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The Iraq war successful

mikhail

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The Iraq war is a success The coalition of the willing removed a totalitarian dictator and replaced him with a democracy with a consitution.I know alot of people will disagree but sorry Iraq is a democracy by any kind of general standards.

This all came at a terrible price of those who did truely die for freedom. They should always be remembered.

I know this isnt gonna go down well with those who where in favour of keeping saddam hussein in charge but im pretty sure you will live long enough to doubt yourselves.

Which for me sums up alot of the left they are the first people to stand up bravely and demand Don Imus is fired but when it comes to a middle east Hitler a proven ethnic cleanser you would rather he stay in charge.
 
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USA_1

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The Iraq war is a success The coalition of the willing removed a totalitarian dictator and replaced him with a democracy with a consitution.I know alot of people will disagree but sorry Iraq is a democracy by any kind of general standards.

This all came at a terrible price of those who did truely die for freedom. They should always be remembered.

I know this isnt gonna go down well with those who where in favour of keeping saddam hussein in charge but im pretty sure you will live long enough to doubt yourselves.

Which for me sums up alot of the left they are the first people to stand up bravely and demand Don Imus is fired but when it comes to a middle east Hitler a proven ethnic cleanser you would rather he stay in charge.
You must be kidding. Iraq was a costly disaster. We replaced one corrupt government with another corrupt faux government.
 

mikhail

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Well Saddam Huseins "government" wasnt a government at all more like a mafia.Iraq now has a democracy.Im sorry but you seem rather uninformed when you seem to refer the Ba'ath party as merely corrupt.
 

USA_1

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Well Saddam Huseins "government" wasnt a government at all more like a mafia.Iraq now has a democracy.Im sorry but you seem rather uninformed when you seem to refer the Ba'ath party as merely corrupt.
The government that finally takes control of Iraq will be just as bad as the Ba'ath party. The US presence was the only reason total civil war hasn't already engulfed Iraq. Now that we are leaving you will see just how long your "democracy" will last.
 

mikhail

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The government that finally takes control of Iraq will be just as bad as the Ba'ath party. The US presence was the only reason total civil war hasn't already engulfed Iraq. Now that we are leaving you will see just how long your "democracy" will last.
You sound like your almost hoping that will happen.
 

rathi

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Right now, Iraq is South Vietnam in 1973. To claim victory would be quite premature. Exactly what path the Iraqi government takes is very much up on the in air. The primary reason I hate counter insurgency situations so much is because ultimately it all rests on what locals want. The military battle is over, and all we can do is hope that the political situation works out in our favor.
 

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The government that finally takes control of Iraq will be just as bad as the Ba'ath party. The US presence was the only reason total civil war hasn't already engulfed Iraq. Now that we are leaving you will see just how long your "democracy" will last.
so just to be sure, you are predicting that a civil war will break out as american forces leave?

what were you predicting about the surge in early 2008, again?
 

USA_1

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so just to be sure, you are predicting that a civil war will break out as american forces leave?

what were you predicting about the surge in early 2008, again?
I knew the surge would accomplish exactly what it did. I was 100% correct on my prediction. Now lasting peace and a stable Iraq? Not gonna happen.
My prediction. There will be a major power play. The real threats that have been patient, quiet and waiting for us to leave will make their move. The ones smart enough to know that they can not win over the US military.

When chaos does breaks out again should we go back in with another surge?

http://mwcnews.net/focus/editorial/4809-victory-in-iraq.html

Nevertheless, they certainly want to convince the American people that their nation has won a war in Iraq. If you walk down the street of your home town and ask people what winning in Iraq means here is some of the things you might hear:

1. We successfully got rid of Saddam Hussein and his dictatorship
2. We defeated the regular Iraqi army that was fielded against our forces
3. We have successfully brought democracy to Iraq
4. We prevented Saddam Hussein from developing and using weapons of mass destruction
5. We destroyed Al Qaeda’s ability to use Iraq as a stage for terrorist attacks against the U.S.

Numbers 1 and 2 are true and constitute the classical definitions of "winning" a war. If anyone had pushed John McCain to define his terms he may well have fallen back on these traditional criteria for success. Number 3 is highly questionable. After our invasion, we configured elections for Iraq which were then held in the midst of a civil war. It is now apparent that the Iraqi people are so divided, both ethnically and in terms of religious sects, that the electoral process has only led to stalemate.

The most recent elections (March 2010) have not produced a conclusive winner and the various Iraqi parties have not been able to negotiate a stable coalition government. The resulting political vacuum has once more opened the door to civil war, and terrorist attacks on civilian targets are on the increase. Numbers 4 and 5 are false and always have been. They are two major variants on the lies fed to the American Congress and people by the administration of George W. Bush.
 
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USA_1

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You sound like your almost hoping that will happen.
No, I would love to see Iraq become a peaceful democratic nation but hoping ain't gonna fix it. We have let the worms out of the can and it's inevitable that Iraq will implode. The three warring factions are still there.
I am a realist.
Just because you want something to happen will not make it come true. Iraq was a no win situation from day one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w75ctsv2oPU

Cheney was absolutely right on in 1994 before he got Alzheimer's.
 
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tacomancer

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The Iraq war is a success The coalition of the willing removed a totalitarian dictator and replaced him with a democracy with a consitution.I know alot of people will disagree but sorry Iraq is a democracy by any kind of general standards.

This all came at a terrible price of those who did truely die for freedom. They should always be remembered.

I know this isnt gonna go down well with those who where in favour of keeping saddam hussein in charge but im pretty sure you will live long enough to doubt yourselves.

Which for me sums up alot of the left they are the first people to stand up bravely and demand Don Imus is fired but when it comes to a middle east Hitler a proven ethnic cleanser you would rather he stay in charge.
Lets hope it is a success and those guys don't fall right into barbarism as soon as we leave.
 

USA_1

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Lets hope it is a success and those guys don't fall right into barbarism as soon as we leave.
Not to worry.
It will take several years, maybe even a decade or so.
 

VanceMack

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The Iraq war is a success The coalition of the willing removed a totalitarian dictator and replaced him with a democracy with a consitution.I know alot of people will disagree but sorry Iraq is a democracy by any kind of general standards.

This all came at a terrible price of those who did truely die for freedom. They should always be remembered.

I know this isnt gonna go down well with those who where in favour of keeping saddam hussein in charge but im pretty sure you will live long enough to doubt yourselves.

Which for me sums up alot of the left they are the first people to stand up bravely and demand Don Imus is fired but when it comes to a middle east Hitler a proven ethnic cleanser you would rather he stay in charge.
The Iraq war was HUGELY successful. It was an unmittigated military victory. it ended in 2003. The aftermath...the peace effort...not handled very well at all. But we have given the Iraqi people a break from a murderous brutal dictator...if they choose peace and democracy...good for them. If not...well...thats truly on their shoulders.
 

USA_1

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The Iraq war was HUGELY successful. It was an unmittigated military victory. it ended in 2003. The aftermath...the peace effort...not handled very well at all. But we have given the Iraqi people a break from a murderous brutal dictator...if they choose peace and democracy...good for them. If not...well...thats truly on their shoulders.
How many Iraqis have been killed since the war ended? More or less than Saddam killed?
 

VanceMack

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How many Iraqis have been killed since the war ended? More or less than Saddam killed?
Depends on which group and their numbers that suit your personal bias you choose, now doesnt it. And killed by who? And how many WERE be killed by Saddam directly...villages gassed...villages slaughtered because of one or two people speaking out against him...how many starved or died because of his using the oil for food and medicine programs to build palaces? And how many were killed by muslim terrorists? Oh...and I guess you MISSED the part where I STATED the after war effort was dismal...

God I LOVE moronic ****ing mindless liberal ideologues...they do make the world SUCH a better place...
 

USA_1

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Depends on which group and their numbers that suit your personal bias you choose, now doesnt it. And killed by who? And how many WERE be killed by Saddam directly...villages gassed...villages slaughtered because of one or two people speaking out against him...how many starved or died because of his using the oil for food and medicine programs to build palaces? And how many were killed by muslim terrorists? Oh...and I guess you MISSED the part where I STATED the after war effort was dismal...

God I LOVE moronic ****ing mindless liberal ideologues...they do make the world SUCH a better place...
So you don't know if the conflict, which to every rational person includes the aftermath (the war was not over when Bush proclaimed mission accomplished) caused more Iraqi sufferring than Saddam? Were the Iraqis killed after we invaded any better off than the ones Saddam killed? Iraq war a success? To them?
Liberal idealogue? Give me a break. Real conservatives know the Iraqi war was unwinnable and a huge mistake. All your cheerleading will not change that.
I hate moronic faux conservatives that mindlessly follow the party line.
I am an independent with libertarian leanings. Calling me liberal shows your ignorance.
 
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VanceMack

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So you don't know if the conflict, which to every rational person includes the aftermath (the war was not over when Bush proclaimed mission accomplished) caused more Iraqi sufferring than Saddam? Were the Iraqis killed after we invaded any better off than the ones Saddam killed? Iraq war a success? To them?
Liberal idealogue? Give me a break. Real conservatives know the Iraqi war was unwinnable and a huge mistake. All your cheerleading will not change that.
I hate moronic faux conservatives that mindlessly follow the party line.
I am an independent with libertarian leanings. Calling me liberal shows your ignorance.
Where did I midlessly cheerlead ANYTHING? Do I agree that Saddam needed to be removed? Yes...I agree with Bill Clinton and every other democrat. Did I STATE TWICE NOW that they did a lousy job of the aftermath? Of maintaining peace? Yes...three times now. Will that MATTER to you? No...because there ARE none so blidnly as those that truly WILL NOT see.

Do I think Iraq is BETTER? We'll see, wont we.
 

VanceMack

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So you don't know if the conflict, which to every rational person includes the aftermath (the war was not over when Bush proclaimed mission accomplished) caused more Iraqi sufferring than Saddam? Were the Iraqis killed after we invaded any better off than the ones Saddam killed? Iraq war a success? To them?
Liberal idealogue? Give me a break. Real conservatives know the Iraqi war was unwinnable and a huge mistake. All your cheerleading will not change that.
I hate moronic faux conservatives that mindlessly follow the party line.
I am an independent with libertarian leanings. Calling me liberal shows your ignorance.
Im sorry...THAT is funny as hell!!!

:lamo:lamo
 

USA_1

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Im sorry...THAT is funny as hell!!!

:lamo:lamo
Sorry to burst your bubble but everyone that disagrees with you is not a liberal. I have voted republican as much as democrat and have voted independant and liberatarian. I probably have more conservative views than you. Libertarians and many conservatives realize Iraq was a mistake. Claiming it was a success may make you feel better, but it isn't reality.
You really are embarrassing yourself more and more with every idiotic comment.
 

USA_1

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Where did I midlessly cheerlead ANYTHING? Do I agree that Saddam needed to be removed? Yes...I agree with Bill Clinton and every other democrat. Did I STATE TWICE NOW that they did a lousy job of the aftermath? Of maintaining peace? Yes...three times now. Will that MATTER to you? No...because there ARE none so blidnly as those that truly WILL NOT see.

Do I think Iraq is BETTER? We'll see, wont we.
I guess what you don't realize is that the war in Iraq is not over. All the players are still in place and no one really knows whose side the Iraqi army is on.
So you don't know if Iraq is better or not? Gee, after spending a trillion dollars and losing thousands of American lives you don't know? And you still call it a success?
 

VanceMack

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I guess what you don't realize is that the war in Iraq is not over. All the players are still in place and no one really knows whose side the Iraqi army is on.
So you don't know if Iraq is better or not? Gee, after spending a trillion dollars and losing thousands of American lives you don't know? And you still call it a success?
The war in Iraq ended in a military victory in 2003. We ousted the Hussein military and government. Perhaps you missed it. Following the war we remained in Iraq (as we did in Germany and Japan). There were countless missteps beginning with a failure to fully engage the Iraqi people from day one.

That makes 5 times now I have stated the message very clearly. War against an enemy ends when the enemy is defeated. We went to war against the Iraqi government. That ended a long time ago. Google it.
 

USA_1

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The war in Iraq ended in a military victory in 2003. We ousted the Hussein military and government. Perhaps you missed it. Following the war we remained in Iraq (as we did in Germany and Japan). There were countless missteps beginning with a failure to fully engage the Iraqi people from day one.

That makes 5 times now I have stated the message very clearly. War against an enemy ends when the enemy is defeated. We went to war against the Iraqi government. That ended a long time ago. Google it.
Man, that Bush propaganda campaign really worked great on you. You actually believe the enemy was defeated in '03? You are really naive, aren't you? Now you're even comparing Iraq to Japan and Germany. You really were brainwashed, weren't you?

http://zfacts.com/p/Iraq-war-casualties.html

 
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VanceMack

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Man, that Bush propaganda campaign really worked great on you. You actually believe the enemy was defeated in '03? You are really naive, aren't you? Now you're even comparing Iraq to Japan and Germany. You really were brainwashed, weren't you?

Iraq War Coalition Casualties

Hey genius...who were we fighting post 2003? Certainly not the Iraqi people. Certainly not the Iraqi government. CERTAINLY not the Iraqi military who we were training with. So...who were we at war with?

The WAR was over. Where we failed miserably was in the follow up action.
 

USA_1

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Hey genius...who were we fighting post 2003? Certainly not the Iraqi people. Certainly not the Iraqi government. CERTAINLY not the Iraqi military who we were training with. So...who were we at war with?

The WAR was over. Where we failed miserably was in the follow up action.
You're kidding right? The war had just begun when Bush told gullible people like you it was over. Most of US casualties after Bush's "Mission accomplished" speech were killed by Iraqis. Saddam loyalists, Ba'ath party members, some Iraq military and Iraqis aligning themselves with Iran and Al Qaeda.
A war isn't over until the fighting stops. Not when someone tells you it's over.
 
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VanceMack

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You're kidding right? The war had just begun when Bush told gullible people like you it was over. Most of US casualties after Bush's "Mission accomplished" speech were killed by Iraqis. Saddam loyalists, Ba'ath party members, some Iraq military and Iraqis aligning themselves with Iran and Al Qaeda.
A war isn't over until the fighting stops. Not when someone tells you it's over.
War has an opponent. Our opponent was the Iraqi military and their government. They were defeated in 2003. BECAUSE they did such a lousy job following the war we ended up in prolonged fighting against terrorists. Just like we did following WW2 (you would probably be SHOCKED to know Hitler loyalists were still killing people 15 years later...did that mean we were still 'at war' with Germany? Are we still "at war" With Afghanistan? Of COURSE not. The Taliban were ousted and we were in a period of relative peace for several years...right up until we turned the process over to the UN. Then the terror attacks started again in earnest. So we are there again...in full force...fighting the Taliban. But are we 'at war' with AFghanistan? With their givernment? Their people? Of course not.
 

USA_1

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War has an opponent. Our opponent was the Iraqi military and their government. They were defeated in 2003. BECAUSE they did such a lousy job following the war we ended up in prolonged fighting against terrorists. Just like we did following WW2 (you would probably be SHOCKED to know Hitler loyalists were still killing people 15 years later...did that mean we were still 'at war' with Germany? Are we still "at war" With Afghanistan? Of COURSE not. The Taliban were ousted and we were in a period of relative peace for several years...right up until we turned the process over to the UN. Then the terror attacks started again in earnest. So we are there again...in full force...fighting the Taliban. But are we 'at war' with AFghanistan? With their givernment? Their people? Of course not.
You are totally clueless. Most US forces in Iraq were killed by Iraqis not by Al Qaeda. You can call them terrorists or whatever you want, but they were Iraqis. It doesn't matter that their leader was thrown out and the organized military were destroyed. Iraqis kept fighting. They still are.
Is the war in Afghanistan over, too?
 
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