The Lancet states, based on mortality figures, says that COVID killed many more than projected

[Peter King]

Findings​

Although reported COVID-19 deaths between Jan 1, 2020, and Dec 31, 2021, totalled 5·94 million worldwide, we estimate that 18·2 million (95% uncertainty interval 17·1–19·6) people died worldwide because of the COVID-19 pandemic (as measured by excess mortality) over that period.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)02796-3/fulltext

So the study by the Lancet says that over 18 million people died of covid, more than 3 times the reported deaths. This due to vast under reporting of covid related deaths. This is the difference between the reported deaths and the over-rate of deaths reported during the same time.

Not every death gets reported under the "covid" deaths, but were still due to covid. At least that is what the Lancet is reporting.

 

[tacomancer]

... and nobody was surprised by this ...

 

[bluesmoke]

If the CDC and WHO does their job, the final COVID death figure will be calculated with consideration given to some number of excess death and other factors. They've probably been working on a methodology and already have some figures.

 

[BirdinHand]

So, some countries REALLY lied about their numbers?

You don’t say.

Shocking.

 

[Gateman_Wen]

So, some countries REALLY lied about their numbers?

You don’t say.

Shocking.

India seems to have underreported by a factor of 10 or more.

 

[BirdinHand]

India seems to have underreported by a factor of 10 or more.

Nothing about that is in the least surprising.

 

[RealityNow]

It's not likely that any accurate global data will be presented for some time....COVID is still here and in some locations around the World, people are seeing more cases and no one knows what may be the next variant to morph into existence.

What next will "people who enjoy being aggreived about something"pursue to feed the need to feel "aggreived"?

 

[tacomancer]

So, some countries REALLY lied about their numbers?

You don’t say.

Shocking.

In a lot of cases, excess death calculations can only be done 6 months or more after whatever event. Its not a matter of lying, but needing all the info for the statisticians to do their thing to find where existing surveillance was inadequate in a "fog of war" (or in this case "fog of disease") type situation.

The US is also tracking this, but the numbers are in many cases, still preliminary.

Excess Deaths Associated with COVID-19

Figures present excess deaths associated with COVID-19 at the national and state levels.

www.cdc.gov

In other countries, there is also a factor in that they are just not that good at this tracking their population. Personally, I wouldn't expect a government to lie unless it was more of an authoritarian or nationalistic bent.

 

[RealityNow]

China locks down a city of 9 million amid a new spike in COVID-19 cases​

---------------------
COVID is not over

 

[BirdinHand]

In a lot of cases, excess death calculations can only be done 6 months or more after whatever event. Its not a matter of lying, but needing all the info for the statisticians to do their thing to find where existing surveillance was inadequate in a "fog of war" (or in this case "fog of disease") type situation.

The US is also tracking this, but the numbers are in many cases, still preliminary.

Excess Deaths Associated with COVID-19

Figures present excess deaths associated with COVID-19 at the national and state levels.

www.cdc.gov

In other countries, there is also a factor in that they are just not that good at this tracking their population. Personally, I wouldn't expect a government to lie unless it was more of an authoritarian or nationalistic bent.

I agree.

I don't think, for example, that India would be purposefully be underreporting their numbers....more so that they just do NOT have a handle on the numbers.

China? On the other hand? Purposefully underreporting.

 

[CaughtInThe]

there is a poster here that everyone knows (who has been the most wrong about COVID) who said the most important stat (or something like that) was excess mortality.

i'm gonna go find his posts and link to them here.

 

[tacomancer]

I agree.

I don't think, for example, that India would be purposefully be underreporting their numbers....more so that they just do NOT have a handle on the numbers.

China? On the other hand? Purposefully underreporting.

With a guy like Modi in charge of India, I can absolutely see that they would be lying about their numbers. Their current government is not exactly highly ethical.

 

[CaughtInThe]

here is one of the posts about excess deaths by the person here who considers himself a COVID expert. there are a ton more. bold mine...



"We still don't know. I have done some checking and I am finding some states showing lower death levels than is shown on the worldometer. There is some funny bidness goin' on. The CDC appears to be nothing more than an agency that collects stats and lag on that, probably because they are busy watching porn. I dunno and I dunno what else it is they do other than stuff like saying not to drink hydroxycholoroquine. I believe my 75,000 EXCESS deaths still to be extremely close to actual.

OTHER THAN the CDC do you have any charts, maybe from individual states that show how many people died over the past 5 years or so versus how many in 2020? I don't think the individual states have any reason to cheat or fudge on such stats."

Tulsa sees Covid-19 surge in the wake of Trump's June rally

No one wants to be president and a billionaire. Okeeeeyyyy! Vindman did, Strozk did, Weissmann did, Cuomo did. Obama tried and failed at everything except dividing America between racial lines. No one wants to be a pudgy old man with a bad hair transplant.

debatepolitics.com

 

[CaughtInThe]

here's a "great" post...


"As I said to another poster, they ARE overstated because they are including deaths WITH Covid instead of BY Covid. Only way to get some semblance of the truth is to use EXCESS deaths.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30933-8/fulltext
"

Additional Deaths That Trump Has Engendered in the Virus Pandemic

I said what I had to say. I have nothing new to add. Take what you will of it. I don't like to repeat myself. That’s fine, there really wasn’t any debate after your first reply, not that I expected much. I do hope you think twice before posting any other nonsense though. I was kind in this...

debatepolitics.com

 

[Lovebug]

Don't forget those who suffer (long term) effects. Our beloved weather man has been under the weather for some time

Moe Shamell shares story of his medical emergency, talks next steps - WBBJ TV

JACKSON, Tenn. -- In January, our very own meteorologist Moe Shamell thought he had what was a sinus infection until testing positive for COVID-19.

www.wbbjtv.com

 

[CaughtInThe]

here's another "great" post...


"Twenty EIGHT states with no excess Covid deaths. Eat that."

Liberals....As we said....your tribal leaders have been lying to you

WEAR YOUR MASKS!! KEEP 6 FEET AWAY!! IF YOU DON'T YOU WILL INFECT SOMEONE OR BE INFECTED!!! Well, folks. It was all a lie, I knew it. The conservatives here knew and we all told you it was hogwash and to STOP listening to the unelected bureaucrats that shut down the economy and cost millions...

debatepolitics.com

 

[CaughtInThe]

this is classic...

"So, all we have to do is take an average of how many people WOULD have died. This may seem callous but as they say "Ball don't lie" means "Math don't lie". Somehow we need to get the TOTAL people who died in every city and this should be doable. From that, we subtract what would be expected and the result is the deaths from Corona Virus."

Latest Covid Trend Charts Confirm - No Worse than Really Bad Flu Season

Zomg... How did you get this so ridiculously backwards? Social distancing keeps the number of cases low enough at a given time to make sure that everyone who needs treatment can get treatment. Even if it doesn't work perfectly, it significantly reduces the damage. Without social distancing...

debatepolitics.com

 

[bluesmoke]

So, some countries REALLY lied about their numbers?

You don’t say.

Shocking.

If the deaths were reported but in a non-COVID category bearing similarities, like influenza and/or pneumonia, that could be their excuse and thus arguably not lying. Also, so shocking. I'm aghast. Gabberflasted. There are no words...

 

[Chomsky]

So, some countries REALLY lied about their numbers?

You don’t say.

Shocking.

Why such a hyperbolic retort, implying nefarious intent?

There's the real possibility India, under the conditions they endured, with the infrastructure they possessed, did not have the ability to do accurate data-logging. In fact, many Indians never even made it inside a clinic; their systems were completely over-run.

I highly suspect there was no accurate data gathered in many third-world countries, for the reasons I listed above.

 

[Chomsky]

If the deaths were reported but in a non-COVID category bearing similarities, like influenza and/or pneumonia, that could be their excuse and thus arguably not lying. Also, so shocking. I'm aghast. Gabberflasted. There are no words... & report

The above supposes that Indian had the infrastructure in place to treat, test, catalog, and data-log & report all those that died.

I'm not sure India & other third-world countries had the ability to do that with their current infrastructures under the conditions occurring at the pandemic peaks. They couldn't even treat nor test a great many, nor get them into a clinic or get medical help to them.

 

[Peter King]

The above supposes that Indian had the infrastructure in place to treat, test, catalog, and data-log & report all those that died.

I'm not sure India & other third-world countries had the ability to do that with their current infrastructures under the conditions occurring at the pandemic peaks. They couldn't even treat nor test a great many, nor get them into a clinic or get medical help to them.

They almost do not test but have high covid deaths, that is always suspicious IMO.

France for example reported 18.5 thousand new infections and 185 deaths.

Germany has 132 deaths but almost 99 thousand new cases. From what the figures have been that sounds like a logical relation between deaths and infections. France's figures makes just no sense.

Italy the same illogical and untrustworthy new infection figures. They report just shy of 30,000 but 129 deaths.

The most surprising country IMO is South Korea, for month after month after month they had few or no infections (notoriously obedient people the South Koreans, even to the government) but now the wheels have come off their covid measures because since the end of January their covid figures have BALLOONED to massive figures.

The past few days they have been up to 350,000 new infections or more. In the month before it came up to 200,000 and the number of deaths has also grown around 200 deaths a day has become the new normal in South Korea. Where in December 2020 all of us had high figures South Korea just had a few dozen deaths a day at most.

 

[Chomsky]

They almost do not test but have high covid deaths, that is always suspicious IMO.

France for example reported 18.5 thousand new infections and 185 deaths.

Germany has 132 deaths but almost 99 thousand new cases. From what the figures have been that sounds like a logical relation between deaths and infections. France's figures makes just no sense.

Italy the same illogical and untrustworthy new infection figures. They report just shy of 30,000 but 129 deaths.

The most surprising country IMO is South Korea, for month after month after month they had few or no infections (notoriously obedient people the South Koreans, even to the government) but now the wheels have come off their covid measures because since the end of January their covid figures have BALLOONED to massive figures.

The past few days they have been up to 350,000 new infections or more. In the month before it came up to 200,000 and the number of deaths has also grown around 200 deaths a day has become the new normal in South Korea. Where in December 2020 all of us had high figures South Korea just had a few dozen deaths a day at most.

Hm. I was not aware of the bolded, and am indeed surprised. With the recent sharp rise & subsequent shutdown in China, I'm wondering if we've got a new variant on the loose in that section of the world? Perhaps the new Omicron varieties we're hearing of?

 

[Peter King]

Hm. I was not aware of the bolded, and am indeed surprised. With the recent sharp rise & subsequent shutdown in China, I'm wondering if we've got a new variant on the loose in that section of the world? Perhaps the new Omicron varieties we're hearing of?

It could be, it is indeed puzzling. Japan also still has over 52 thousand infections and 125 deaths today.

 

[BirdinHand]

Why such a hyperbolic retort, implying nefarious intent?

There's the real possibility India, under the conditions they endured, with the infrastructure they possessed, did not have the ability to do accurate data-logging. In fact, many Indians never even made it inside a clinic; their systems were completely over-run.

I highly suspect there was no accurate data gathered in many third-world countries, for the reasons I listed above.

Oh, I’m sure countries like India made honest mistakes.

I don’t believe the numbers from China though. They seem absurdly low.

 

[bluesmoke]

The above supposes that Indian had the infrastructure in place to treat, test, catalog, and data-log & report all those that died.

I'm not sure India & other third-world countries had the ability to do that with their current infrastructures under the conditions occurring at the pandemic peaks. They couldn't even treat nor test a great many, nor get them into a clinic or get medical help to them.

They obviously were able to categorize, though wrongly, because their considerable increase in excess deaths noted in the Lancet report as likely being COVID, though categorized elsewhere. The point of my post is supported by the evidence.