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The Bible Is Satan’s Masterpiece!

And yet anyone halfway familiar with the story of Moses would know that Moses repeatedly wanted to shirk the responsibility of leadership because he wasn't an eloquent speaker.

It's literally like you're trying to be wrong on this stuff.

And you focus on his doubts, instead of his perseverance. The fact is that he did not give up, because of his drive to help his people. The story undermines your misplaced emphasis on his doubts.
 
It doesn't require belief in any religious scriptures to understand what they are about. In fact, belief is a stumbling block toward true understanding.
lol...
 
Paul traveled extensively to far off areas to try to make converts. His focus was on converting Gentiles, not Jews. He spent much of his time with Gentiles. Not likely that all those people knew him before he arrived. Some of them accepted him, and some did not. His travels brought him the hardships of travels at the time. Those who accepted his message surely didn't beat him or punish him. He actually helped to get a nascent religion started, so he did have supporters.
True.
Once again, you focus on one small part of Paul's ministry and try to paint it as the whole thing. You make it sound as if it was a constant struggle against unyielding opposition. If that were the case, his name would not be know today.
I'm simply trying to show you that there's a mixed bag to your claims - some true and some completely false. There were many hardships that are common to someone who travelled as extensively as he did. And there were hardships that came exclusively as a result of preaching.
 
True.

I'm simply trying to show you that there's a mixed bag to your claims - some true and some completely false. There were many hardships that are common to someone who travelled as extensively as he did. And there were hardships that came exclusively as a result of preaching.

You haven't shown anything that I claimed to be completely false.
 
You haven't shown anything that I claimed to be completely false.
"My claims are not completely false!!!"

Kind of a low threshold for success, but I guess you achieved it.
 
"My claims are not completely false!!!"

Kind of a low threshold for success, but I guess you achieved it.

I didn't say that. Don't put words in my mouth. But I guess that's what you do when you've got nothing else.
 
This is a utter mess of a post David, as you're wrong on about every count. Paul was certainly not a stranger to the Jews, being a former Pharisee from the tribe of Benjamin himself. He was beaten by the Jews, arrested by the Jews and spent two years in a prison in Caesarea (a town in Israel and home of the Roman governors in Judea), per his writings and confirmed by Luke as well. Yes, for specifically trying to preach to the establishment religion.
Well, that is the claim. THere is another claim about Paul. That claim is from the Ebionites They claimed that Paul was a greek convert to Judaism trying to court the daughter of the High priest, and when that failed, he became bitter and apostate. That is a story that was relayed by Epiphanius. There is some indication that this is true. For example, when Paul quoted from the Jewish scriptures, he always used the LXX, not the Hebrew scriptures.

When it comes to the claim about being from the Tribe of Benjemin. It was highly unlikely. Most Jews , except for the Cohen and levites didn't know their tribe. . However, that is the tribe the Herod the Great claimed to be part of after he converted to Judaism. That would indicate that Paul was following in that manner. and it does reinforce the concept he was a convert.

Of course, then there was the attitude towards the Law. He thought of the Law s as a burden. That would be highly untypical of people who grew up following the law. They would view it as an honor and a delight. It would be the same as a modern day Christian view the Gospels as 'the bad news'

While he might have been Jewish, his lack of knowledge about the Jewish writings and his attitudes to the law shows the he wasn't a good Jews, and highly unlikely to have been a Pharisee.
 
Well, that is the claim. THere is another claim about Paul. That claim is from the Ebionites They claimed that Paul was a greek convert to Judaism trying to court the daughter of the High priest, and when that failed, he became bitter and apostate. That is a story that was relayed by Epiphanius. There is some indication that this is true. For example, when Paul quoted from the Jewish scriptures, he always used the LXX, not the Hebrew scriptures.
That's sus. Epiphanius was a fourth century thinker who believed the Ebionites (whoever they were) were heretics, for starters. And there's the issue that the very first mention of the Ebionites was out of Irenaeus' against heresies writings - which was written in 180, a full 120 years after the death of Paul. There's no real evidence that a group with this name even existed outside of Irenaeus' writings. Paul confronted some of these Jewish-Christian hybrids in his letter to Galatia (48AD) that may fit the bill as Ebionites, but it's highly speculative that we're talking about the same group.

For someone to question Paul's birthright because he favored the Septuagint is moving into "birther" territory of literary evidence (not you). Jesus quoted the Septuagint, Peter's letters quoted it, as did every gospel writer. About 2/3rds of the OT quotes in the NT were from the LXX.
Well, that is the claim. THere is another claim about Paul. That claim is from the Ebionites They claimed that Paul was a greek convert to Judaism trying to court the daughter of the High priest, and when that failed, he became bitter and apostate. That is a story that was relayed by Epiphanius. There is some indication that this is true. For example, when Paul quoted from the Jewish scriptures, he always used the LXX, not the Hebrew scriptures.

When it comes to the claim about being from the Tribe of Benjemin. It was highly unlikely. Most Jews , except for the Cohen and levites didn't know their tribe. . However, that is the tribe the Herod the Great claimed to be part of after he converted to Judaism. That would indicate that Paul was following in that manner. and it does reinforce the concept he was a convert.
I don't think it's highly unlikely at all. There are plenty of first century ossuary to their family tribes that we have unearthed over the years. Also there are first century Mishna references to tribal affiliation (non-Levite). Of course, the more common the first century Jew, the less likely the knowledge of the tribe, and less likely he would even care.

Of course, then there was the attitude towards the Law. He thought of the Law s as a burden. That would be highly untypical of people who grew up following the law. They would view it as an honor and a delight. It would be the same as a modern day Christian view the Gospels as 'the bad news'

While he might have been Jewish, his lack of knowledge about the Jewish writings and his attitudes to the law shows the he wasn't a good Jews, and highly unlikely to have been a Pharisee.
For the rest of this, I can only personally attest that religious rules suck. Everyone that's been on the wrong end of oppressive rules-based religion can attest. Legalism crushes people, it is no honor and it is no delight. The fact that much of Paul's writings revolve around the freedom of Christ, completely conveys that he was intimately familiar with that pressure.
 
That's sus. Epiphanius was a fourth century thinker who believed the Ebionites (whoever they were) were heretics, for starters. And there's the issue that the very first mention of the Ebionites was out of Irenaeus' against heresies writings - which was written in 180, a full 120 years after the death of Paul. There's no real evidence that a group with this name even existed outside of Irenaeus' writings. Paul confronted some of these Jewish-Christian hybrids in his letter to Galatia (48AD) that may fit the bill as Ebionites, but it's highly speculative that we're talking about the same group.

For someone to question Paul's birthright because he favored the Septuagint is moving into "birther" territory of literary evidence (not you). Jesus quoted the Septuagint, Peter's letters quoted it, as did every gospel writer. About 2/3rds of the OT quotes in the NT were from the LXX.

I don't think it's highly unlikely at all. There are plenty of first century ossuary to their family tribes that we have unearthed over the years. Also there are first century Mishna references to tribal affiliation (non-Levite). Of course, the more common the first century Jew, the less likely the knowledge of the tribe, and less likely he would even care.


For the rest of this, I can only personally attest that religious rules suck. Everyone that's been on the wrong end of oppressive rules-based religion can attest. Legalism crushes people, it is no honor and it is no delight. The fact that much of Paul's writings revolve around the freedom of Christ, completely conveys that he was intimately familiar with that pressure.
Does that stop him from reporting they thought the Paul was a convert? That only reinforces my other points about Pauls lack of knowledge, and his attitudes.

And, the fact that Jesus was alleged to have quoted the Septigaunt shows the origin of the writers of the Gospels, not of Jesus. Jesus didn't write a darn thing down.
 
This is what I've been trying to tell you as well, @nota bene . Religion does nothing but isolate people. It's a community of haters. How may times have you all prayed to "save the evil Democrats soul"?

Like The Crusades, The Spanish Inquisition, and the Salem Witch trials, in history, religion has been nothing but a weapon to perpetuate warfare against those with whom people disagree.

You don't support isolating and vilifying over half the country. You don't hate the majority of Americans. Please tell us you don't.
I'd suggest that your worldview is both skewed and very narrow if all you genuinely see about religion is that it "isolates" and is "nothing but a weapon."

Please don't address me as "you all." I am one person, and my relationship with God is uniquely mine.

And I feel no obligation to defend or "prove" my faith to your "us."
 
It seems to me that people just assume that the Bible is unquestionable.

Which is why it just might be Satan’s greatest deception upon man.
 
I'd suggest that your worldview is both skewed and very narrow if all you genuinely see about religion is that it "isolates" and is "nothing but a weapon."

Please don't address me as "you all." I am one person, and my relationship with God is uniquely mine.

And I feel no obligation to defend or "prove" my faith to your "us."
So you're one of the people who think the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, the Salem Witch trials, the corruption of the Catholic Church and all the American "fake preacher/evangelicals" ,the current campaign against women, gays and minorities have nothing to do with religion? Hmmm. Well. I don't know what to say to that.

My friend, remove the wool from your eyes. I'm telling you - religion the way it's been used in the past and the way it's being used as rationale to vilify people - it's killing us. If really don't see it, I'm sorry.
 
So you're one of the people who think the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, the Salem Witch trials, the corruption of the Catholic Church and all the American "fake preacher/evangelicals" ,the current campaign against women, gays and minorities have nothing to do with religion? Hmmm. Well. I don't know what to say to that.

My friend, remove the wool from your eyes. I'm telling you - religion the way it's been used in the past and the way it's being used as rationale to vilify people - it's killing us. If really don't see it, I'm sorry.
You're right: You don't know what to say, and you've just proven that (and also embarrassed yourself with the little "So you're one of the people" gambit).
 
Does that stop him from reporting they thought the Paul was a convert? That only reinforces my other points about Pauls lack of knowledge, and his attitudes.
Of course not, but we don't even know if "they" existed. And if the Ebionites did exist, the first mention of them was decades after Paul had died. Just an odd charge revealed centuries later, by a group that may or may not exist, without any real support whatsoever. Just no.
And, the fact that Jesus was alleged to have quoted the Septigaunt shows the origin of the writers of the Gospels, not of Jesus. Jesus didn't write a darn thing down.
That's true.
 
You're right:
You could have just stopped there!
You don't know what to say, and you've just proven that (and also embarrassed yourself with the little "So you're one of the people" gambit)
Well if the shoe fits...

Nota, I know you you sublimate your will to Christianity. You let others tell you what's right and wrong. Just own it and quit attacking those who've figure you out.
 
It seems to me that people just assume that the Bible is unquestionable.
Maybe because that's what they were taught or indoctrinated to believe and accept, no questions asked. Religion doesn't seem to like being questioned or challenged.
 
You could have just stopped there!

Well if the shoe fits...

Nota, I know you you sublimate your will to Christianity. You let others tell you what's right and wrong. Just own it and quit attacking those who've figure you out.
You don't know anything.
 
There is no God or Satan. The bible was written by men to control the masses. The end
 
Not everyone is sola scriptura (by Scripture alone).
 
Not everyone is sola scriptura (by Scripture alone).

No they aren't. But without the scriptures, how does anyone know the details of the person who is the very basis of Christianity? It was handed down either verbally or in writing. No one is born with the specific details of Christian doctrine in them and no one has a direct line of communication with the founder of Christianity. The details of Christian belief do not magically enter the human mind without some source, either verbal or written. If they did, there was have been no need for the Christian mission to spread the word. Take away written scriptures and what really is the basis of the Christian faith? It's roots in Judaism led to its reliance on written scripture.
 
No they aren't. But without the scriptures, how does anyone know the details of the person who is the very basis of Christianity? It was handed down either verbally or in writing. No one is born with the specific details of Christian doctrine in them and no one has a direct line of communication with the founder of Christianity. The details of Christian belief do not magically enter the human mind without some source, either verbal or written. If they did, there was have been no need for the Christian mission to spread the word. Take away written scriptures and what really is the basis of the Christian faith? It's roots in Judaism led to its reliance on written scripture.
Of course, no where in scripture does it say Scripture alone. That means that people who say 'Scripture alone' are adding to scripture, which makes the scripture alone stance violating the principle of scripture alone.
 
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