The Bad Boy Syndrome

[Waddy]

I'll tell you why women like bad boys; they love a challenge. They can change that bad boy....they can turn him into the man of their dreams. A few little improvements here and there, new haircut, better clothes, and some behavioral modifications.... it's do-able. And then they will have tamed the Tiger, better than any old Sigfried and Roy could ever do. But like Sigried and Roy learned, too often they get bit. It ain't the Tiger's fault; he's just acting like a Tiger. Better to settle for a house cat, and de-claw him for sure first thing. Maybe a house full of cats......

 

[CLAX1911]

seriously though....being alone, doing guy things, just led me to masterbation. I like having a girl around. Sometimes it does seem more trouble than it's worth, but there you have it.....

For some people it is more trouble than it's worth. If she decides to divorce you take half of your stuff accuse you of rape then it's not worth it. Your wife and your girlfriend you might not ever do that but she can.

 

[CLAX1911]

I'll tell you why women like bad boys; they love a challenge. They can change that bad boy....they can turn him into the man of their dreams. A few little improvements here and there, new haircut, better clothes, and some behavioral modifications.... it's do-able. And then they will have tamed the Tiger, better than any old Sigfried and Roy could ever do. But like Sigried and Roy learned, too often they get bit. It ain't the Tiger's fault; he's just acting like a Tiger. Better to settle for a house cat, and de-claw him for sure first thing. Maybe a house full of cats......

I'm going to have to disagree I think they go for the "bad boy" trope because they come off as more masculine. They're exciting, they take charge I can't be conquered what's the conquer them they wind up leaving them.

I remember a few years back I shaved my head bald, and I had a goatee and for some reason I got a lot more attention from ladies. I couldn't figure that one out so I talked to a few female friends of mine and they said that it's because I looked dangerous. I understood that because dangerous is exciting. I didn't want the attention and so I stopped shaving my head and it went away. Now I really hope I don't go bald.

 

[Waddy]

For some people it is more trouble than it's worth. If she decides to divorce you take half of your stuff accuse you of rape then it's not worth it. Your wife and your girlfriend you might not ever do that but she can.

I've been married over 50 years to the same woman. It's been great. Maybe I just got lucky. And I do understand when young men want to steer clear of marriage, or even long term relationships. But can't a guy just keep a side chick without any commitment? Switch off every now and again? Hell. just pay for one once in a while.

 

[CLAX1911]

I've been married over 50 years to the same woman. It's been great. Maybe I just got lucky. And I do understand when young men want to steer clear of marriage, or even long term relationships. But can't a guy just keep a side chick without any commitment? Switch off every now and again? Hell. just pay for one once in a while.

I'm happy that you have such a long lasting marriage longer than my parents they just haven't made it that far yet. Really what you probably did was you committed to her and she committed to you and you work through the problems and remained committed even then.

That's work, work on yourself work on each other. You have to find someone willing to work as hard as you. That's not easy. Especially this day and age where marriage isn't really much of a commitment. The only people really with skin in the game are men so opting out if it is a wise decision.

 

[Luce]

The Bad Boy Syndrome

Thread inspired by Wan's thread found here:
The Nice Guy Syndrome​

Why are women drawn to "bad boys" -- the rebels and heels and assholes of the masculine persuasion?

Or is this just a stereotype?

Or have things changed in the last forty years with the advent of the New Millennial Woman?

As Wan says: Let's share our thoughts.

Sounds like incel whining.

 

[Herkamer63]

A few things to dissect here:

-Women like that idea of excitement, adventure, and being mischievous (especially younger women). First thing that comes to mind is Bonnie and Clyde because they were seen as just that (except those two were criminals and not only ruined small businesses but also murdered people). Young, full of energy, and (puppy) love. Brush aside anyone that tells them 'no' (even if they're authority figures)because they want to have fun. That's how a lot of bad boys roll.

-Bad boys are seen as protective. In many situations, they are seen as jumping in to defend their girls because, deep down, they're seen as people with true hearts of gold, caring of others, and women just want to help bring that out. Although, many argue that when the women is not around, these guys are anything but good.

-Masculinity is, supposedly, displayed by these types of men, shown as tough and strong in character. They don't care what others think of them, except their women.

-Confidence becomes no issue here because bad boys don't lack in this department. The appearance of them knowing what they want and what they're doing is a major attraction. They are very comfortable with themselves because they (are in) love with themselves and have a lot of self respect. What you see is what you get.

Many young women love the bad boys because they think they can customize these guys any way they want, believing that they may have a real winner in their grasp. However, as many women get older and wiser, they begin to realize that the concept of the bad boy is, more or less, a phase in their younger days, thinking they have a knight in shining armor, when, in reality, many bad boys are wolves in sheep skin. Not saying that many nice guys are never bad, but many fathers do have a right to keep watch over their daughters and who they go out with when they're younger, and would rather see their little girls go out with guys who seem decent, good, and appear to actually care.

Either way, regardless if they're in the nice guy or bad boy categories, ladies, be careful who you go out with. Don't jump into a relationship with someone right away, even if they are check marking all the areas you want marked for a guy. Unless if the dude appears very creepy or simply uninterested in them, if they ask you out and you on a date with them, make sure to get them to be open and honest. Pay attention to patterns on how they respond. You really don't know if you really love the guy until like the 7th or 10th date (assuming you're still seeing each other). But if you see behaviors you're not liking, ditch him. Don't attempt to change him. He needs to do that on his own under his own free will. Otherwise, he'll change you for the worse. Be careful.

 

[CLAX1911]

A few things to dissect here:

-Women like that idea of excitement, adventure, and being mischievous (especially younger women). First thing that comes to mind is Bonnie and Clyde because they were seen as just that (except those two were criminals and not only ruined small businesses but also murdered people). Young, full of energy, and (puppy) love. Brush aside anyone that tells them 'no' (even if they're authority figures)because they want to have fun. That's how a lot of bad boys roll.

-Bad boys are seen as protective. In many situations, they are seen as jumping in to defend their girls because, deep down, they're seen as people with true hearts of gold, caring of others, and women just want to help bring that out. Although, many argue that when the women is not around, these guys are anything but good.

-Masculinity is, supposedly, displayed by these types of men, shown as tough and strong in character. They don't care what others think of them, except their women.

-Confidence becomes no issue here because bad boys don't lack in this department. The appearance of them knowing what they want and what they're doing is a major attraction. They are very comfortable with themselves because they (are in) love with themselves and have a lot of self respect. What you see is what you get.

Many young women love the bad boys because they think they can customize these guys any way they want, believing that they may have a real winner in their grasp. However, as many women get older and wiser, they begin to realize that the concept of the bad boy is, more or less, a phase in their younger days, thinking they have a knight in shining armor, when, in reality, many bad boys are wolves in sheep skin. Not saying that many nice guys are never bad, but many fathers do have a right to keep watch over their daughters and who they go out with when they're younger, and would rather see their little girls go out with guys who seem decent, good, and appear to actually care.

Either way, regardless if they're in the nice guy or bad boy categories, ladies, be careful who you go out with. Don't jump into a relationship with someone right away, even if they are check marking all the areas you want marked for a guy. Unless if the dude appears very creepy or simply uninterested in them, if they ask you out and you on a date with them, make sure to get them to be open and honest. Pay attention to patterns on how they respond. You really don't know if you really love the guy until like the 7th or 10th date (assuming you're still seeing each other). But if you see behaviors you're not liking, ditch him. Don't attempt to change him. He needs to do that on his own under his own free will. Otherwise, he'll change you for the worse. Be careful.

So masculinity is something women seem to prefer.

This is of course obvious but it seems a lot of people want to redefine masculinity.

 

[Herkamer63]

So masculinity is something women seem to prefer.

This is of course obvious but it seems a lot of people want to redefine masculinity.

I'm not saying masculinity is bad. Not at all. As a matter of fact, I would want to see women go out with masculine men. I wasn't clear of where I was going with that, so here it is: a lot of younger women don't understand that part of being masculine IS caring for others and understanding. It's about standing strong on who you are and not being feminine.

However, many younger women only see masculine men as ONLY caring about what they think. In other words, they really don't care if their man is a jerk and rude to everyone else, so long as he's nice to her. That's not masculine at all. Those are the signs of what a spoiled child does, not a full grown adult. As I was growing up, I was taught to respect everyone around me and treat them with dignity. There are men (and women) who don't do either.

As an example, and to give full context, a few years ago, there was a woman I liked. I only asked her out once, but we never dated. Which was fine because she, at the time, had been talking to someone else. Found out later, she was actually in a relationship with another man, and a few years later, they got married. Every now and then, I'll see her and her husband at the place I like to get drinks at. Over the course of that time, I have seen the guy several times with this woman. Now, the woman would say something to me every time we see each other, but every time I would greet the guy, the only thing he'd give me is a look and turns away. Every once in a while, he'd give me a grunt while he's drunk.

I'm not demanding he'd greet me nor am I saying I have a right to be greeted, but if you greet someone, you would hope to be greeted back, at least, with a simple 'hey.' I get none of that from this man. I pretty much given up trying to say ANYTHING to him because he just seems like a horse's @$$, at least to me. He must have found out I had a thing for his wife a few years ago and he's holding some sort of grudge or whatever against me.

Of course, this is the guy's second marriage (first wife only lasted about 10 years, then they got divorced), while it being this woman's first, and he doesn't want to lose this one. Nearly a 20 year difference between the two and probably doesn't want a younger guy, like me (who's her age), to come along and snatch her away from him. Even then, he can still show respect without me asking nor demanding it. It should just come naturally. But I don't receive it from him and that's fine. It shows me where this woman's mind is at, too, so I lost interest in her a few years ago and haven't pursued her since, especially after she got married.

Bottom line is this, there's a fine line between being masculine and being a jerk. If being masculine involves being rude to everyone else around you, except what you would perceive as being your property, then it's not masculinity. It's what we call being intolerant and disrespectful. But there are women that like that, even though they say they want a man who's kind and considerate, and these bad boys, like the man I gave in the example, are anything but masculine. That's what I was trying to get at.

 

[CLAX1911]

I'm not saying masculinity is bad. Not at all. As a matter of fact, I would want to see women go out with masculine men. I wasn't clear of where I was going with that, so here it is: a lot of younger women don't understand that part of being masculine IS caring for others and understanding. It's about standing strong on who you are and not being feminine.

However, many younger women only see masculine men as ONLY caring about what they think. In other words, they really don't care if their man is a jerk and rude to everyone else, so long as he's nice to her. That's not masculine at all. Those are the signs of what a spoiled child does, not a full grown adult. As I was growing up, I was taught to respect everyone around me and treat them with dignity. There are men (and women) who don't do either.

As an example, and to give full context, a few years ago, there was a woman I liked. I only asked her out once, but we never dated. Which was fine because she, at the time, had been talking to someone else. Found out later, she was actually in a relationship with another man, and a few years later, they got married. Every now and then, I'll see her and her husband at the place I like to get drinks at. Over the course of that time, I have seen the guy several times with this woman. Now, the woman would say something to me every time we see each other, but every time I would greet the guy, the only thing he'd give me is a look and turns away. Every once in a while, he'd give me a grunt while he's drunk.

I'm not demanding he'd greet me nor am I saying I have a right to be greeted, but if you greet someone, you would hope to be greeted back, at least, with a simple 'hey.' I get none of that from this man. I pretty much given up trying to say ANYTHING to him because he just seems like a horse's @$$, at least to me. He must have found out I had a thing for his wife a few years ago and he's holding some sort of grudge or whatever against me.

Of course, this is the guy's second marriage (first wife only lasted about 10 years, then they got divorced), while it being this woman's first, and he doesn't want to lose this one. Nearly a 20 year difference between the two and probably doesn't want a younger guy, like me (who's her age), to come along and snatch her away from him. Even then, he can still show respect without me asking nor demanding it. It should just come naturally. But I don't receive it from him and that's fine. It shows me where this woman's mind is at, too, so I lost interest in her a few years ago and haven't pursued her since, especially after she got married.

Bottom line is this, there's a fine line between being masculine and being a jerk. If being masculine involves being rude to everyone else around you, except what you would perceive as being your property, then it's not masculinity. It's what we call being intolerant and disrespectful. But there are women that like that, even though they say they want a man who's kind and considerate, and these bad boys, like the man I gave in the example, are anything but masculine. That's what I was trying to get at.

I do apologize I didn't mean to give the impression that I thought you said masculinity was bad.

Our society is trying to label masculinity as toxic, so because of that a lot of young men get the idea that they shouldn't be masculine.

I would say the bad boy types probably have a lot of masculine characteristics. And that's what attracts women to them. I'm not saying they're good people because they have a few masculine characteristics I'm saying that's what women are attracted to. They'll accept some rather toxic characteristics that I would not consider masculine.

Think about the popular phrase toxic masculinity do not talking about certain poor behaviors they're talking about masculinity. Things such as stoicism, being forthright, competent, aggressive and dominant. This is masculinity and that's what's being called toxic. Not the criminal Behavior, self-centeredness and various other aspects that make the bad boys bad.

 

[CLAX1911]

Sounds like incel whining.

The trope of nice guys finishing last existed long before the concept of incels did.

You have to be assertive you have to be masculine women don't want feminized men. Generally speaking of course

 

[Herkamer63]

I do apologize I didn't mean to give the impression that I thought you said masculinity was bad.

Our society is trying to label masculinity as toxic, so because of that a lot of young men get the idea that they shouldn't be masculine.

I would say the bad boy types probably have a lot of masculine characteristics. And that's what attracts women to them. I'm not saying they're good people because they have a few masculine characteristics I'm saying that's what women are attracted to. They'll accept some rather toxic characteristics that I would not consider masculine.

Think about the popular phrase toxic masculinity do not talking about certain poor behaviors they're talking about masculinity. Things such as stoicism, being forthright, competent, aggressive and dominant. This is masculinity and that's what's being called toxic. Not the criminal Behavior, self-centeredness and various other aspects that make the bad boys bad.

It's all good. It's hard to get a point across on a platform like this, so no worries. But, yeah, the bad boys do have many masculine features. The only issue is, like you said, criminal behaviors. Nothing wrong with being forthcoming nor dominant in a positive sense. Also, you're on the money in saying that a lot of women are, by nature, attracted to masculine men that display masculine features. The problem we're running into today is the difference between what's toxic and what isn't.

The guy I used as the example does display masculine features. He is dominant and is forthcoming. However, the toxic features are him not showing courtesy and respect towards others, like someone just simply greeting him. Again, no law that says he has to, nor is anyone demanding it, but something like that should almost be an instant turn off to anyone. Yet, this woman fell for him and, apparently, thinks that features like this are perfectly fine and acceptable. To be fair, though, I don't know him well enough and he might be uncomfortable around others he doesn't know, but, then again, I've seen this guy several times and tried to talk to him but he has always turned his nose up at me, so I wouldn't be surprised if he's just a jerk and does the same to others.

Anyway, I fully agree that society today has embraced what's actually toxic and casted down what's not. There are good masculine guys that are out there that have given up on dating altogether because they're always demonized over stuff that isn't even true and tired of having to be compared to these bad boys, who are held up in such high regard and praise but are the total opposite of what a good person in general is suppose to be. Some of these women wise up, though, and realize that these bad boys are nothing more than, well, immature little boys in grown up bodies and will take the time to look for actual men. For me, personally, I'm not seeing anyone right now because I'm focusing on what I need done in my life. Although, I have a hobby I'm really getting into, and there's a lot of women that I'm becoming friends with because of the hobby that I could ask out but I'm holding off. Anyway, thanks for the conversation, brother!

 

[CLAX1911]

It's all good. It's hard to get a point across on a platform like this, so no worries. But, yeah, the bad boys do have many masculine features. The only issue is, like you said, criminal behaviors. Nothing wrong with being forthcoming nor dominant in a positive sense. Also, you're on the money in saying that a lot of women are, by nature, attracted to masculine men that display masculine features. The problem we're running into today is the difference between what's toxic and what isn't.

The guy I used as the example does display masculine features. He is dominant and is forthcoming. However, the toxic features are him not showing courtesy and respect towards others, like someone just simply greeting him. Again, no law that says he has to, nor is anyone demanding it, but something like that should almost be an instant turn off to anyone. Yet, this woman fell for him and, apparently, thinks that features like this are perfectly fine and acceptable. To be fair, though, I don't know him well enough and he might be uncomfortable around others he doesn't know, but, then again, I've seen this guy several times and tried to talk to him but he has always turned his nose up at me, so I wouldn't be surprised if he's just a jerk and does the same to others.

Anyway, I fully agree that society today has embraced what's actually toxic and casted down what's not. There are good masculine guys that are out there that have given up on dating altogether because they're always demonized over stuff that isn't even true and tired of having to be compared to these bad boys, who are held up in such high regard and praise but are the total opposite of what a good person in general is suppose to be. Some of these women wise up, though, and realize that these bad boys are nothing more than, well, immature little boys in grown up bodies and will take the time to look for actual men. For me, personally, I'm not seeing anyone right now because I'm focusing on what I need done in my life. Although, I have a hobby I'm really getting into, and there's a lot of women that I'm becoming friends with because of the hobby that I could ask out but I'm holding off. Anyway, thanks for the conversation, brother!

Parts of our society are trying to deem masculinity as toxic. Not just criminal or exploitive behaviors. People are trying to connect masculinity with these type of behaviors.

I think masculinity is great and more guys should embrace their masculinity. The problem or society is having us abandonment of masculinity.

There are proper ways to express it.