• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

The Donbas: Where The Russian Military Went To Die...

HangLow

BUFF 52 Nav
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 27, 2020
Messages
21,340
Reaction score
17,664
Location
KCMO & 50K Feet Up 4Reagan4Perot4Obama
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Other

Putin planning to double or treble Russian military forces in the Donbas region, West believes​


1649898671720.png



Russia transferred 19 convoys of weapons and ammunition to Donbas – OSCE​


1649898982552.png
Vladimir Putin is planning to double or even treble his military forces in the Donbas region of eastern Ukraine for a renewed assault, Western officials believe.

But the “massive” losses suffered by Russian forces in their failed attempt to take capital Kyiv, and their apparent inability to adapt tactically to the stiff Ukrainian resistance mean it may be a month or more before Moscow can claim any sort of progress in the area, where pro-Russia separatists have been fighting since 2014.

The Russian president wants to be able to declare a victory of some sort by the time of the 9 May parade in Red Square to mark the anniversary of Nazi surrender in the Second World War.
 
Last edited:

Ukraine: the battle for Donbas will be protracted and bloody – military expert


1649899475837.png
Russia’s offensive will now switch to the Donbas region in the east of Ukraine. STUmaps via Wikimedia Commons, CC BY-NC-SA

Russia is desperately trying to replace its considerable losses, up to 20% of its force already. Those efforts will make little difference. The conscript troops and reactivated reserves called up recently will not be ready for months. Nonetheless, the force the Russians will amass will be formidable, and with shorter and better-established supply lines into Russia, they may be able to avoid some of the appalling foul-ups which have characterized their war so far.

The comments from officials in Washington come as Ukraine has said it is preparing for a Russian offensive in the eastern part of the country, after Moscow withdrew from areas around the capital, Kyiv.

Russia now says its main objective is the east, and it is demanding Ukraine cede control of swathes of territory there to separatist fighters.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy told Al Jazeera that Russia could launch another offensive against Kyiv should it gain control of the eastern breakaway region.
 
Last edited:

Ukrainian victory over Putin’s army in the Donbas ‘quite likely’, says the UK​

Fierce fighting to erupt in the battle for the Donbas over the next two to three weeks, British defense chiefs say

Ukrainian victory over Vladimir Putin’s army in the looming battle in the Donbas is “quite likely”, Britain said on Tuesday.

Armed forces minister James Heappey stressed that Ukrainian forces had already defeated “some of Russia’s best regiments and battalions” so the next wave of attacks would come from less well-trained troops.

He also warned allies in the West against “rushing to trade away Ukrainian territory” to strike a deal with Mr. Putin to end the war, stressing these decisions should be left to the government in Kyiv alone.

“The Ukrainians have got the wind on their back right now,” he told Times Radio. “They have seen off the initial advances.
 

Ukrainian victory over Putin’s army in the Donbas ‘quite likely’, says the UK​

Fierce fighting to erupt in the battle for the Donbas over the next two to three weeks, British defense chiefs say

Ukrainian victory over Vladimir Putin’s army in the looming battle in the Donbas is “quite likely”, Britain said on Tuesday.

Armed forces minister James Heappey stressed that Ukrainian forces had already defeated “some of Russia’s best regiments and battalions” so the next wave of attacks would come from less well-trained troops.

He also warned allies in the West against “rushing to trade away Ukrainian territory” to strike a deal with Mr. Putin to end the war, stressing these decisions should be left to the government in Kyiv alone.

“The Ukrainians have got the wind on their back right now,” he told Times Radio. “They have seen off the initial advances.
Better keep your Chakras on the Russians, don't be smiling on them, don't be making it pan out fairly.
 

The U.S. has expanded intelligence sharing with Ukraine about Russian troops in the Donbas region.​


1649901759622.png
Russian soldiers patrolling the captured town of Volnovakha, in the Donetsk region of Ukraine, on Monday.
Credit...Alexander Nemenov/Agence France-Presse — Getty Images


The United States has increased the flow of intelligence to Ukraine about Russian forces in the Donbas and Crimea, as Kyiv’s military forces prepare to defend against a renewed offensive by Moscow in the country’s east, American officials said Wednesday.

The information could allow the Ukrainians to conduct more effective counterattacks against Russian forces in the Donbas or Crimea, or better predict the movement of Russian troops from those areas against Ukrainian forces.

After several weeks of failing to take Ukraine’s capital, Kyiv, Russian forces retreated from around the city and have been regrouping in Ukraine’s east, including the Donbas region. Western officials say they expect the Kremlin to mount a major offensive there.

As the conflict in Ukraine has evolved, intelligence agencies have adjusted their approach to ensure officials have flexibility “to share detailed timely intelligence with the Ukrainians,” a U.S. intelligence official said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss the handling of classified material.
 

Russia’s Make-or-Break Gambit in the Donbas​

Putin is hungry for some sort of win by Russia’s May 9 Victory Day.​

1649902645586.png
From left to right: Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu, President Vladimir Putin, and Adm. Nikolai Yevmenov, the commander in chief of the Russian Navy, attend the Navy Day parade in St. Petersburg, Russia, on July 25, 2021. ALEXEY NIKOLSKY/SPUTNIK/AFP VIA GETTY IMAGES APRIL 13, 2022, 4:37 PM

Having failed to achieve their initial goal of a lightning campaign to seize the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv, Russian forces are focusing their efforts on the Donbas region in the country’s east in what is likely to be a decisive—and bloody—next chapter of the war, Ukrainian and Western officials believe.
 

Russia says ammunition blast damages flagship of Black Sea fleet - Interfax​


April 14 (Reuters) - The flagship of Russia's Black Sea Fleet, the Moskva missile cruiser, was badly damaged when ammunition on board blew up, Interfax news agency quoted the defense ministry as saying on Thursday.

The blast is yet another military setback for Russia, which has suffered a series of blows since invading Ukraine on Feb. 24 in what Moscow calls a "special military operation" to "denazify" the country.

Interfax said all the crew had been evacuated. It cited the ministry as blaming the blast on fire and said the cause was being investigated.

1649904663074.png
Ukrainian Neptune anti-ship missiles. Ukraine MoD Photo

Neptunes, first fielded in 2021, are based on the Soviet AS-20 ‘Kayak’anti-ship missile which is similar to the U.S.-built Harpoon missile.

Moskva was commissioned into the Soviet Navy in 1982 and is one of three Slava-class guided-missile cruisers.

The three 11,500-ton Slavas were designed around launchers that can hold 16 SS-N-12 Sandbox anti-ship cruise missiles – each about the size of a telephone pole. Developed in the 1970s, the Slavas and the Sandboxes were designed to take on U.S. and NATO aircraft carriers by overwhelming them with a barrage of high-speed cruise missiles to sink ships.

The two other Slavas are RTS Marshal Ustinov (055) and RFS Varyag (011) have been operating in the Mediterranian.

Moskva is not the first Russian warship to be damaged in the nearly 50-day invasion of Ukraine. A landing ship sank off the port of Ukrainian city Berdiansk after being attacked by Ukrainian forces, USNI News previously reported.
 
Last edited:

Russia says ammunition blast damages flagship of Black Sea fleet - Interfax​


April 14 (Reuters) - The flagship of Russia's Black Sea Fleet, the Moskva missile cruiser, was badly damaged when ammunition on board blew up, Interfax news agency quoted the defense ministry as saying on Thursday.

The blast is yet another military setback for Russia, which has suffered a series of blows since invading Ukraine on Feb. 24 in what Moscow calls a "special military operation" to "denazify" the country.

Interfax said all the crew had been evacuated. It cited the ministry as blaming the blast on fire and said the cause was being investigated.

Ukrainian Neptune anti-ship missiles. Ukraine MoD Photo

Neptunes, first fielded in 2021, are based on the Soviet AS-20 ‘Kayak’anti-ship missile which is similar to the U.S.-built Harpoon missile.

Moskva was commissioned into the Soviet Navy in 1982 and is one of three Slava-class guided-missile cruisers.

The three 11,500-ton Slavas were designed around launchers that can hold 16 SS-N-12 Sandbox anti-ship cruise missiles – each about the size of a telephone pole. Developed in the 1970s, the Slavas and the Sandboxes were designed to take on U.S. and NATO aircraft carriers by overwhelming them with a barrage of high-speed cruise missiles to sink ships.

The two other Slavas are RTS Marshal Ustinov (055) and RFS Varyag (011) have been operating in the Mediterranian.

Moskva is not the first Russian warship to be damaged in the nearly 50-day invasion of Ukraine. A landing ship sank off the port of Ukrainian city Berdiansk after being attacked by Ukrainian forces, USNI News previously reported.
I would bet good money that a Seal Team or the Mossad was somewhere in the Black Sea Painting the target... No missile is that good to hit a ship exactly where it is most vulnerable... Generally, a laser is used to put a heat signature on a target which later guides a projectile weapon to strike the target in that spot... Simply put, if the target is “painted,” it is getting hit, no ands, ifs, or buts...
-Peace
 

DID UKRAINE STRIKE, AND POSSIBLY SINK,

THE MOSKVA, A MAJOR RUSSIAN WARSHIP?​

1649906007214.png
Russian authorities confirmed that the cruiser Moskva was burning in the Black Sea and had been evacuated. Photo from Russia Today.

Reports in Russian state-run media appear to confirm social media chatter that a premier Russian warship, the Moskva, has been badly damaged — and is perhaps burning or even sinking — in the Black Sea.

No details have been confirmed by the US government, US military, or western media, but Ukrainian officials in Odesa claim that the ship was struck by two Ukrainian-built Nepture anti-ship cruise missiles fired from land.

The website of Russia Today says that Russian officials have confirmed an explosion on the ship and claim that the crew of 510 has been evacuated.

If true, the loss of the Moskva, some analysts said, could mean any amphibious landings that Russia might attempt in southern Ukraine. would be more vulnerable to air attacks.

Calling the ship a “12,500-ton, 612-foot mobile missile battery,”
Forbes said in January that the ship “packs enough anti-ship missiles to wipe out the entire Ukrainian navy and enough air-defense missiles to swat away any conceivable aerial attack on the Black Sea Fleet’s amphibious flotilla.”
 
Last edited:
If that battleship sinks; Russia has bigger problems than Ukraine...
They only had three, one in the Atlantic, the Pacific, and the Black Sea...
-Peace

That boat is supposed to be a Carrier Killer...
Do you guys remember these???
1649908244669.png

Imagine a ship that can put (rain) this many missiles on a Carrier or a city every two minutes...
If the Ukrainian sunk it... They will own the sea and the air very soon...
The Russian ability to raze a city from the sea is gone...
-Peace
 
Last edited:

DID UKRAINE STRIKE, AND POSSIBLY SINK,

THE MOSKVA, A MAJOR RUSSIAN WARSHIP?​

Russian authorities confirmed that the cruiser Moskva was burning in the Black Sea and had been evacuated. Photo from Russia Today.

Reports in Russian state-run media appear to confirm social media chatter that a premier Russian warship, the Moskva, has been badly damaged — and is perhaps burning or even sinking — in the Black Sea.

No details have been confirmed by the US government, US military, or western media, but Ukrainian officials in Odesa claim that the ship was struck by two Ukrainian-built Nepture anti-ship cruise missiles fired from land.

The website of Russia Today says that Russian officials have confirmed an explosion on the ship and claim that the crew of 510 has been evacuated.

If true, the loss of the Moskva, some analysts said, could mean any amphibious landings that Russia might attempt in southern Ukraine. would be more vulnerable to air attacks.

Calling the ship a “12,500-ton, 612-foot mobile missile battery,”
Forbes said in January that the ship “packs enough anti-ship missiles to wipe out the entire Ukrainian navy and enough air-defense missiles to swat away any conceivable aerial attack on the Black Sea Fleet’s amphibious flotilla.”
 
I would bet good money that a Seal Team or the Mossad was somewhere in the Black Sea Painting the target... No missile is that good to hit a ship exactly where it is most vulnerable... Generally, a laser is used to put a heat signature on a target which later guides a projectile weapon to strike the target in that spot... Simply put, if the target is “painted,” it is getting hit, no ands, ifs, or buts...
-Peace
Well seeing as the Neptune missile is radar guided I am not sure what good painting it with a laser will do.


That only works on laser guided missiles.
 
Well seeing as the Neptune missile is radar guided I am not sure what good painting it with a laser will do.
That only works on laser guided missiles.
I don't know if I would lose that bet Brain...
Ukraine started building the Neptunes back in 1965... during the cold war...
After the soviet union, they continued to build and market them around the world...
During the early 2000s, they started upgrading them and started different product offerings...
but you are right, I do not know if they offer a laser-guided Neptune missile or not...
but after the 2014 war with Russia, they started preparing to fight a full-scale war...

The Battleship had a very fine anti-missile capability including radar-guided defenses...
so far the word is that it never activated... Ukraine fired two missiles... both hit both sides of the ship...
at the most vulnerable spots... I guess I will keep my money in my pocket...
-Peace
 
I don't know if I would lose that bet Brain...
Ukraine started building the Neptunes back in 1965... during the cold war...
After the soviet union, they continued to build and market them around the world...
During the early 2000s, they started upgrading them and started different product offerings...
but you are right, I do not know if they offer a laser-guided Neptune missile or not...
but after the 2014 war with Russia, they started preparing to fight a full-scale war...

The Battleship had a very fine anti-missile capability including radar-guided defenses...
so far the word is that it never activated... Ukraine fired two missiles... both hit both sides of the ship...
at the most vulnerable spots... I guess I will keep my money in my pocket...
-Peace
I don’t remember saying anything at all about betting.

Right now there is absolutely zero evidence that the Neptune missile is laser guided but if you want to pretend it is I really don’t care.
 
The Neptun (Neptune) has an inertial navigation system with active radar homing on the terminal stage of its flight. It is subsonic with a 330lb warhead.

About 12 miles out the acquisition radar locks on and the missile drops from 30' above the water to 9' above the water. The Moskva the morning after.....

iu
 
 
Back
Top Bottom