Tax Dollars to pay for Trayvon Martin Hoodie

[tech30528]

no, he died, and his death was ruled just.

if he lived, he would of been convicted of felony assualt and battery

Probably charged with a hate crime as well. According to the girlfriend he went back because he thought Zimmerman was gay.

 

[opendebate]

Its not an attack but an observation. How can you look at the evidence about TM and not call him out as a criminal, a thug, and one pathetic young man who ended up dead because of the way he was.

You see, I would be happy to answer your questions if I thought they were actual questions. But I have come to believe that this is really a rhetorical question. Which is just a fancy way for you to call me stupid. If I am mistaken, I apologize in advance. If you would actually like a response that you will actually listen to, let me know.

 

[opendebate]

I'm glad you realize that just calling someone prejudiced without any credibility is a bad argument. Just realize that you made it first.

Show me big talker. Show me where I was prejudice first.

 

[CalGun]

I have observed you don't want to answer the question; you simply have a conclusion in mind and the points brought up about TM don't fit that equation / conclusion so you ignore them - or seem too. Yes I am asking. Please explain:

How did TM come to be in possession of thousands of dollars worth of jewelry when searched at school, and a large screw driver at the same time?

Did TM not have a friend who was a leader in a local street gang?

Did TM not text another person about buying Glock Handgun even though he's 17 and that would be illegal?

Did TM not post about "Lean" the concoction of tea, cough syrup and candy on his facebook?

Is it respectful to say about another person "crazy aXX cracker?

Who was TM talking with on video the night of his death and the convenience store?

Did TM not post about getting "beat" in his last fight and how he'd improve next time?

Was TM not suspended from school once or more than once?

Are these indications of a problem, a person on the path to being a hoodlum, a juvenile delinquent, or I dare say - A THUG? A

All of that and I don't even bring up his actions after his words "crazy aXX cracker" that night, but please don't discredit those actions. I do believe Zimmerman, I do believe his neighbors, and I do believe those who said it was Zimmerman screaming. I personally wish Zimmerman had been a marshal arts expert and handled it, but he wasn't and handled it the only way he could. You are entitled to your opinions about that night and I'm entitled to mine; but mine have statements made under oath backing them up; yours are an opinion and it has no statements like that supporting it.

You see, I would be happy to answer your questions if I thought they were actual questions. But I have come to believe that this is really a rhetorical question. Which is just a fancy way for you to call me stupid. If I am mistaken, I apologize in advance. If you would actually like a response that you will actually listen to, let me know.

 

[opendebate]

I have observed you don't want to answer the question; you simply have a conclusion in mind and the points brought up about TM don't fit that equation / conclusion so you ignore them - or seem too. Yes I am asking. Please explain:

How did TM come to be in possession of thousands of dollars worth of jewelry when searched at school, and a large screw driver at the same time?

It was never proven that he stole the jewelry. (your logic here should be consistent. There was not enough evidence to prove Z guilty of the charges and you insist that verdict be accepted and although TM and this alleged jewelry theft never faced a trial, it was determined by the local police department that there was not enough evidence to charge him)

Did TM not have a friend who was a leader in a local street gang?

I have a friend that has been in jail, hat does not mean I am a criminal. I have a friend that cheated on her husband, but I never would. I have a friend that is gay, but I'm not. This is not about his friend. Did he have more friends that were not gang leaders? Why don't they matter.

As many gun rights advocates will tell you, owning a gun or considering purchasing one does not make you a crazy gun-slinger or an irresponsible gun owner. 17 old boys are big talkers. Besides, if owning a gun makes you and thug then by your definition GZ was a thug.

Is it respectful to say about another person "crazy aXX cracker?

TM had no obligation to be respectful to GZ and if you hold TM accountable or make assumptions about his attitudes based on the language he used that night then you must do the same with GZ. "These f---ing punks...these a**holes....

Who was TM talking with on video the night of his death and the convenience store?

How is this relevant? Do you know? Or are you speculating.

Did TM not post about getting "beat" in his last fight and how he'd improve next time?

Again, explain how this is relevant.

Was TM not suspended from school once or more than once?

Kids get suspended for lots of reasons. Good kids get suspended, not so good kids get suspended. The valedictorian of my school was suspended, was she a thug.

Are these indications of a problem, a person on the path to being a hoodlum, a juvenile delinquent, or I dare say - A THUG?

Not every kid who has problems in school ends up a hoodlum or a thug, many have problems in school, grow out of it and go on to live quite normal uneventful lives. You have no real grounds to make that assumption about how this persons life would have turned out.

Even if you are right and he was a thug or on his way to being a thug...it's irrelevant. What matters is what he was doing THAT night, what matters is what he did THAT night and what GZ did THAT night and we will never actually know.

You have sought out what you call evidence to support an opinion you already had and a judgement you already made. You can accuse me of the same but you would be mistaken and here is why, I am not screaming that an innocent angelic young boy was gunned down by an enraged racist. I am saying that none of us knows all the details of what happened that night and there are many possibilities.

 

[CalGun]

It is clear you have a made up mind, and can not process common sense. You answered each question like they were the only question and ignore the cumulation of events that make Trayvon Martin a CRIMINAL JUVENILE DELIQUIENT = THUG. You ask questions instead of answer the one's posed to you - common theme for people with their mind made up and unwilling to look at hard facts that go against them. I will forever label Trayvon Marting a THUG, a CRIMINAL, and JUVENILE DELINQUENT and its appalling our government would spend a dime putting his clothing on display in our national museum and more appalling our loser of a dictator would tell us we should "honor" such a person - I don't honor SCUM OF THE EARTH like TRAYVON MARTIN.

I have observed you don't want to answer the question; you simply have a conclusion in mind and the points brought up about TM don't fit that equation / conclusion so you ignore them - or seem too. Yes I am asking. Please explain:



It was never proven that he stole the jewelry. (your logic here should be consistent. There was not enough evidence to prove Z guilty of the charges and you insist that verdict be accepted and although TM and this alleged jewelry theft never faced a trial, it was determined by the local police department that there was not enough evidence to charge him)



I have a friend that has been in jail, hat does not mean I am a criminal. I have a friend that cheated on her husband, but I never would. I have a friend that is gay, but I'm not. This is not about his friend. Did he have more friends that were not gang leaders? Why don't they matter.

As many gun rights advocates will tell you, owning a gun or considering purchasing one does not make you a crazy gun-slinger or an irresponsible gun owner. 17 old boys are big talkers. Besides, if owning a gun makes you and thug then by your definition GZ was a thug.



TM had no obligation to be respectful to GZ and if you hold TM accountable or make assumptions about his attitudes based on the language he used that night then you must do the same with GZ. "These f---ing punks...these a**holes....



How is this relevant? Do you know? Or are you speculating.



Again, explain how this is relevant.



Kids get suspended for lots of reasons. Good kids get suspended, not so good kids get suspended. The valedictorian of my school was suspended, was she a thug.



Not every kid who has problems in school ends up a hoodlum or a thug, many have problems in school, grow out of it and go on to live quite normal uneventful lives. You have no real grounds to make that assumption about how this persons life would have turned out.

Even if you are right and he was a thug or on his way to being a thug...it's irrelevant. What matters is what he was doing THAT night, what matters is what he did THAT night and what GZ did THAT night and we will never actually know.

You have sought out what you call evidence to support an opinion you already had and a judgement you already made. You can accuse me of the same but you would be mistaken and here is why, I am not screaming that an innocent angelic young boy was gunned down by an enraged racist. I am saying that none of us knows all the details of what happened that night and there are many possibilities.

 

[Excon]

Bs! The evidence does not support such an assertion.
His coming out of hiding to approach in a hasty manner, yelling his question in an angry fashion, and immediately striking Zimmerman upon arrival, is an attack, and not SYG.
Stop with the absurd bs!

It is not an assertion, it is one of many "possible" things that may or may not have occurred that night.

Wrong.
The evidence does not support the assertion that Trayvon was standing his ground.
To suggest such, actually flies in the face of the evidence.

Bs! The evidence does not support such an assertion.
His coming out of hiding to approach in a hasty manner, yelling his question in an angry fashion, and immediately striking Zimmerman upon arrival, is an attack, and not SYG.
Stop with the absurd bs!

What you are presenting as facts a really just GZ's version of what took place. Those are not facts.

Wrong!
As I said; Stop with the absurd bs!
They are facts.
They are the facts that are even corroborated in part by, and supported by, other evidence, both eye witness as well as physical evidence.

So stop with the absurd claims.

 

[Excon]

See the problem is that Zim did have a history of racist comments.

No he doesn't.
No where is there any evidence of him saying his race was superior to others.
The real problem here is people distorting the facts of the case to say what they want it to say, and with many of them not knowing the difference between a racial and prejudicial.

Further, to say that when a person uses language describing "punks who always get away" with crimes, and decides to track someone they have profiled......and for those defenders to claim race had no part, sorry, but it stretches the truth.....a lot.

Race played a part in this, everyone has a bias, especially those wannabe cops.

Wrong! The only stretching is by those claiming racism played a roll.
Trayvon's actions played the part, not his race. His actions were suspicious which had nothing to do with his race.

Further, to say that when a person uses language describing "punks who always get away" with crimes, and decides to track someone they have profiled......and for those defenders to claim race had no part, sorry, but it stretches the truth.....a lot.

Race played a part in this, everyone has a bias, especially those wannabe cops.

Wrong!
Speaking out of frustration to what you believed the situation to be, has nothing to do with race.

Further, to say that when a person uses language describing "punks who always get away" with crimes, and decides to track someone they have profiled......and for those defenders to claim race had no part, sorry, but it stretches the truth.....a lot.

Race played a part in this, everyone has a bias, especially those wannabe cops.

As for use of language?
You should check your self and your stretching of the truth.
He was not tracking Trayvon.
Following to keep under surveillance, is not tracking.
And the profiling he did was not illegal, and was dependent on Trayvon's actions, not his race. Which means there was nothing wrong with it.

 

[American]

I guess you could call it that, because few libs pay attention in class or do their homework.

If you've paid even a lick of attention to the story then you should know Z was investigated and FBI didn't find evidence of him being racist. The finding just goes to show how the left played the race card because they didn't like the end result of the incident.

The FBI are obvious shills of the racist and gun rights nuts. :lol:

 

[blaxshep]

See the problem is that Zim did have a history of racist comments. Further, to say that when a person uses language describing "punks who always get away" with crimes, and decides to track someone they have profiled......and for those defenders to claim race had no part, sorry, but it stretches the truth.....a lot.

The ONLY racist involved was Trayvon. Zimmerman was the "Crazy CRACKER" remember?

Just imagine the racist fallout if Zimmerman had called Trayvon a crazy N-word.

You liberals are pathetic.

You what a racist is; anyone winning an argument with a liberal.

 

[ReformCollege]

Show me big talker. Show me where I was prejudice first.

Do you seriously lack 5th grade reading comprehension?

 

[opendebate]

Do you seriously lack 5th grade reading comprehension?

Is that your best answer? Trying to be a bully and show everyone how much smarter you are then me. Does that make you feel good about yourself?

 

[ReformCollege]

The same way the Bonnie & Clyde car is portrayed. The Smithsonian is non-political. What happened is historical. So, I will guess that the history of the event is what will be portrayed and its impact on society. I'm not sure why anyone feels threatened by this.

Just re-read your post. The Smithsonian does not teach history lessons. They are a museum, not a university.

True. I suppose my concern is less about the Smithsonian than it is about how this case is going to be looked back on. Just merely the fact that this is going to be considered in history is scary to me.

 

[ReformCollege]

Is that your best answer? Trying to be a bully and show everyone how much smarter you are then me. Does that make you feel good about yourself?

I'm just dumbfounded. I clearly said that you were the one who claimed someone else was prejudiced without anything to back up such a statement. I was just returning the favor. How you turned that into what you did, I don't know.

 

[Morality Games]

That is an absolutely not true statement. Z was found not guilty. He killed the other side of hte story so there was not enough evidnce for a conviction. But it was not ruled "just". where does this stuff come from. Z made a bad decision and got a kid killed and that is just?

The dark side of American culture produces awful people. Even a moral as simple and easy to appreciate as "not speaking ill of the dead" is inconceivable to them.

 

[opendebate]

I'm just dumbfounded. I clearly said that you were the one who claimed someone else was prejudiced without anything to back up such a statement. I was just returning the favor. How you turned that into what you did, I don't know.

Okay, I had to go back and look. I believe my opinion about his post is "backed up" by----

The evidence is clear that Trayvon was assaulting Zimmerman, that is all that is needed for self defense. Live like a thug, die like a thug.

The evidence in this case was anything but clear other than to people who made up there mind before anything was ever presented.

The poster does not know that this kid lived like a thug. He could have been a poser,( living in a community where you don't have credibility unless you are a hard ass that is a distinct possibility.) He knows that the defense tried to paint him like a thug but that should not be trusted anymore than the slanderous things that have been said about Zimmerman and anyone who adopts that slander as truth was predisposed to those ideas in the first place. I do not buy the slanderous things said about Zimmerman anymore than I believe the slanderous things said about TM. I believe we all have an obligation to hold ourselves to a higher standard and the dead deserve more respect than to promote things as fact about them that we really don't know. And really, those things speak to the larger context than to the case anyway.

Besides, your kinda changing the subject

 

[specklebang]

History is history no matter how any individual responds to it.

I'm pretty sure the Smithsonian has objects like whips reflecting the slavery and civil war period. Some people will smile with joy at the thought of whipping Negroes and others will be horrified. But the whip itself is a historical object and should be preserved.

I doubt the Smithsonian has any specific political agenda.

True. I suppose my concern is less about the Smithsonian than it is about how this case is going to be looked back on. Just merely the fact that this is going to be considered in history is scary to me.

 

[specklebang]

Well, I'm a retired thug but I must admit that someone following me is likely to provoke a reaction from me.

The legality of following someone has been established by decision of the court. So if you're being followed, I suggest that you run and not confront your follower.

This applies whether you are a thug or not. If you attack someone following you they are legally correct in using deadly force.

Anything else is just a philosophical issue.

Okay, I had to go back and look. I believe my opinion about his post is "backed up" by----



The evidence in this case was anything but clear other than to people who made up there mind before anything was ever presented.

The poster does not know that this kid lived like a thug. He could have been a poser,( living in a community where you don't have credibility unless you are a hard ass that is a distinct possibility.) He knows that the defense tried to paint him like a thug but that should not be trusted anymore than the slanderous things that have been said about Zimmerman and anyone who adopts that slander as truth was predisposed to those ideas in the first place. I do not buy the slanderous things said about Zimmerman anymore than I believe the slanderous things said about TM. I believe we all have an obligation to hold ourselves to a higher standard and the dead deserve more respect than to promote things as fact about them that we really don't know. And really, those things speak to the larger context than to the case anyway.

Besides, your kinda changing the subject

 

[blaxshep]

Well, I'm a retired thug but I must admit that someone following me is likely to provoke a reaction from me.

The legality of following someone has been established by decision of the court. So if you're being followed, I suggest that you run and not confront your follower.

This applies whether you are a thug or not. If you attack someone following you they are legally correct in using deadly force.

Anything else is just a philosophical issue.

No you can confront your follower, you just can't physically assault them.

 

[opendebate]

Well, I'm a retired thug but I must admit that someone following me is likely to provoke a reaction from me.

The legality of following someone has been established by decision of the court. So if you're being followed, I suggest that you run and not confront your follower.

This applies whether you are a thug or not. If you attack someone following you they are legally correct in using deadly force.

Anything else is just a philosophical issue.

I do not debate whether or not it is legal to follow someone. I do not debate whether or not jumping Z was a bad idea on TM's part and yes, he would have been best served by running home instead. But I will not make the assumption that he jumped GZ for no other reason than that he is a worthless thug who deserved to be shot and I do not believe the evidence provides any proof of who provoked whom. I believe that is now and will remain an unknown. I also believe that because it is an unknown GZ was found not guilty of manslaughter.

 

[Μολὼν λαβέ]

So you believe that racism (a prejudice based on race) was not involved in the shooting.

Thanks for the info.

Neither the FBI nor the lead investigator in the case believe Zimmerman was racist, you?

In an interview last year with two FBI agents, Chris Serino, the Sanford Police Department detective who headed the shooting probe, said that he believed that “Zimmerman’s actions were not based on Martin’s skin color.”

Lead Cop Told FBI Zimmerman Was Not A Racist | The Smoking Gun

After interviewing nearly three dozen people in the George Zimmerman murder case, the FBI found no evidence that racial bias was a motivating factor in the shooting of Trayvon Martin, records released Thursday show.

FBI records: agents found no evidence that Zimmerman was racist - Atlas Shrugs

 

[Gimmesometruth]

Neither the FBI nor the lead investigator in the case believe Zimmerman was racist, youLead Cop Told FBI Zimmerman Was Not A Racist | The Smoking Gun
FBI records: agents found no evidence that Zimmerman was racist - Atlas Shrugs

If you looked though the previously responses I would not have to tell you that it wasn't a question of motive that I raised, and all one has to do is look at Z's myspace page to see evidence of his racism.

 

[polisciguy]

Smithsonian Eyes Trayvon Martin Hoodie for Museum Exhibit - ABC News

I find this sickening and outrageous. This thug's clothing is to be put on display at our national museum
and our tax dollars going to pay for this criminals "hoodie" is pathetic. I hope someone tosses green paint
all over this one.

Probably could have been avoided if people had not been so absorbed with it. I hate the publicity cases get nowadays. Either way, so they add Trayvon's hoodie to the museum? If they do display it, it is what we deserve for becoming so nauseatingly obsessed with the case.

 

[CriticalThought]

no, he died, and his death was ruled just.

if he lived, he would of been convicted of felony assualt and battery

Zimmerman: innocent until proven guilty.

Martin: guilty until proven innocent.

Had he lived, Martin would have been presumed innocent until a jury of his peers had convicted him. He would deserve no less justice than was afforded to Zimmerman. This animosity you have toward him is unfounded, given that only he and Zimmerman know what happened that night. That gives me pause to wonder what the basis behind your animosity really is.

 

[ReformCollege]

Okay, I had to go back and look. I believe my opinion about his post is "backed up" by----



The evidence in this case was anything but clear other than to people who made up there mind before anything was ever presented.

The poster does not know that this kid lived like a thug. He could have been a poser,( living in a community where you don't have credibility unless you are a hard ass that is a distinct possibility.) He knows that the defense tried to paint him like a thug but that should not be trusted anymore than the slanderous things that have been said about Zimmerman and anyone who adopts that slander as truth was predisposed to those ideas in the first place. I do not buy the slanderous things said about Zimmerman anymore than I believe the slanderous things said about TM. I believe we all have an obligation to hold ourselves to a higher standard and the dead deserve more respect than to promote things as fact about them that we really don't know. And really, those things speak to the larger context than to the case anyway.

Besides, your kinda changing the subject

He's stating that because GZ's wasn't convicted, then TM assaulted him. Its not completely backed up by evidence since TM isn't alive to stand trial for such an accusation, but it certainly is a plausible explanation. Its difficult to quantify exactly what deserves a "thug" label, but if TM indeed did assault GZ unprovoked I certainly wouldn't consider those the actions of an angel. Just because you don't buy the argument doesn't mean you get to call him prejudiced. You don't know that he came to that conclusion due to prejudiced thinking or rational thinking, that's just your conjecture. That was all, I just get irritated when I see people throw around terms like "bigot" "prejudiced" or "racist" on a constant basis. Attack the argument, not the person behind it.