, in violation to the intent of the Constitution.

For instance, under the Constitution, Congress is only supposed to be immune from law and arrest, while actually coming and going for an actual vote, but now Congress has established itself immune from a whole range of laws, from insider trading, to health care, and much more.

We've also created various "special' classes of citizens, recreating the Orwellian rule "All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others." We do this with racial quotas, affirmative action, hate crimes, and more. Most recently we do this by fabricating new collective rights, and distorting the terms of the Constitution and the very definition of "rights" themselves, to result in equal outcome under different terms, essentially subjective and unsupportable social engineering by government dictate, something entirely in conflict with the Constitution.

Contrary to your article's reference, the concern was not just the "titles" themselves, but benefit derived from and claimed by those titles. Contemporary social engineers have managed to bypass the the specific titles, of nobility, and raising race and class distinctions to false nobility status, with this process itself not only being very corrupt, but it corrupting the equal application of the rule of law.
 

Trip

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Incidentally it should be recognized that the term "entitlement" originates from those very "titles of nobility".
 
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