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Texas school district to arm teachers with weapons

Yes, it’s always better to allow someone intent on murdering a group of people to continue their important work without interruption.

Collateral damage due to interruption by some wannabe self-styled enforcer of the law is thus justified. Gunner can say he was only trying to help and didn't mean to shoot/kill an innocent.
 
How many of those are teachers shooting students? If you’re going to be a white knight, make sure you’re arguing the correct point.

Then you need be cognizant of who's pretending to be the white knight in the case of arming the good guys. It's the armed teacher or dude in the crowded room charging with his lance on a mighty steed to rescue the fair maiden. That innocents get trampled and lanced is worth saving others. Even though "good guys" with guns stop about 3% of mass shooters vs about 13% stopped by good guys without guns.
 

Some teachers at a tiny school district in Texas are now packing heat — and educators won’t hesitate to “take out” an armed student if necessary, the superintendent said Monday.

The Grand Saline Independent School District, located about an hour east of Dallas, is now in its second week of carrying concealed guns on campus, Superintendent Micah Lewis told The Post.

“Every time there was a school shooting, me and the board talked about it again,” said Lewis. “If some crazy came in here, could we minimize the damage by being armed?”
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I again think that Taxes has a gun problem.
Worst idea ever.
 
Collateral damage due to interruption by some wannabe self-styled enforcer of the law is thus justified. Gunner can say he was only trying to help and didn't mean to shoot/kill an innocent.
So it’s better to allow a mass shooter to kill as many people as he wants than to take the risk that someone who is able to stop him might accidentally shoot an innocent bystander, even though it’s highly possible the mass shooter was going to kill them anyway? If you were in a room with a lot of people and someone started shooting, you would rather no one try to stop them, even though there is a chance someone else could get shot?
 
Then you need be cognizant of who's pretending to be the white knight in the case of arming the good guys. It's the armed teacher or dude in the crowded room charging with his lance on a mighty steed to rescue the fair maiden. That innocents get trampled and lanced is worth saving others. Even though "good guys" with guns stop about 3% of mass shooters vs about 13% stopped by good guys without guns.
No, that’s not what I’m talking about at all.
 
I'm against this, for so many reasons. But I do want to highlight a very important paragraph in the article:

"District employees who are interested in becoming guardians must apply for the program and go through a screening and training with the Texas Department of Public Safety, Lewis explained. They must complete 40 hours of training initially and additional hours on a continuous basis. The staffers must also have a license to carry."

If these conditions were required for the purchase of a gun, I believe America would have far less issues with gun violence. And then the school wouldn't feel the need to allow the teachers to walk around with a killing device on their person. So while I'm strongly against this move on a variety of levels, at least this district isn't being blatantly stupid about it and is requiring accountability (at least on the surface).

Training is key to gun safety.
 
A new Republican jobs program. Counterfeit "good guy" badges becomes a cottage industry.
;)

Anybody can wear a "badge". People walking around with badges on. I can't wait.
 
Your source literally offered NOTHING in regard to proof that an armed teacher is more likely to shoot a student than a student is likely to die from a school shooting. And where there HAVE been just over 400 accidental deaths by firearms annually nationwide in all settings, annually, there are also are annually 40,698 accidental auto deaths, 42,114 accidental deaths by falling, and 87,404 accidental deaths by poisoning.
 
statistics say that if teachers are armed, a student will be shot, either accidentally or on purpose, by another teacher


"statistics say" an armed teacher with proper firearms training will shoot and kill a crazy person who terrorizes a school with a gun.
How is that for "statistics say"?

I like that logical conclusion instead of your unsupported claim.
 
Your source literally offered NOTHING in regard to proof that an armed teacher is more likely to shoot a student than a student is likely to die from a school shooting. And where there HAVE been just over 400 accidental deaths by firearms annually nationwide in all settings, annually, there are also are annually 40,698 accidental auto deaths, 42,114 accidental deaths by falling, and 87,404 accidental deaths by poisoning.
"statistics say" an armed teacher with proper firearms training will shoot and kill a crazy person who terrorizes a school with a gun.
How is that for "statistics say"?

I like that logical conclusion instead of your unsupported claim.
The source shows that accidental discharges are much more common than intentional school shootings, which was my claim.

A single, properly trained person of sound mind is highly unlikely to shoot anyone in a school setting, whether by accident or on purpose. But put firearms into the hands of ALL teachers, and it becomes harder to ensure that each is properly trained and of sound mind. In that case you start to raise the probability of accidents without appreciably increasing the probability of them stopping a school shooting.

Armed security guards are sufficient to prevent the extremely rare occurrence of school shootings. That a few happen each year in spite of armed security guards is no reason to risk the higher probability of armed teachers accidentally shooting themselves or a student.
 
"statistics say" an armed teacher with proper firearms training will shoot and kill a crazy person who terrorizes a school with a gun.
How is that for "statistics say"?

I like that logical conclusion instead of your unsupported claim.

what statistics? the bullshit you pull out of your ass? Even trained police and military personal miss, or are too scared to engage, you think some fake rambo tough guy teach who probably would freeze or shit his pants in the event (plenty of people would so not knocking that reaction, its instinct) woudl be able to take out the shooter without killing?

Also, the odds of a school shooter are miniscule, the chance of a teacher having a gun and it going off, studetn getting a hold of it, or other issues is greater than the very slim chance there is a school shooter and the teacher can actually stop it because they had a gun
 
The source shows that accidental discharges are much more common than intentional school shootings, which was my claim.

A single, properly trained person of sound mind is highly unlikely to shoot anyone in a school setting, whether by accident or on purpose. But put firearms into the hands of ALL teachers, and it becomes harder to ensure that each is properly trained and of sound mind. In that case you start to raise the probability of accidents without appreciably increasing the probability of them stopping a school shooting.

Armed security guards are sufficient to prevent the extremely rare occurrence of school shootings. That a few happen each year in spite of armed security guards is no reason to risk the higher probability of armed teachers accidentally shooting themselves or a student.
Of course this will end poorly.

Right off the bat it’s clear that the teacher or board member who even suggested it cannot be of ‘sound mind’ or they wouldn’t have considered this.

There’ll be an accidental discharge, an overzealous educator pulling a gun on a kid; a road rage incident, a bar brawl escalation after hours, a domestic incident, or a quarrel at Walmart that goes south.

This will not end well.
 
The source shows that accidental discharges are much more common than intentional school shootings, which was my claim.

A single, properly trained person of sound mind is highly unlikely to shoot anyone in a school setting, whether by accident or on purpose. But put firearms into the hands of ALL teachers, and it becomes harder to ensure that each is properly trained and of sound mind. In that case you start to raise the probability of accidents without appreciably increasing the probability of them stopping a school shooting.

Armed security guards are sufficient to prevent the extremely rare occurrence of school shootings. That a few happen each year in spite of armed security guards is no reason to risk the higher probability of armed teachers accidentally shooting themselves or a student.
You are still fabricating arguments that arent relevant to the issue. The majority of the accidental discharges occurred with kids playing with guns and impaired adults. Not relevant to armed teachers OR school shootings.

Nor are the schools arming anyone. They arent arming teachers...they are allowing law abiding citizens to responsibly carry. And while we agree that school shootings are extraordinarily rare, the reality is that when they do occur, if no one is able to stop the shooter, the shooter is seldom stopped. On the other hand, we have several incidents of hero teachers who took on the shooters without defensive means, in order to save lives. Why you wouldnt trust people that would run unarmed into the path of danger to save lives with a firearm is beyond me. It says to me that you arent invested in whether or not the armed teachers may save lives...you are only invested in your bias against guns.
 
You are still fabricating arguments that arent relevant to the issue. The majority of the accidental discharges occurred with kids playing with guns and impaired adults. Not relevant to armed teachers OR school shootings.

Nor are the schools arming anyone. They arent arming teachers...they are allowing law abiding citizens to responsibly carry. And while we agree that school shootings are extraordinarily rare, the reality is that when they do occur, if no one is able to stop the shooter, the shooter is seldom stopped. On the other hand, we have several incidents of hero teachers who took on the shooters without defensive means, in order to save lives. Why you wouldnt trust people that would run unarmed into the path of danger to save lives with a firearm is beyond me. It says to me that you arent invested in whether or not the armed teachers may save lives...you are only invested in your bias against guns.
I'm not biased against guns. I am pro-second amendment. I am simply concerned that having firearms in schools other than those carried by trained security personnel whose job is to prevent school shootings will increase the body count rather than decrease it.

Teachers can leave their firearms in their vehicles. They are not needed inside a school with sufficient security. If security is not sufficient, then it needs to be increased. Saving money by allowing untrained teachers to carry concealed in the classroom is a recipe for disaster, and may ultimately do more damage to the second amendment when we eventually get a headline story of an armed teacher accidentally blowing the brains out of a kindergartner in the cafeteria.
 
I'm not biased against guns. I am pro-second amendment. I am simply concerned that having firearms in schools other than those carried by trained security personnel whose job is to prevent school shootings will increase the body count rather than decrease it.

Teachers can leave their firearms in their vehicles. They are not needed inside a school with sufficient security. If security is not sufficient, then it needs to be increased. Saving money by allowing untrained teachers to carry concealed in the classroom is a recipe for disaster, and may ultimately do more damage to the second amendment when we eventually get a headline story of an armed teacher accidentally blowing the brains out of a kindergartner in the cafeteria.
Law abiding citizens have been carrying concealed since the 70s. The feared "ohmigosh its going to be the wild west all over again!" scenario has never played out. There is absolutely zero reason to believe that while it doesnt happen ANYWHERE else....it WILL suddenly start happening in schools. In fact statistically...numerically...when it comes to civilian use of firearms in defense vs law enforcment use of firearms in defense, civilians have a BETTER track record.

Again...there is no discussion of schools arming teachers. This is about letting trained individuals carry armed in school. I accept you are pro 2A, but you keep citing things that have no relative bearing to this as your reasoning for fearing the policy.
 
Law abiding citizens have been carrying concealed since the 70s. The feared "ohmigosh its going to be the wild west all over again!" scenario has never played out. There is absolutely zero reason to believe that while it doesnt happen ANYWHERE else....it WILL suddenly start happening in schools. In fact statistically...numerically...when it comes to civilian use of firearms in defense vs law enforcment use of firearms in defense, civilians have a BETTER track record.

Again...there is no discussion of schools arming teachers. This is about letting trained individuals carry armed in school. I accept you are pro 2A, but you keep citing things that have no relative bearing to this as your reasoning for fearing the policy.
It does happen 'everywhere else.' Look at the statistics for accidental discharges. They happen occasionally all over the place. Everywhere there are firearms, there is the occasional accidental discharge. They just don't happen OFTEN. But they happen MUCH MORE OFTEN than school shootings.

The problem here isn't that allowing teachers to be armed in the classroom is going to turn schools into wild west Yosemite Sam shootouts. The problem is that it is purporting to solve the "problem" of children being shot at school by their classmates by technically putting them at greater risk (though not at high risk) of being shot at school. It doesn't solve the issue. It compounds it.

No, I don't expect any children to be shot at this Texas school in the next month or so. But IF a child is shot at this Texas school down the road, it is MORE LIKELY that it will be accidentally by a teacher carrying a concealed weapon than it will be by a mass murdering student targeting his classmates.
 
It does happen 'everywhere else.' Look at the statistics for accidental discharges. They happen occasionally all over the place. Everywhere there are firearms, there is the occasional accidental discharge. They just don't happen OFTEN. But they happen MUCH MORE OFTEN than school shootings.

The problem here isn't that allowing teachers to be armed in the classroom is going to turn schools into wild west Yosemite Sam shootouts. The problem is that it is purporting to solve the "problem" of children being shot at school by their classmates by technically putting them at greater risk (though not at high risk) of being shot at school. It doesn't solve the issue. It compounds it.

No, I don't expect any children to be shot at this Texas school in the next month or so. But IF a child is shot at this Texas school down the road, it is MORE LIKELY that it will be accidentally by a teacher carrying a concealed weapon than it will be by a mass murdering student targeting his classmates.
You are falling back to your accidental discharge argument which has already been shattered. Sorry...thats just not honest. You arent promoting a factual case against the policy...you are promoting your own bias.

-The rate is highest for older children to young adults, ages 10 to 29 (not the teacher demographic)
-Common circumstances include playing with the gun (28.3% of incidents), (not the teacher demographic)
-thinking the gun was unloaded (17.2%), (not the teacher demographic)
-hunting (13.8%). (not the teacher demographic)
-The victim is suspected to have consumed alcohol in nearly a quarter of the deaths and in 46.8% of deaths among those aged 20–29. (again....not the teacher demographic)
 
But put firearms into the hands of ALL teachers, and it becomes harder to ensure that each is properly trained and of sound mind. In that case you start to raise the probability of accidents without appreciably increasing the probability of them stopping a school shooting.
Perhaps you should read the linked story.
 

Some teachers at a tiny school district in Texas are now packing heat — and educators won’t hesitate to “take out” an armed student if necessary, the superintendent said Monday.

The Grand Saline Independent School District, located about an hour east of Dallas, is now in its second week of carrying concealed guns on campus, Superintendent Micah Lewis told The Post.

“Every time there was a school shooting, me and the board talked about it again,” said Lewis. “If some crazy came in here, could we minimize the damage by being armed?”
=======================================================
I again think that Taxes has a gun problem.
So sad to see what Trumpism has done to America 🇺🇸.
Why do these.... people? Want to go backwards in life?
 

Some teachers at a tiny school district in Texas are now packing heat — and educators won’t hesitate to “take out” an armed student if necessary, the superintendent said Monday.

The Grand Saline Independent School District, located about an hour east of Dallas, is now in its second week of carrying concealed guns on campus, Superintendent Micah Lewis told The Post.

“Every time there was a school shooting, me and the board talked about it again,” said Lewis. “If some crazy came in here, could we minimize the damage by being armed?”
=======================================================
I again think that Taxes has a gun problem.
This probably won't end well. Kid pulls out a plastic look alike gun and gets shot by teacher. Won't be good look. But that's Texas. I am glad I live 1500 miles from there, and won't ever move there.
 
So far? None. But statistics say that if teachers are armed, a student will be shot, either accidentally or on purpose, by another teacher before he or she will be shot by another student in a mass shooting scenario.
Which statistics 'say' that?

You should understand...that research is done by people that SUPPORT your position. They researched qualified police accidental discharges as a measure of demonstrating that its just too dangerous to have teachers armed because of the potential for accidental discharge. They studied 80 cases of law enforcement accidental discharges (including cases where the guns were drawn but the officers didnt mean to shoot...not just an accident from playing with firearms like your article suggests). 80 cases...over 20 years.

The research paper (that again....SUPPORTS your position) was written in 2013. The research points out many states have already been doing this for several years. What you ARENT finding is armed teachers shooting people. But that doesnt mean there arent a TON of articles expressing the fear that it will happen...heck...they even cite examples of shootings OCCURRING in schools....


.........by cops. Cops and armed resource officers.

Not by teachers in their day to day classrooms.

 
Oh, this is awesome.

I remember my 7th grade shop teacher, who would spend a few minutes now and again loudly imploring Jesus to strike all of his students dead, because we were little sinner bastards.

Sometimes he'd then start crying or even occasionally pass out.

This is a man that needed to be armed in a classroom full of kids.
 
Doesn't just the fact that teachers need to carry guns make you stop and think about what sort of society requires that? I imagine no one on this forum went through metal detectors, had armed guards, armed teachers, active shooter training etc when they started school. So what has gone wrong since then?
 
You are falling back to your accidental discharge argument which has already been shattered. Sorry...thats just not honest. You arent promoting a factual case against the policy...you are promoting your own bias.

-The rate is highest for older children to young adults, ages 10 to 29 (not the teacher demographic)
-Common circumstances include playing with the gun (28.3% of incidents), (not the teacher demographic)
-thinking the gun was unloaded (17.2%), (not the teacher demographic)
-hunting (13.8%). (not the teacher demographic)
-The victim is suspected to have consumed alcohol in nearly a quarter of the deaths and in 46.8% of deaths among those aged 20–29. (again....not the teacher demographic)
Be serious. The teacher demographic overlaps ALL of those categories to some degree. I suggest that it is you who is not being honest here.
 
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