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Teach Children Tradition Gender Roles?

Should traditional gender and marriage roles be taught in school?


  • Total voters
    51
They are children. Discipline is what the need to meet goals and challenges in life. That discipline will help the succeed and be something, "freedom" to express themselves through their clothes gets them nothing useful to their lives.

Freedom of expression through clothing and the right amount of change will get you a cup of coffee.
Discipline and the right amount education/intelligence can get you almost anything you desire in life.
What could possibly be disciplinary about wearing the same clothes? It's not discipline, it's a superfluous requirement of conformity and a desire for optimum organization. What about the families that can barely afford regular clothes, and now must purchase new school uniforms every year? I enjoy mixing and matching clothes, and I always wear something lax that's comfortable. Would a uniform be comfortable, no. You see discipline, I see organization, I see some deranged attempt to create a more egalitarian and monochromatic environment. What good is a school uniform, if kids don't receive discipline where it's most needed, at home?
 
So, the question would be do you think we should teach a class similar to what Gingrey is suggesting, promoting traditional gender roles and marriage roles?

What we need to do is teach curriculum with no deviation. Everything else should be left for the parents to decide.
 
I guess in this context 'traditional' roles means Victorian. They ain't traditional. You just have to go back a little further to discover that the nuclear family, strict male/female role delineation et al are actually far from traditional; they're rather modern ideas barely 150 years old.
 
I guess in this context 'traditional' roles means Victorian. They ain't traditional. You just have to go back a little further to discover that the nuclear family, strict male/female role delineation et al are actually far from traditional; they're rather modern ideas barely 150 years old.

I think he was probably more thinking 1950's America. Pretty similar though.
 
NO. I don't even think parents should teach traditional gender roles, much less schools. Those roles are obsolete and only deserve mention in history classes. Birth control and modern appliances and technology made them obsolete and they were never as universal as some people fantasize.

Every individual should be free to decide for themselves the roles that they will play in their lives.
 
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GOP lawmaker: Teach grade-school classes on traditional gender roles - The Hill's Blog Briefing Room



So, the question would be do you think we should teach a class similar to what Gingrey is suggesting, promoting traditional gender roles and marriage roles?

i think it's important to explain the whole spectrum without promoting any one sexual identity over the another. i asked my parents what "gay" meant when i was six, and i got a full, honest, and unbiased answer. i think that's the way to go.
 
No. I don't think we need to be teaching kids about gender roles at all, whether traditional or otherwise. And I don't think it would do anything at all to reduce the divorce rate in the country.
 
Well, no it would not be hate speech, and no one is proposing in the US what France is doing. Can we stay in the real world please?

This is the real world and the idea is spreading...

http://m.now.msn.com/school-replaces-mothers-day-fathers-day-out-of-respect-for-modern-families

You don't get it, it is hateful to use mother and father because it discriminates against those who cannot be mothers or fathers because of their orientation.

Listen, I wish this wasn't going on... What you figured those pushing for political correctness would just stop at what was reasonable??

Noooo, you don't get it, this is about telling people what is and is not ok to say or talk about.
 
This is the real world and the idea is spreading...

School replaces Mother's Day, Father's Day out of respect for modern families

You don't get it, it is hateful to use mother and father because it discriminates against those who cannot be mothers or fathers because of their orientation.

Listen, I wish this wasn't going on... What you figured those pushing for political correctness would just stop at what was reasonable??

Noooo, you don't get it, this is about telling people what is and is not ok to say or talk about.

Your story is from Canada. You keep trying and keep failing.
 
I think in RI, they cancelled the Father-Daughter dance because of political correctness. I'll try to find a link.
 
Your story is from Canada. You keep trying and keep failing.

That's fine if you don't feel the point is completely relevant, but I made the points.

First, that to teach "traditional" gender roles (mother and father) are going to wind up being considered along hate-speech because the concept detracts from those that do not conform to those traditions.

The same logic that changed "merry christmas" to "happy holidays" is going to prevail as it always seems to happen.

Then I made the points that this is going on in France and is an idea that's spreading...

What was your point again?
 
Here it is. Apparently it violates some gender discrimination law, which I find utterly ridiculous. I don't have a problem with "family dances" as suggested which would include everyone, but still to do away with the Father-Daughter Dance is kind of crappy IMO.

R.I. school: Father-daughter dance violates law - CBS News
 
What could possibly be disciplinary about wearing the same clothes? It's not discipline, it's a superfluous requirement of conformity and a desire for optimum organization. What about the families that can barely afford regular clothes, and now must purchase new school uniforms every year? I enjoy mixing and matching clothes, and I always wear something lax that's comfortable. Would a uniform be comfortable, no. You see discipline, I see organization, I see some deranged attempt to create a more egalitarian and monochromatic environment. What good is a school uniform, if kids don't receive discipline where it's most needed, at home?

It teaches them to learn and express their individuality while fitting into society, not countering society. They must learn to discipline themselves in order to do this. If they don't, you can end up with a society that puts more of it's citizens in prison than any other country in the world, say, kind of like the US today.

As for costs, perhaps you are not aware of how it works in Japan. During the school year, you see the students out in their uniforms throughout the day, not may in other clothing. It actually reduces costs this way. Also, they have limited suppliers of the uniforms with uniform quality.

Because if kids do not receive and learn discipline at home, then they need another teacher. It would be great if parents actually fulfilled their roles. But, have you seen much evidence of this being widespread in the last 50 years?
 
GOP lawmaker: Teach grade-school classes on traditional gender roles - The Hill's Blog Briefing Room



So, the question would be do you think we should teach a class similar to what Gingrey is suggesting, promoting traditional gender roles and marriage roles?


No. I think it should be taught at home. In my opinion, homosexuality is a psychological circumstance, not genetic and there are no credible papers suggesting that homosexuality is genetic. I tell my children that and suggest that they learn to tolerate homosexuals because there are a lot of them around. I don't want them in a supervisory role with my children, whether it be school, church, ag, scouts, etc. because they tend to state absolutely that gay is genetic and imply that there is nothing wrong with it. Well, I think its wrong wiring and should be acknowledged as such. That doesn't mean gays are bad, just a deviation.
 
Set aside politics for a minute...the things school systems do...like father - daughter dances being discriminatory, change Christmas to Holidays...etc. Think how a teacher or teachers who have different values, beliefs, traditions than your own...might cause a bit of confusion for your kids from teacher to teacher...and from elementary school, to middle school, and high school.

I think that parents need to ask themselves a simple question: "Do I want other people teaching my kids their values, their beliefs, their traditions.

In other words...

Should values, beliefs (religion, etc), and traditions that your families (mother's, dads, single mom's, single dad's...etc) have been carried forward by generations... that you feel is important...be minimized, criticized, or substituted with other values, beliefs, and traditions by someone that you don't have a personal relationship with?

If you kid comes home and says, "Mommy, daddy...my teacher said you are stupid people because you believe in the bible." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher said its okay for boys to kiss boys and girls to kiss girls and be in love." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher said you're going to a bad place when you die because you say the lord's name in vain." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher says that gay people are really bad and need to be put in jail." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher says Christmas is bad because people lied about Jesus being god's son. "Mommy, daddy...my friends at school said that sometimes it's okay for me to put candy in my pocket at the store and not pay for it. "Mommy, daddy...my friends at school say people who aren't our color is trying to take our country away from us."

Now take all of the examples above...and reverse their meanings. That could be possible from teacher to teacher, school level to school level.

By the time a kid gets through high school...their minds will be ****ed up as a chinese fire drill. Ooooops. I can't say "chinese fire drill". I mean "asian fire drill". Hmmmmmm, wait I can't say that either...that's being a bigot. No...it's okay as long as I don't say "slant eyed chinese or asian. Uh oh...noooo, nooo, I can't say that because my teacher said ....yadda, yadda,..

To me...that's like saying to your kid:

Go away kid...listen to your teachers and school friends...I don't have time for your nonsense!

Let the schools stick with educating your kids with things like..Washington chopped down a cherry tree. Washington's father asked him, "Son, did you chop down the cherry tree?" Washington replied, "Oh hell no, dad...I wouldn't do **** like that!"
 
I have voted no, male chauvinism (or better known was the good old times) has run it's course. Women are just as qualified to do all the things men are good at. Men should no longer be taught or be made to believe that the little woman should be home barefoot and pregnant, cleaning and cooking up a storm.

Men should work, bring home the bacon and not much more. A bit of dabbling in the yard, fixing the odd thing here and there and should not have to do any of these icky women's tasks. That is the traditional gender role and it has to end.
 
Set aside politics for a minute...the things school systems do...like father - daughter dances being discriminatory, change Christmas to Holidays...etc. Think how a teacher or teachers who have different values, beliefs, traditions than your own...might cause a bit of confusion for your kids from teacher to teacher...and from elementary school, to middle school, and high school.

I think that parents need to ask themselves a simple question: "Do I want other people teaching my kids their values, their beliefs, their traditions.

In other words...

Should values, beliefs (religion, etc), and traditions that your families (mother's, dads, single mom's, single dad's...etc) have been carried forward by generations... that you feel is important...be minimized, criticized, or substituted with other values, beliefs, and traditions by someone that you don't have a personal relationship with?

If you kid comes home and says, "Mommy, daddy...my teacher said you are stupid people because you believe in the bible." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher said its okay for boys to kiss boys and girls to kiss girls and be in love." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher said you're going to a bad place when you die because you say the lord's name in vain." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher says that gay people are really bad and need to be put in jail." "Mommy, daddy...my teacher says Christmas is bad because people lied about Jesus being god's son. "Mommy, daddy...my friends at school said that sometimes it's okay for me to put candy in my pocket at the store and not pay for it. "Mommy, daddy...my friends at school say people who aren't our color is trying to take our country away from us."

Now take all of the examples above...and reverse their meanings. That could be possible from teacher to teacher, school level to school level.

By the time a kid gets through high school...their minds will be ****ed up as a chinese fire drill. Ooooops. I can't say "chinese fire drill". I mean "asian fire drill". Hmmmmmm, wait I can't say that either...that's being a bigot. No...it's okay as long as I don't say "slant eyed chinese or asian. Uh oh...noooo, nooo, I can't say that because my teacher said ....yadda, yadda,..

To me...that's like saying to your kid:

Go away kid...listen to your teachers and school friends...I don't have time for your nonsense!

Let the schools stick with educating your kids with things like..Washington chopped down a cherry tree. Washington's father asked him, "Son, did you chop down the cherry tree?" Washington replied, "Oh hell no, dad...I wouldn't do **** like that!"

Totally agree. This is not supposed to be the role of the school.
 
Totally agree. This is not supposed to be the role of the school.

thanks, Chris...

We need to be careful who we allow to teach our children personal values, beliefs, and traditions. Kids really are gullible and vulnerable.
 
It teaches them to learn and express their individuality while fitting into society, not countering society. They must learn to discipline themselves in order to do this. If they don't, you can end up with a society that puts more of it's citizens in prison than any other country in the world, say, kind of like the US today.

As for costs, perhaps you are not aware of how it works in Japan. During the school year, you see the students out in their uniforms throughout the day, not may in other clothing. It actually reduces costs this way. Also, they have limited suppliers of the uniforms with uniform quality.

Because if kids do not receive and learn discipline at home, then they need another teacher. It would be great if parents actually fulfilled their roles. But, have you seen much evidence of this being widespread in the last 50 years?
Exactly how is wearing clothes that you find enjoyable to wear "countering society"? How does one acquire discipline if they must perform an action because the alternative is legal repercussions? I don't smoke pot, not because I'm disciplined, but because it's illegal. I don't study, not because it's illegal, but because I lack discipline. If it were illegal for me not to study, and I faced certain repercussions if I did not study, then I would study. Not because I have disciplined myself to study, but because I HAVE to study. Requiring students to wear clothes or face repercussions does nothing for discipline, it merely adds another superfluous rule that does nothing but inhibit self-expression. For some people, clothing is a PASSION, and suddenly they will be deprived of pursuing that passion because of some misguided attempt to make students more obsequious.
 
I guess I just find it sexist when an institution assumes that I'm predisposed to be a "breadwinner" and pushes me in that direction. If I was a girl, that assumes I'm predisposed to finish high school and marry my quarterback boyfriend immediately or go to college for the specific reason of finding a husband.

What would happen to girls in a classroom that purports and emphasizes "gender roles"? I'm envisioning something along the lines of lessons in etiquette, household chores, and something akin to "cotillion".

Slightly insulting.

More than slightly insulting if you ask me. Never mind the fact that traditional sexist gender roles are harmful to both men and women and cause all sorts of conflict when a person of either gender prefers not to follow the traditionalist role. They're also awfully limiting. I know many men, like you who cook, clean and are great parents, nurturing and fulfill similar "roles" that traditionally are thought of as women's roles. They find it quite insulting to have caring and nurturing children to be "women's work" and their kids are just as bright and loving and well-adjusted as kids whose dads go to work and moms stay home.
 
More than slightly insulting if you ask me. Never mind the fact that traditional sexist gender roles are harmful to both men and women and cause all sorts of conflict when a person of either gender prefers not to follow the traditionalist role. They're also awfully limiting. I know many men, like you who cook, clean and are great parents, nurturing and fulfill similar "roles" that traditionally are thought of as women's roles. They find it quite insulting to have caring and nurturing children to be "women's work" and their kids are just as bright and loving and well-adjusted as kids whose dads go to work and moms stay home.

What can I say? I'm a Renaissance Man. :D
 
I don't really think it does anymore. One of the few bright points of the two-income household that's almost necessary these days is that it unconsciously destroys these notions of gender roles. One can sit there all they want and think that your job is to go get the paycheck and the woman's role is to manage the kids and household. However, when that check you're bringing home doesn't put the bacon in the pan for her to fry, it pretty much destroys that ever-fragile psyche that thinks a man does this and a woman does that.

Beyond that, there are more and more studies that show that households with a more egalitarian view on division of labor in the home have happier marriages that last longer. Since most young people are getting married older (late 20s to mid 30s for first marriages) both men and women have established themselves professionally and work together to support the household, including domestic duties.
 
So, the question would be do you think we should teach a class similar to what Gingrey is suggesting, promoting traditional gender roles and marriage roles?

Who gets to decide what is traditional? A female principal might not be considered "traditional". Should we fire all female school administrators so that they can go home and serve their husbands and raise the kids? Not exactly sure how we are supposed to teach the differences between gender roles when very few people can seem to clearly articulate exactly what those are. Even Gingrey only insinuates that there are differences, he doesn't specifically state what those differences may be.
 
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