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The GQP is surrendering to trump.

bongsaway said:
Not so fast. Trump lost his bid for a second term because of trump and his mouth. The gop lost the 2018 midterm because of trump. Then they lost the white house because of trump and then the senate because of trump and his mouth. He lost at the height of his popularity in the gop, what makes you think his kind of hatred will win the next election? All america has to do is get out and vote out these traitors.
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Yep.
 
gbg3 said:
As a conservative, I'll answer. Joe Biden is the president. As far as who "won" fair and square, I've no idea. Too many irregularities and affidavits were never investigated. I don't know which man "won".
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gbg3 said:
No, this is not the either/or you presented. I just presented a 3rd option. I couldn't possibly admit Biden won fair and square because I have no way of knowing if that is true. There were volumes of affidavits and questions which were never investigated or answered. I think it delusional for anyone to think they know who won the 2020 election fair and square. Fraud doors were swung all the way open and then volumes of questions, concerns, and affidavits went unresolved.
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gbg3 said:
Nobody knows.
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Those are dodges. Biden either is or is not the legitimate President.

If you cannnot figure out a simple fact, you need to step aside and let the adults figure it out for you. :)
 
Ginger Ale said:
Under your premise, Trump couldn't have won fair and square either. Every presidential win would be questionable.
That's the problem with the delusion.
There is no proof that this was different than any other election. The only difference is Trump and his fanboys denying the win. The only truths are the "questions, and concerns" Trump feed his base and demanded they have or else.

It looks ridiculous, and now the GOP is demanding you all get in a duck line and follow the idea or else you'll be ousted. It looks like a dang cult.
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I certainly think there is no shortage whatsoever - of each side thinking the other looks like a dang cult with the decisions, narratives, and actions happening in 2021! Divisiveness just grows and grows.
 
SheWolf said:
I plan to retire outside of the United States. I constantly tell myself that in order to keep myself sane. I currently have a good job. If it wasn't for that, I would probably look into moving out now. I know a few other people planning the same way. I will not give up my citizenship, and I will not stop voting in the elections. I am not giving up as an America, but I feel I need to diversify my options in case of a failed democracy.
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The U.S. is not a democracy. :rolleyes:
It's a republic.
 
Phys251 said:
Those are dodges. Biden either is or is not the legitimate President.

If you cannnot figure out a simple fact, you need to step aside and let the adults figure it out for you. :)
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This is precisely the way I've felt about this election since the day after it occurred. Once we started to see actual video of press and legal observers being cleared out and then boxes of ballots being wheeled out from under the only covered table in the room, descriptions from a driver bringing in a trailer full of ballots from another state, and so much more - there were important and serious questions to be answered and most never were.
As far as the who is the current president, that's Joe Biden. And, unlike the childish behavior demonstrated by the group you find to be "adults" - "he's not my president", fake impeachments and Dem planted investigations, Biden is my president too since I am a citizen of the U.S. and he is indeed POTUS.
 
gbg3 said:
This is precisely the way I've felt about this election since the day after it occurred. Once we started to see actual video of press and legal observers being cleared out and then boxes of ballots being wheeled out from under the only covered table in the room, descriptions from a driver bringing in a trailer full of ballots from another state, and so much more - there were important and serious questions to be answered and most never were.
As far as the who is the current president, that's Joe Biden. And, unlike the childish behavior demonstrated by the group you find to be "adults" - "he's not my president", fake impeachments and Dem planted investigations, Biden is my president too since I am a citizen of the U.S. and he is indeed POTUS.
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You did not answer the question. You are rightfully stating that Biden was officially elected, but was he legally elected? That is a Yes/No question with no middle ground. :)
 
gbg3 said:
This is precisely the way I've felt about this election since the day after it occurred. Once we started to see actual video of press and legal observers being cleared out and then boxes of ballots being wheeled out from under the only covered table in the room, descriptions from a driver bringing in a trailer full of ballots from another state, and so much more - there were important and serious questions to be answered and most never were.
As far as the who is the current president, that's Joe Biden. And, unlike the childish behavior demonstrated by the group you find to be "adults" - "he's not my president", fake impeachments and Dem planted investigations, Biden is my president too since I am a citizen of the U.S. and he is indeed POTUS.
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So Democrats are childish.....not the millions of idiot Republican voters who believe the election was stolen from Trump and who support what those traitors did on Jan 6.

Of course.
 
Ginger Ale said:
Under your premise, Trump couldn't have won fair and square either. Every presidential win would be questionable.
That's the problem with the delusion.
There is no proof that this was different than any other election. The only difference is Trump and his fanboys denying the win. The only truths are the "questions, and concerns" Trump feed his base and demanded they have or else.

It looks ridiculous, and now the GOP is demanding you all get in a duck line and follow the idea or else you'll be ousted. It looks like a dang cult.
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With the procedures we had in place in 2020, I think every presidential win would be highly questionable. Hopefully, that will get fixed and procedures will be changed to tighten up fraud weaknesses, which were as wide open as possible in 2020.
 
gbg3 said:
With the procedures we had in place in 2020, I think every presidential win would be highly questionable. Hopefully, that will get fixed and procedures will be changed to tighten up fraud weaknesses, which were as wide open as possible in 2020.
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Yet Trump and his stooge lawyers could not produce any evidence of voter fraud, despite over 50 appearances in court.

Go figure.
 
Phys251 said:
You did not answer the question. You are rightfully stating that Biden was officially elected, but was he legally elected? That is a Yes/No question with no middle ground. :)
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Then, you are free to give it the Yes/No you think is warranted.
I don't think the procedures used in the 2020 came even close to allowing for anyone to know who legitimately won. In fact, with the mess that election was and the potential fraud opportunities which existed, I don't know if it would be possible to ever determine a "fair" winner of 2020.
I certainly answered but you simply don't like my answer and are trying to force your answer on everyone else. I'm not the least bit interested in agreeing with something I don't agree with. I also don't care that you don't agree with me. That's fine.
 
Destroy Trumpism said:
So Republicans have a right to pass new voter suppression laws? I see.
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States most definitely have the right and the responsibility to determine voter laws! We could go back to the new GA law since it received so much press and most likely know the most about it - and we could compare it to the laws in other states. Good luck with your suppression narrative.
 
gbg3 said:
States most definitely have the right and the responsibility to determine voter laws! We could go bacRk to the new GA law since it received so much press and most likely know the most about it - and we could compare it to the laws in other states. Good luck with your suppression narrative.
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Not a narrative. It's a fact. Republicans want to prevent minorities and young people from voting, because they can't win elections any more.

And YOU stand by that.
 
gbg3 said:
Once we started to see actual video of press and legal observers being cleared out and then boxes of ballots being wheeled out from under the only covered table in the room, descriptions from a driver bringing in a trailer full of ballots from another state, and so much more - there were important and serious questions to be answered and most never were.
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Those stories were debunked several times however, I guess the actual correct information never made it to Newsmax or Fox.....or rather they chose not to share the truth in order to perpetuate the big lie. These are just two links debunking the lies however there are plenty more out there if you really want to get at the truth, it's there. The sad thing is once the lie has been told and repeated over and over there doesn't seem to be any way to get Trumpers to accept the facts even when they are presented to them by Republicans as they were in GA and AZ. It's weird.

The first one was debunked and explained by a Republican election official

From the article:

"That interpretation is wrong, however. The footage doesn’t show any wrongdoing, said Gabriel Sterling, a Republican and Georgia’s voting system implementation manager, in a Dec. 4 tweet.
"The 90 second video of election workers at State Farm arena, purporting to show fraud was watched in its entirety (hours) by @GaSecofState investigators," Sterling wrote, linking to a fact-check from Lead Stories. "Shows normal ballot processing."

www.politifact.com

Claim about ‘suitcases’ of ballots in Georgia is wrong

Georgia election officials disputed a video promoted by President Donald Trump’s campaign as evidence of election fraud,
www.politifact.com www.politifact.com

The second one turned out to be shredded, unused requests formail in ballots left over from the GOP campaign to get out the mail in vote for Trump.

From the article:

Frames from the video reveal that the ballot applications are blank. And while the applications feature an image of President Donald Trump's face on them, there is no evidence the "applications were for Trump," as the tweet states.

A clear image of the ballot request similar to the one shown in the video has been posted to Twitter by several users in Ohio and North Carolina. The ballot applications were not requested by voters and are part of a nationwide effort by the Republican Party to encourage mail-in voting."

www.usatoday.com

Fact check: Viral video claiming to show 'shredded mail-in ballots' is of printing waste

A video on social media falsely claiming to show mail-in ballots is of printing waste and shredded material.
www.usatoday.com
 
AFrench2 said:
No it won't. This is the endgame and the end-result of a party that aligned with Christian Superchurch Leaders and Corporate Fatcat old white men in the 1980's over 40 years ago. The party is dying. There will be no "cleaning" where they shine themselves off and re-brand.

There is no where to go for them from here. They aligned themselves as the Anti-Black party and that entire paradigm in society is crumbling. You can't skate by just by saying "Black people suck" anymore. Their party will die.
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The deaths of both major parties have been previously predicted, yet both continue.
 
Destroy Trumpism said:
Not a narrative. It's a fact. Republicans want to prevent minorities and young people from voting, because they can't win elections any more.

And YOU stand by that.
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Please elaborate on the specific ways Republicans are preventing minorities and young people from voting. I think everyone of any race and legal voting age has an equal opportunity to vote in their state. The procedures are the same for any voter, regardless of their skin color, sex or age.
 
gbg3 said:
Please elaborate on the specific ways Republicans are preventing minorities and young people from voting. I think everyone of any race and legal voting age has an equal opportunity to vote in their state. The procedures are the same for any voter, regardless of their skin color, sex or age.
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Spare me your nonsense. Stacy Abrams explained it in explicit detail to that hick Senator Kennedy from Louisiana recently. Go watch the video.

You want to make elections "more secure", even though there was NO EVIDENCE of voter fraud in the 2020 election and election experts have stated repeatedly that the 2020 election was the most secure in U.S. history. You are disingenuous and you know voter suppression is the only hope the fascist Republican Party has left for ever holding power again.
 
gbg3 said:
elaborate on the specific ways Republicans are preventing minorities and young people from voting
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Speaking to the minority issue the reduction of voting options doesn't specifically target minorities rather it targets densely populated urban areas and by default minorities and the working poor. Fewer polling stations, drop boxes and reduced hours all have a much more significant impact on cities like Atlanta. That is the goal, limit options in Atlanta, Detriot, Philadelphia, Phoenix........the cities that gave Biden the win
 
AFrench2 said:
the GOP barely continues. They've won 1 popular vote(s) in the last 20 years. so okay.
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The Republicans don't have to win the popular vote, which is why they still pose a significant threat to this country. And if they take back power in 2022, they will never give it up. Jan 6 proved that.
 
AFrench2 said:
the GOP barely continues. They've won 1 popular vote(s) in the last 20 years. so okay.
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A party’s political survival isn’t dependent how many losses they have. If it were, both parties would’ve died off multiple times over the course of our country’s history.

Even major scandals can’t kill either party. Remember Watergate? Many predicted that was the end of the Republican Party, but just 6 years after Nixon resigned, the country overwhelmingly voted for Reagan, and 4 years later re-elected him by the biggest electoral vote margin in American history.

As long as there are Conservatives in America, there will be a Republican Party.
 
RaleBulgarian said:
A party’s political survival isn’t dependent how many losses they have. If it were, both parties would’ve died off multiple times over the course of our country’s history.
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okay. In 2024 go ahead and vote for the Whigs.

Oh, wait.
 
Those of you discussing voter suppression are simply playing a game. Minorities in the last couple decades have voted in presidential elections in far greater numbers than earlier. Clearly, they aren't having a problem and they don't need the "special treatment" Dems are so convinced they do. They are perfectly capable of getting their vote placed when they have even the slightest amount of motivation. These narratives about them not having transportation, not having ID, can't possibly get to a voting location or drop box that isn't as close as their block, etc. - all of that is simply hogwash meant to open up voting procedures to fraud. Voting is easy for every single legal voter who has chosen to vote. I'm over your games.
 
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