Tent Cities?

[talloulou]

What do you all think of tent cities?

In olympia we have a very small downtown. Homeless people and homeless activists have now decided that they have some right to space and thus the government should just up and give them space to create their own homeless tent city. So now smack dab in the middle of downtown Olympia we have an illegal tent city. The city council has said the homeless can not stay and the homeless and their activists have said they are not leaving. So far the city hasn't made any move to remove them.

I'm all for feeding the poor and I've given to the homeless numerous times in the past, especially in the winter. However this whole "tent city" has completely turned me off. I was, prior to this, sympathetic to the plight of the homeless. Now I'm outraged as I feel it is one thing to be charitable and a whole nother thing for charity to be demanded!

I don't know at this point who angers me more the homeless or the activists who have worked hard to bring homeless people and anyone else who wants to come party in to my city to help make their tent city bigger. They are now dancing in the streets in protest, for what I don't know. I guess they are protesting their imagined right to have free housing and land provided by the government. So now my downtown is a freaking circus.

In any event here's some background...


Tent city 'needs to leave,' Olympia official says - South Sound - The Olympian - Olympia, Washington

Top Stories | KING5.com | News for Seattle, Washington

and the blog where they post.....apparently the homeless have computers??:shock:

OlyBlog | 'We Are the Media'

I have a real problem with all this bull$hit and I am very angry that these people aren't being booted out and forced to take their tents down. Olympia is not big enough to have a "tent city." I realize other places have them but we are too small and there is no out of the way place for such a "self sustaining" tent city to exist. So it's all very in your face!

Am I wrong for being pi$$ed? Business owners were worried there was no place for these people to go to the bathroom and instead of rounding them up and telling them they can't pitch a tent in a downtown parking lot the city delivered portapotties!!!!

Am I heartless or is this ridiculous??? And what's with all the "sustainable community" crap. That to me sounds like college bull$hit and many of these so called homeless do look suspiciously like kids that should be in college. One guy interviewed on Michael Medved today says he prefers to be homeless!!!! Yet we're supposed to just up and give him some land? Aaaargh

 

[WI Crippler]

What do you all think of tent cities?

In olympia we have a very small downtown. Homeless people and homeless activists have now decided that they have some right to space and thus the government should just up and give them space to create their own homeless tent city. So now smack dab in the middle of downtown Olympia we have an illegal tent city. The city council has said the homeless can not say and the homeless and their activists have said they are not leaving.

I'm all for feeding the poor and I've given to the homeless numerous times in the past, especially in the winter. However this whole "tent city" has completely turned me off. I was, prior to this, sympathetic to the plight of the homeless. Now I'm outraged as I feel it is one thing to be charitable and whole nother thing for charity to be demanded!

I don't know at this point who angers me more the homeless or the activists who have worked hard to bring homeless people and anyone else who wants to come party in to my city to help make their tent city bigger. They are now dancing in the streets in protest, for what I don't know. I guess they are protesting there imagined right to have free housing and land provided by the government.

In any event here's some background...


Tent city 'needs to leave,' Olympia official says - South Sound - The Olympian - Olympia, Washington

Top Stories | KING5.com | News for Seattle, Washington

and the blog where they post.....apparently the homeless have computers??:shock:

OlyBlog | 'We Are the Media'

I have a real problem with all this bull$hit and I am very angry that these people aren't being booted out and forced to take their tents down. Olympia is not big enough to have a "tent city." I realize other places have them but we are too small and there is no out of the way place for such a "self sustaining" tent city to exist. So it's all very in your face!

Am I wrong for being pi$$ed? Business owners were worried there was no place for these people to go to the bathroom and instead of rounding them up and telling them they can't pitch a tent in a downtown parking lot the city delivered portapotties!!!!

Am I heartless or is this ridiculous??? And what's with all the "sustainable community" crap. That to me sounds like college bull$hit and many of these so called homeless do look suspiciously like kids that should be in college. One guy interviewed on Michael Medved today says he prefers to be homeless!!!! Yet we're supposed to just up and give him some land? Aaaargh

It is ridiculous. I feel bad for people that have struggles, but like Ronald Reagan said "It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions".

 

[ARealConservative]

f government was actually restricted to essential services, public land wouldn't exist anyway.


This is a problem created by the liberals and big government republicans. They can clean up their own mess as far as I'm concerned.

 

[WI Crippler]

f government was actually restricted to essential services, public land wouldn't exist anyway.


This is a problem created by the liberals and big government republicans. They can clean up their own mess as far as I'm concerned.

I agree, however I feel they won't want to clean it up.

 

[Just Me 2]

No one is entitled to anything in this world. You need to work for it. If people want a home get a job and work for it. No one should live off the tax payers and no one should expect things to be handed to them. It is called personal responsibility.

 

[WI Crippler]

No one is entitled to anything in this world.

My first words to my newborn son, right after they cut his umbilical cord.

"No more free meals for you mister, you are going to have to work for them now"

( just so some idiots don't think I am actually forcing labor on my child, I was referring to the fact he is going to have to make a physical effort to get the nourishment he needs, instead of having it given to him via an umbilical cord. I wouldn't usually post an explanation of a light humored joke, but I had someone criticize me when i joked about grounding my newborn for 2 weeks when he was born )

 

[Just Me 2]

My first words to my newborn son, right after they cut his umbilical cord.

"No more free meals for you mister, you are going to have to work for them now"

( just so some idiots don't think I am actually forcing labor on my child, I was referring to the fact he is going to have to make a physical effort to get the nourishment he needs, instead of having it given to him via an umbilical cord. I wouldn't usually post an explanation of a light humored joke, but I had someone criticize me when i joked about grounding my newborn for 2 weeks when he was born )

:rofl I got it, sad that you felt you had to put the explanation though.

 

[Kandahar]

What is the alternative to their tent city? They won't just disappear just because the government takes away their community.

As I understand it, they're not claiming ownership of the land. They just want to be left alone while they're on public property, just as someone sitting on a park bench (whether a panhandler or a CEO) shouldn't be bothered by the police.

I agree that they don't have any special right to the land. But that doesn't mean the government should harass them.

 

[talloulou]

What is the alternative to their tent city? They won't just disappear just because the government takes away their community.

First off you have to understand that many of our homeless are imports that actually come here from other places because of our reputation for friendliness and tolerance of the homeless. So in many ways we helped create this problem. Furthermore in order to make this "tent city" protest as big as possible they are putting out the word that many more should come and they do each day this goes on.

As I understand it, they're not claiming ownership of the land. They just want to be left alone while they're on public property, just as someone sitting on a park bench (whether a panhandler or a CEO) shouldn't be bothered by the police.

This is a hostile takeover of a downtown parking lot. They've filled the entire large parking lot (where by the way people use to be able to park....a whole nother downtown problem) with tents. You can't just demand a spot to put a tent.

I agree that they don't have any special right to the land. But that doesn't mean the government should harass them.

The government thus far has asked them to take down the tents. They said no! Who's harrassing who?:roll:

The government brought them toilets which I agree is better than having them continue to pi$$ and $hit in the streets but at what point do you finally put your foot down and stop enabling this bull$hit?

 

[Kandahar]

This is a hostile takeover of a downtown parking lot. They've filled the entire large parking lot (where by the way people use to be able to park....a whole nother downtown problem) with tents. You can't just demand a spot to put a tent.

OK, that is a bit different than a tent city in, say, a public area. If they're actually preventing people from using the land for its intended purpose, then you're right that they should be removed.

 

[talloulou]

OK, that is a bit different than a tent city in, say, a public area. If they're actually preventing people from using the land for its intended purpose, then you're right that they should be removed.

Yes the whole idea is to hold this very prominent space hostage until their demands are met. Their demands are that they are given a space somewhere in Olympia, which by the way is very small. I don't like demands and hostile takeovers.

 

[DeeJayH]

poor wording in your OP, especially in teh poll answers
but noone is entitled to more than they have earned
and there are plenty of charity orgs to help them without creatign teh blight on the community tent cities create

 

[DeeJayH]

we are having the same problem

Southpinellas: St. Petersburg tent city empties

 

[Real Korimyr #9]

The government thus far has asked them to take down the tents. They said no! Who's harrassing who?:roll:

If they have been ordered to remove their tents and refused, the government should confiscate them-- and then allow their owners to retrieve them, for free, at the Police Department with a warning.

If the tents show up again, burn them.

I believe in the right to free speech and free assembly, but it seems as though modern protestors believe these rights extend to the right to be a nuisance and prevent other people from going about their lawful business. This error in thinking must be corrected.

 

[RightinNYC]

Reading the posts there from such illustrious members as "theunabonger" really inspires sympathy for their situation.

 

[BubbaBob]

What is the alternative to their tent city?

Getting a job and quitting sucking at the government teat, perhaps?

I know, I know...it's a radical idea...

BubbaBob

 

[ashurbanipal]

For those who have advocated getting rid of the tent city:

1) I am curious to know what you would advocate if, say, 70% of all Americans were homeless? I know that's not the case, but suppose that it were--what then?

2) I am also curious to know whether any of you have ever tried to find a job (so as to be able to get out of living under a bridge or in a tent city) without an address. How did you fare?

 

[Jerry]

What do you all think of tent cities?

Sure!

First we'll zone some land for them...we'll call this zoned land "residential".

Next, housing code will require that their "tents" be made out of dimensional lumber, have plumbing, electricity, and all other relevant characteristics which fall under "habitability".

Of coarse, non of this is going to be free, so the tax payer is going to have to fork over some cash....which the state will want to make back over the course of the next few decades...so these "homeless" people are going to have to pay a funny little thing I call "rent", which, depending on how things are set up, will cover utility bills, property taxes, etc.

Now, at this point the "homeless" in these "tent" cities will have to find a way to pay their "rent", for which I have another ingenious idea I like to call a "job".

A "job" is a strange place where you go and perform a service for someone, and they give you money in exchange for that service.

Weird aye?

If the homeless wish to remain homeless, whatever, but that means by definition that they don't have a home.

 

[ARealConservative]

For those who have advocated getting rid of the tent city:

1) I am curious to know what you would advocate if, say, 70% of all Americans were homeless? I know that's not the case, but suppose that it were--what then?

America is founded on individual liberty. If 70% of American's felt government shouldn't protect individual property rights any longer, then America as we know it ceases to exist.

If 70% of American's think it is ok to squat on my property, I don't have much recourse, do I? (see progressive taxation threads as an example)

 

[Jerry]

For those who have advocated getting rid of the tent city:

1) I am curious to know what you would advocate if, say, 70% of all Americans were homeless? I know that's not the case, but suppose that it were--what then?

wtf?

2) I am also curious to know whether any of you have ever tried to find a job (so as to be able to get out of living under a bridge or in a tent city) without an address. How did you fare?

I've been homless twice and got a job both times.

The first time I just used my last address, since it was in the city, and kept my mouth shut. When I finaly had a place (I moved in with a friend) I just told my employer that I moved and gave him the new address.

The second time a local church let me use their adress since they operated a homless shelter in sevear weather. My employer looked at the adress, looked at me and said "isn't that a homless shelter", I said "yup, but that's where I sleep at night, take a shower and do my londry, so...", and he said " well, so long as you come to work clean it doesn't matter to me, your hired".

It is hard to get off the street even if your not insane or don't have a drug addiction, but those cold nights and not knowing when or where your next meal is coming are prity good motiviations for figuring the systom out and getting your act together.

My experience on the street taugt me that one only becomes homless for 2 reasons: either your a basket case or your stupid.

I was stupid.

 

[americanwoman]

I don't agree with these tent cities. I think it promotes homelessness as opposed to trying to fix the problem. People who have a low work morale will just say who cares if I get fired. I think Jerry put it best though.

Speaking of homeless rising above poverty. I just saw The pursuit of Happyness- It's based on a true story and it's inspiring to see. If you work hard in this country no matter what you are doing you can rise above the poverty level.

The trouble is people that like, who live in a tent, obviously have no determination, no motivation, and are content to live in a tent. Fine, go to some campgrounds, don't do it on public property.

 

[ashurbanipal]

America is founded on individual liberty.

At least partially, I would admit.

If 70% of American's felt government shouldn't protect individual property rights any longer, then America as we know it ceases to exist.

1) We went from liberty to property rights pretty easily, but I suppose that's not what I want to argue.

2) This doesn't answer the question. Suppose that we're still protecting property rights, but 70% of Americans are now homeless (and therefore theoretically cannot vote since they don't reside anywhere). What then? Suppose that all but one person in America were homeless. What then?

If 70% of American's think it is ok to squat on my property, I don't have much recourse, do I? (see progressive taxation threads as an example)

I suppose not, but I imagine that extending your logic here would commit you to some positions you'd find very uncomfortable.

 

[ashurbanipal]

wtf?

It's a simple question: if 70% of all Americans were homeless, what would you advocate regarding tent cities on public land? If nothing different, what if all private land were owned by one person, and everyone else in America was homeless. What then?

I've been homless twice and got a job both times.

When was this?

The first time I just used my last address, since it was in the city, and kept my mouth shut.

So you lied. A couple of points:

1) Employers often check such things these days, even for minimum wage jobs.
2) Had you been discovered, there are statutes in some states that would allow you to be prosecuted for fraud. That certainly doesn't seem like a very clean method for finding a job.

When I finaly had a place (I moved in with a friend) I just told my employer that I moved and gave him the new address.

And suppose you didn't have a friend who was able or willing to take you?

The second time a local church let me use their adress since they operated a homless shelter in sevear weather. My employer looked at the adress, looked at me and said "isn't that a homless shelter", I said "yup, but that's where I sleep at night, take a shower and do my londry, so...", and he said " well, so long as you come to work clean it doesn't matter to me, your hired".

1) So, for this to be viable, we'd just need to know whether there are enough homeless shelters in Olympia to provide the same services to all the homeless people living in the tent cities.

It is hard to get off the street even if your not insane or don't have a drug addiction, but those cold nights and not knowing when or where your next meal is coming are prity good motiviations for figuring the systom out and getting your act together.

If I were on the street, I'd be quite motivated to get somewhere else, I'd admit. I'm just not entirely sure that, despite the fact I am young, good looking, educated, articulate, strong, heatlhy, competent, and not lazy, I'd be assured of getting anywhere. That's my general beef with people who want to be too hard on the homeless; despite taking all the recommended actions, there are no guarantees they'll work.

My experience on the street taugt me that one only becomes homless for 2 reasons: either your a basket case or your stupid.

I was stupid.

1) Do you have any reason to believe that this applies to literally all homeless people?

2) Why should we wish to turn a cold shoulder on basket cases and people who may have done something stupid?

I'd be curious to know a little more about your experiences--how long were you homeless and what happened to make you homeless?

 

[ashurbanipal]

Speaking of homeless rising above poverty. I just saw The pursuit of Happyness- It's based on a true story and it's inspiring to see. If you work hard in this country no matter what you are doing you can rise above the poverty level.

One person who is able to do this is an example, but that example does not show that all people, doing the same as he did, can also acheive what he acheived. I think that for every person who gets out of poverty like this, there are a thousand others who are just as determined, just as driven, just as motivated, who never make it.

 

[Flea]

Originally Posted by ashurbanipal
For those who have advocated getting rid of the tent city:

1) I am curious to know what you would advocate if, say, 70% of all Americans were homeless? I know that's not the case, but suppose that it were--what then?

What did the American government do when unemployment went up to 25% in the 30's? It created jobs. To a degree, people want ot work and feel useful. It feels good to be needed and respected.

When 70% of Americans are homeless, I will know that marajuana has been legalized and I will move to Fiji.

Originally Posted by ashurbanipal
2) I am also curious to know whether any of you have ever tried to find a job (so as to be able to get out of living under a bridge or in a tent city) without an address. How did you fare?

Like Jerry said, if you want it and you are creative, you can make it work. We have homeless, and they just are there, everyday. I don't see any effort. Except for one guy that started a little business doing odd jobs and washing windows, he is trying and I talked to him about it.