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The ACA is here to stay.

J

James D Hill

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The days of the GOP wanting to repeal without a plan of their own is over. If they take away millions health care it would be political suicide. Now the conservatives must come to the table with a plan other than just ending the ACA. Every day thousands of people will have health care. Some for the first time and many in poor red states. Lets face it my right wing friends. You lost this battle just like you did with social security,Medicare,Medicaid and the VA.You hatred of intitlements has once again been defeated by peopoles want of intitlements. See a pattern here?
 

Funny, it's only been moderate suicide for the dems.

Actually, by election time 2014 I think folks, especially the ones you highlight, will be clamouring for Obamacare to be repealed. By then those who couldn't afford healthcare before will have had the reality check and found that it's not much different except now they have to pay for what they couldn't afford before.

Btw, you're off your nut with the VA comment. Once again with you - history fail. In fact it was Reagan that elevated the VA to cabinet status.
 

35 times more people have lost their insurance then gained it

don't say it cant be repealed I want you look up the Medicare Catastrophic Health Care Act



Why Congress Repealed the Medicare Catastrophic Health Care Act

It is never to late to repeal the train wreck Its up to the people and come 2014 when all those republicans get elected which they will with the promise of repeal and having control of the house and the senate it will be repealed or there will be hell to pay
 

moderate sucide? you need to step outside your bubble every now and then Republicans closed a 9 point gap on the generic congressional election poll and are up by 2.5 points

Generic Congressional Vote
RCP Average 11/6 - 12/1 -- 43.5 41.0 Republicans +2.5
Rasmussen Reports 11/25 - 12/1 3500 LV 43 38 Republicans +5
CNN/Opinion Research 11/18 - 11/20 749 RV 49 47 Republicans +2
FOX News 11/10 - 11/12 1006 RV 43 40 Republicans +3
Quinnipiac 11/6 - 11/11 2545 RV 39 39 Tie

RealClearPolitics - Election Other - Generic Congressional Vote

and lets not forget Obamas numbers

President Obama Job Approval
RCP Average 11/10 - 12/2 -- 39.8 55.9 -16.1

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_obama_job_approval-1044.html
 

The VA was opposed by many right wingers. It was the liberal vote that allowed ther VA that status my friend. They say Reagan would not be conservate enough for these tea bagger waco's and that is a good example.
 

They have lost. The president is here for another 3 years and by then the conservatives will not be able to take away millions insurance. I say by May the conservaives will have to find another ourage to bitch about becuse they have lost this one. Too bad sooo sad.
 

H.R. 3121. It's only been around since September
http://rsc.scalise.house.gov/uploadedfiles/bill_american_health_care_reform_act.pdf
 

While I agree that the Republicans will have to have a plan to replace the ACA, it is far cry from being here to stay. It has been in reality an uphill battle for the democrats just to get it this far. When a party passes a bill in which 53% of the American public says it doesn't want vs. only 39% in favor, that alone means they, the democrats are in for a rough time. Remember 2010, that was a result of 53% being against the ACA. Today the latest figures from RCP show 38% in favor and 57% against. You have 6 or 7 Democratic senators up for re-election running scared that the ACA will be their doom. You have 40-50 democrats in the house also running scared, so much they joined Republicans in voting to delay the implementation of the ACA for a year. Right now the ACA is hanging around the neck of the Democrats like an Albatross.

There is no way to compare the ACA to Medicare, Medicare at the time when it was passed had 61% of America for it and only 31% against it. That is a gap of 30 point in favor, not like the ACA with has a gap of 19 points against it. Read this on Medicare:

The Gallup Brain: Medicare's Early Days

But you are right in a sense a lot of what the ACA has brought forth is here to stay regardless if the law if repealed or not. One could call it a victory even in repeal for the Democrats. One thing is for sure not matter how this plays out, there is no going back to the old system. So a new law is a must and if not a new law, then the ACA needs a ton of fixing. But be careful if those 6-7 Democratic Senators along with those in the house do not call for its repeal sometime around late spring or early summer of the ACA just to protect their jobs. That is if the trend that begun on 1 NOV continues to run in the Republicans favor. Another 2010 is indeed possible, but it is too early to tell. Too much time and too many things have to happen first.
 

you don't think the American people can force a law change I want you to look up the liberty amendment federal laws can be changed or repealed and made unconstitutional at the state level with out no involvement from the federal government One man does not run the country if the people want a law repealed it can and will be repealed
 
James D Hill said:
Your hatred of entitlements has once again been defeated by peoples want of entitlements. See a pattern here?
Click to expand...

People wanting something for nothing is an old trend.

It's also fairly toxic and not exactly something to be proud of.
 

Too late my friend. If a party takes away tens of milions of insurance policies from people who have none now then heads are going to roll. Repeal is out of the queston without something to replace it. The right can no longer just root for failure without replacing it.
 
soot said:
People wanting something for nothing is an old trend.

It's also fairly toxic and not exactly something to be proud of.
Click to expand...

It is the best thing to ever happen to this country. It is time to hold the greedy and selfish accountable for selling our economy down the river. Now they have the nerve to fight against the cure for the damage thay caused.
 
When and if (and I think it will) fail under it's own weight and missed goals, the Democrats will pick the ACA apart like that Thanksgiving Turkey. Seeing them dismantle their own partisan bill will be quite the sight to see.
 
Ockham said:
When and if (and I think it will) fail under it's own weight and missed goals, the Democrats will pick the ACA apart like that Thanksgiving Turkey. Seeing them dismantle their own partisan bill will be quite the sight to see.
Click to expand...

That is not the same thing as repeal. I agree. It needs to be better but repeal is no longer possible. The ACA is here to stay.
 
James D Hill said:
That is not the same thing as repeal. I agree. It needs to be better but repeal is no longer possible. The ACA is here to stay.
Click to expand...

Technically once it's picked apart, the Democrats will repeal it themselves. However, don't discount it's removal if the GOP has a good mid term. If they gain control of the Senate and keep the House, all bets are off. However, they cannot repeal it without now replacing it with something. What that something is has yet to be revealed - but either way, the failure of the ACA will cause mass amounts of problems for tens of millions of Americans and will do Democrats no benefit.
 
I doubt the GOP has the balls to take it away, but I hope they do. The GOP does need to reign in Cruz and company right now and get them to "go along" with it all through November. That way it will all be about ofailure and his bloody care program that screwed most of America. Then his last two years in office can be really fun with overwhelming majorities in the house/senate actually putting things right against his head in the sand mentality.


 

If thwe right had came to the plate with an idea of their own and worked with the liberals then it would have been a better plan from the beginning. This repeal and nothing else attitude is going to hurt the right in the long run. I never said the ACA is perfect but it is a start. Lets fix it. Merry X-Mas my friend from the left coast.
 
James D Hill said:
It is time to hold the greedy and selfish accountable...
Click to expand...

I agree.

But I think you and I probably disagree fundamentally on exactly who the "greedy and selfish" in this country are.

I think eventually we'll hold them accountable.

I think that for now they're going to continue enjoying their parasitic drive to demand more and more from society in return for less and less.

But that's eventually going to reach a tipping point and then we're going to start shooting them in the street like the useless blights on society that they are.

I don't believe in God but in what I believe is largely and exercise in futility I pray frequently that that day comes in my lifetime.

I'm looking forward to the homeless hunt.

 

Either they need to pay more or we will take it.
 

and the same argument was used in favor of slavery how can you change a law the will crush the economy of all those slave states

and now you liberals are showing your true colors. you don't give a rats ass how bad the law was. you didn't give a dam how it negativity effected so many millions. you could not give a hoot if the web site wasn't ready. you did not care one bit if it is secure. you didn't give a frying **** how much the law cost. as long as you got your way you are no better then a spoiled child throwing a fit till you got what you wanted, but the American public isn't going to give in to your spoiled rotten ass they will spank your behind and send to bed with no dinner
 
James D Hill said:
It is the best thing to ever happen to this country. It is time to hold the greedy and selfish accountable for selling our economy down the river. Now they have the nerve to fight against the cure for the damage thay caused.
Click to expand...

and I will be the first to hold them accountable when you hold the lazy fat ass leaches sucking the teat of government dry accountable
 
James D Hill said:
Either they need to pay more or we will take it.
Click to expand...

First of all, don't kid yourself.

You aren't "taking" anything.

You're having it given to you by folks who exploit populist politics in a civil society in order to keep themselves employed.

If you were capable to taking something for yourself you wouldn't need entitlements.

But yeah.

No doubt.

Like I said, the hand outs will continue to go on for a while yet.

But the gravy train isn't going to last forever.

The civility of civil society isn't going to last forever.

It never does.

In the end y'all will still be little more than pets.

Domestic animals kept and fed and cared for by folks with money.

Folks who are fundamentally better than you.

But just like a dog that bites the hand that feeds it eventually you'll be stuffed in a burlap sack and tossed into the river.

You've got to remember that y'all will only ever have a little bit of anything.

The little bit you're given.

In the end the people with money will remain the people with money.

And money buys guns and pays the people who are willing to use them.

Some of you will put up a fight but most will have become so used to being kept that you won't know how to think or act on your own.

It'll be a slaughter.

All I'm saying is, I look forward to that day.
 
What BS. The ACA was adopted with gamesmanship with no consideration of anything the conservatives or even moderate Republicans wanted. 100% pure democratic party vote and not one Republican and don't even try to construe it as if the liberals considered anything the Republicans put up - which they have - numerous times and continue to do so today. The OFAILURE CARE ACT is 100% liberal democrat ideology which we all know is a complete and utter failure in reality.


 

You sound like someone who is not in the individual ACA market. Comfortable with a group policy that you don't have to pay much, if anything, for?

But you are right about the right wing's mistakes. From the start, they should have come to the table with a solid plan of their own to counter the other one. Ryan had something....but it was really a budget plan with some health provisions in it, and it didn't deal with the millions without health care. There were some good ideas in it, as I recall, that would have addressed cost. The Ryan plan was never a formal, official plan, either, and never proposed in Congress.

They were so focused on obstruction that they couldn't see straight. Even so, the Dems did accept a couple hundred of Republican amendments, as I recall. So the ACA was changed by the Republicans in ways, but I'm not sure how.

Now, proposing their own plan or some drastic changes to the ACA are the only ways to deal with the problem. Repeal I think is out of the question. Which is regrettable, since the ACA is harming millions of middle class people. Many will lose their insurance.

If a new plan to get health care to many results in many others losing their health care or sinking into poverty from paying significant medical bills on top of sky high premiums....is that a good plan? Does it solve the problem? Or are you saying that one group is better than the other group?

It would've been different if there were a tax on everyone to pay for the plan. But that's not the case. The cost of the plan will be borne by individuals and selected groups, unevenly, straight from their life savings or grocery budgets into the pockets of big insurance companies (which wrote parts of the law).
 

Interesting tirade. Certainly a dark fantasy that might make an interesting Hollywood script as Hollywood always as an appetite for the blood thirsty tyrant with no regard for human life that you well illustrate here. I think, however, you would re-think this if you studied world history regarding outcome of revolutions involving the economically oppressed.
 
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