Tesla Station

[MoSurveyor]

What I'm looking for is exactly that. Will the motion of Tesla becoming profitable in such short order and that their cars are leading sales of all electric cars out there... will that have them leading in developing and will they allow a standardization of batteries so that other manufacturers can use the same setup where the batteries are the same and can be mounted the same in their cars as well. Therefore be able to use their stations' battery swap and whatnot.

If Tesla does allow this, man the investment fortune to be made with them could be astronomical in that other car manufacturers would have to pay nonstop royalties to Tesla designs for using their standards.

It wouldn't last forever and Musk may not even want it that way.

Everyone was better off when VHS, CD, DVD, USB etc. standard formats were adopted. Everyone in the tech world knows this. If he created a separate company just to build standard batteries and do the battery changes - for any car - he could still make a fortune.

 

[DA60]

I really like Tesla's. The 'S" is fast, has a huge range for an electric car and that center console is just SOOOOOOO cool to me.

But, it's still too pricey to be anything more then a well off person's car right now.

Sure, they say they will make cheaper versions.

When they do AND they and still have the Tesla's fab range (or at least 100+ miles) - then I will be really impressed.

 

[Fisher]

I was thinking that if he wanted free recharges that the stations would need some offset like cooperatives with starbucks or some chain restaurant which people would visit during the 20 to 30 minute charges. The energy consumption looks to be offset by the solar production at the stations.

Investors want dividends. What Elon wants will become secondary to that pretty fast.

 

[poweRob]

Investors want dividends. What Elon wants will become secondary to that pretty fast.

I think the stations are a brilliant investment in that it completely destroys all the petro-heads' main arguments against electrics about range fears and long, delayed recharges. So I think the investment in the stations is what will ultimately increase sales. And if, because of a well laid out charging infrastructure, they just so happen to develop their batteries as the industry standard, their investors are going to be pleased as hell.

 

[Fisher]

I think the stations are a brilliant investment in that it completely destroys all the petro-heads' main arguments against electrics about range fears and long, delayed recharges. So I think the investment in the stations is what will ultimately increase sales. And if, because of a well laid out charging infrastructure, they just so happen to develop their batteries as the industry standard, their investors are going to be pleased as hell.

No they are not going to be. About the only way that would work would be if places like Walmart and Target and such started providing the recharge service for a fee. It just cannot be profitable to dump $500K in Fargo where nobody drives a Tesla on the off chance somebody from Boston decides to drive to Yellowstone.

 

[poweRob]

No they are not going to be. About the only way that would work would be if places like Walmart and Target and such started providing the recharge service for a fee. It just cannot be profitable to dump $500K in Fargo where nobody drives a Tesla on the off chance somebody from Boston decides to drive to Yellowstone.

I don't think they have any plans for 100% US coverage of charging stations. So Fargo... probably not on the list.

 

[Fisher]

I don't think they have any plans for 100% US coverage of charging stations. So Fargo... probably not on the list.

One of the articles I read on it alleged that they planned to have 90+% of the nation covered with Tesla stations by 2015. I find the idea so laughable I cannot believe any representation they make. To even try would have them on the fast-track to bankruptcy considering it is 2013 and they can only make a profit due to California subsidies.

 

[MoSurveyor]

Investors want dividends. What Elon wants will become secondary to that pretty fast.

Tell that to the shareholders of Space X.


The people backing Musk knows what he's capable of. I don't think anyone buying any kind of Musk stock is looking for a quick buck. They're looking to be part of the future.

PayPal
SpaceX
Tesla Motors
(Solar City)

 

[Fisher]

Tell that to the shareholders of Space X.


The people backing Musk knows what he's capable of. I don't think anyone buying any kind of Musk stock is looking for a quick buck. They're looking to be part of the future.

PayPal
SpaceX
Tesla Motors
(Solar City)

Ebay has owned paypal for more than a decade.

 

[MoSurveyor]

Ebay has owned paypal for more than a decade.

Musk started it and eBay paid $1.5 billion for it just a few years later. "Only" 11% (~$165M) of that went to Musk, the shareholders got the other $1.3+ billion.

 

[Fisher]

Musk started it and eBay paid $1.5 billion for it just a few years later. "Only" 11% (~$165M) of that went to Musk, the shareholders got the other $1.3+ billion.

Well, take all your savings out of the bank and cash out all your equity in your home and buy Tesla stock if you are so confident in them. Paypal was floundering when Ebay bought them. The value was when they actually fixed all the issues people were having. SpaceX was nearly bankrupt and out of Russian rockets when they finally had their successful launch. If Russia ever cuts them off, the company folds.

 

[MoSurveyor]

Well, take all your savings out of the bank and cash out all your equity in your home and buy Tesla stock if you are so confident in them. Paypal was floundering when Ebay bought them. The value was when they actually fixed all the issues people were having. SpaceX was nearly bankrupt and out of Russian rockets when they finally had their successful launch. If Russia ever cuts them off, the company folds.

If I were younger I sure as hell would.

 

[poweRob]

I'm willing to bet that they mean 90% of the population accommodated. I too think it'd be a stretch to have 90% of this county's geography covered that fast.

One of the articles I read on it alleged that they planned to have 90+% of the nation covered with Tesla stations by 2015. I find the idea so laughable I cannot believe any representation they make. To even try would have them on the fast-track to bankruptcy considering it is 2013 and they can only make a profit due to California subsidies.

 

[joko104]

So track the batteries. Derp.

Tracking the batteries changes exactly nothing nor has any relevancy to my message.

 

[joko104]

The Tesla sedan and roadster are my favorite cars.

And, considering battery technology continues to shrink in size, it has to be the future.

In addition, Tesla makes solar charging units, where you drive your car under the solar panels, plug in the hose, and the sun charges the battery pack to full-strength. You can get a solar charging unit installed in your driveway.

Absolutely clean perpetual motion.

Once again you are wrong is a very well recognized way. There is no "perpetual motion."

 

[the_recruit]

Tracking the batteries changes exactly nothing nor has any relevancy to my message.

Yes it does. Just take them out of circulation when they near the end of their lifecycle. Or put them in the bargain bin. We've already discussed this.

 

[Oozlefinch]

If they get these set up and spread out like gas stations... buh bye gas. Because I think other manufacturers will start using Tesla standards so that their battery change will work on their cars.

And at $70-90,000 for a pretty basic sedan, how many people can actually afford one of these?

More ruch limousine liberal toys that the uber rich can buy to make themselves feel good, that nobody else can afford.

Then people wonder why I dismiss most things like this that come along. I expect that within the next 10 years, I will see as many of these stations as I do Hudson dealerships.

 

[MoSurveyor]

And at $70-90,000 for a pretty basic sedan, how many people can actually afford one of these?

It is pricey but it's not like sedans in this price range are unheard of. Several companies have similar price-points and amenities.

 

[poweRob]

And at $70-90,000 for a pretty basic sedan, how many people can actually afford one of these?

More ruch limousine liberal toys that the uber rich can buy to make themselves feel good, that nobody else can afford.

Then people wonder why I dismiss most things like this that come along. I expect that within the next 10 years, I will see as many of these stations as I do Hudson dealerships.

Try evaluating the car and the company without your political glasses on for a change. How many of your "basic sedans" are rolling around with a 17" touch screen display? Or have the interior OR have the performance this car has?

 

[Oozlefinch]

It is pricey but it's not like sedans in this price range are unheard of. Several companies have similar price-points and amenities.

At this time, they are still making around 5,000 a year, and promise around 20,000 in the near future.

Sounds impressive, and that will make it twice the production run per year of the Hybrid Camry (in Australia, about equal with the Camry in the US). But the Hybrid Camry only costs around $25,000, or under 1/3 the cost of this thing. And even this higher rate of production is less then 1/5 that of the Camry in total.

And yes, sedans do run in this price range, but not many. You have to move all the way up to the top of the line Lexus Hybrid to compare in cost to this vehicle, or once again could buy 2-3 of the lower cost Lexus CT Hybrid (and notice I am sticking to the higher cost hybrids, not the less expensive ICE vehicles).

I am not saying it will not work, but this is still very much a "not ready for prime time" technology, and only time will tell if this becomes the next Prius, or the next Volt.

Try evaluating the car and the company without your political glasses on for a change. How many of your "basic sedans" are rolling around with a 17" touch screen display? Or have the interior OR have the performance this car has?

Have you even heard the latest about these "touch screens"? It was a "gee-whiz must have technology", for about 5 years. Ford and GM are already dumping them, and other companies never even adopted them. They were never a good idea, less intuitive and more prone to cause accidents because of the distraction to use them. OK, so they got a technology that is largely being replaced with good old fashioned knobs, this is good for what reason exactly?

The thing you are missing is that these things are overpriced, and have a very limited market. They might be great in the areas like San Francisco or Irvine, where status is everything and the Yuppies will eat up anything "High Tech". But the marketplace for a base sedan running at over $60,000 is largely non-existant. I see no kind of saturation in the marketplace for this, no kind of wide acceptance, it will not even be usefull in long road trips.

In short, it will be a fad for a few years, and likely that is about it. With about as many charging stations as we have seen fuel and energy sources for all of the other "alternate fuel" vehicles we have seen over the years, from CNG and Hydrogen to plug-in electric. Yea, they are here and there but that is about it.

And if you want to make a trip, better plan your route well in advance, and hope you can find places to "fuel up" on the way, or you might end up stuck in say Van Horn, and nothing left to continue on.

 

[marduc]

Now Tesla is designing charging stations where you charge for free but there is also an option to pay for an automated battery swap that changes your battery with a full charged one in about a minute and a half. Video of them changing two cars' batteries in less time than it took to fill a tank of gas on one car. Really cool. You just pull up onto a platform and stop. Just like if you were driving into a car wash.

If they get these set up and spread out like gas stations... buh bye gas. Because I think other manufacturers will start using Tesla standards so that their battery change will work on their cars.

Tesla launches battery-swapping service for two-minute recharging

All eyes have been on California-based electric car maker Tesla Motors in recent months, with the company having turned a profit last quarter and earning numerous awards for its Model S luxury sedan. And as promised, Tesla on Thursday night demonstrated an automated system capable of recharging the Model S in less than two minutes — equivalent to the time it takes to fuel up a gasoline-powered car.

And by “recharging,” we mean replacing.

As in, dropping a Model S’ depleted battery pack — which can weigh half a ton — out from the undercarriage of the vehicle and replacing it with a fully charged one. Think of it as pulling up to a filling station and instead of sticking a hose into the filler cap and refilling your empty tank, simply replacing the empty gas tank with one that’s full of gas. Only in this case, the gas station is a Tesla Station (a.k.a. a Tesla Supercharger station) and the “gas tank” weighs more than 1,000 pounds.​

Full vid at link but below is a vid from a someone in the audience at a good level to watch it happen.

​

Its about time, I have been scratching my head for a long while now wondering why a system of battery swap stations were not being considered/implemented.

 

[poweRob]

At this time, they are still making around 5,000 a year, and promise around 20,000 in the near future.

Sounds impressive, and that will make it twice the production run per year of the Hybrid Camry (in Australia, about equal with the Camry in the US). But the Hybrid Camry only costs around $25,000, or under 1/3 the cost of this thing. And even this higher rate of production is less then 1/5 that of the Camry in total.

And yes, sedans do run in this price range, but not many. You have to move all the way up to the top of the line Lexus Hybrid to compare in cost to this vehicle, or once again could buy 2-3 of the lower cost Lexus CT Hybrid (and notice I am sticking to the higher cost hybrids, not the less expensive ICE vehicles).

I am not saying it will not work, but this is still very much a "not ready for prime time" technology, and only time will tell if this becomes the next Prius, or the next Volt.



Have you even heard the latest about these "touch screens"? It was a "gee-whiz must have technology", for about 5 years. Ford and GM are already dumping them, and other companies never even adopted them. They were never a good idea, less intuitive and more prone to cause accidents because of the distraction to use them. OK, so they got a technology that is largely being replaced with good old fashioned knobs, this is good for what reason exactly?

The thing you are missing is that these things are overpriced, and have a very limited market. They might be great in the areas like San Francisco or Irvine, where status is everything and the Yuppies will eat up anything "High Tech". But the marketplace for a base sedan running at over $60,000 is largely non-existant. I see no kind of saturation in the marketplace for this, no kind of wide acceptance, it will not even be usefull in long road trips.

In short, it will be a fad for a few years, and likely that is about it. With about as many charging stations as we have seen fuel and energy sources for all of the other "alternate fuel" vehicles we have seen over the years, from CNG and Hydrogen to plug-in electric. Yea, they are here and there but that is about it.

And if you want to make a trip, better plan your route well in advance, and hope you can find places to "fuel up" on the way, or you might end up stuck in say Van Horn, and nothing left to continue on.

It's funny watching how mad you seem to be getting over this. If you don't like it, then just go about your business elsewhere whilst awaiting the death of Tesla if you like.

 

[Oozlefinch]

It's funny watching how mad you seem to be getting over this. If you don't like it, then just go about your business elsewhere whilst awaiting the death of Tesla if you like.

And this is the funny thing, I am not mad. And I am not hoping that the company fails. However, I also do not buy into the "greatest thing ever koolaid".

It is simply another overpiced nitch item for modern Yuppies with to much disposable income. And I doubt it will ever be anything more then that.

And if they get into financial problem, I also will not do more then shrug at their passing. Deloreon, Saturn, Yugo, Oldsmobile, they all faded away without much of a reaction from me, and I doubt this will be any different. Unless they get some kind of huge loan or buyout from the Government, then I will start to care big time.

 

[poweRob]

And this is the funny thing, I am not mad. And I am not hoping that the company fails. However, I also do not buy into the "greatest thing ever koolaid".

It is simply another overpiced nitch item for modern Yuppies with to much disposable income. And I doubt it will ever be anything more then that.

And if they get into financial problem, I also will not do more then shrug at their passing. Deloreon, Saturn, Yugo, Oldsmobile, they all faded away without much of a reaction from me, and I doubt this will be any different. Unless they get some kind of huge loan or buyout from the Government, then I will start to care big time.

Well here's the thing...

They DID get a giant loan from the government. A $465 million loan. I guess you don't recall Romney and Palin trashing Tesla during the campaign calling them "losers". Then Tesla started posting profits and paid off the government loan damn near immediately. All while being made in the good 'ol USA.

Also, something else you didn't know. Tesla's business model was to build the rich niche car called the Tesla Roadster for $100,000. Then used the profits from that to design the Tesla model S which is what you are calling niche and too expensive by saying it "sells for $70-90,000 for a pretty basic sedan" when it actually $62,400. Still above average but it is an above average luxury sedan. Then they come out with the Model X which is similarly prices as the Model S but it is an all-wheel-drive SUV. And from there it is perceived that they will be making a lower priced car beyond that.

Also, trash the 17" touch screen all you want, it controls almost all the car's features from it's GPS to the sun-roof to the radio... it's bad-ass.



It definitely helps to know the topic you are talking about BEFORE you start slamming it don't you think?

 

[Paratrooper]

They are a little expensive for me but I give them kudos for making an electric car that I would actually like to own/drive.