Straw stands by Muslim veil comments (1 Viewer)

[Tashah]

Oct. 6, 2006
Straw stands by Muslim veil comments
By JPost Staff and AP

Former British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw on Friday stood by comments published the previous day that he would ask Muslim women visiting his office to remove their veils, remarks that angered some Muslim groups who said such a request was disrespectful.

"If my constituents comes to me to voice a concern or to discuss a particular issue, I can communicate with them much more easily and come to a greater understanding of their problems if I can see their facial expressions," Straw told Sky News.

The Islamic Human Rights commission called Straw's comments "appalling."

Do you think Straw's veil request is disrespectful or "appalling"?

 

[Simon W. Moon]

I think I could communicate with young ladies better when they wear micro skirts and short shorts.
When women come into my office, I'm going to ask them to hike their skirts.

Their modesty is unimportant to me.


Further I think that I can communicate better with Amish folks when they dress colorfully.
So, when they come to my office I'm going to ask them to wear Hawaiian shirts.

Their religion-based convictions and conventions are just silly. There's no need to respect these corny Amish traditions.


Of the two choices, I choose 'disrespectful' rather than apalling.

 

[dsanthony]

Do you think Straw's veil request is disrespectful or "appalling"?

I think England, Europe and America have a right to defend their culture. Whether its cartoon riots or death threats against "blasphemous" writers, or simple terrorism, radical Islam has declared war against he West. Especially in Europe, muslims are threatening to become a dominant political force. IF europe is going to allow muslims to emigrate, they have a right to demand that they assimilate and accept European culture. If they want to live under muslim rules, let them go back to Syria, Saudia Arabia or whereever...

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

I think England, Europe and America have a right to defend their culture. Whether its cartoon riots or death threats against "blasphemous" writers, or simple terrorism, radical Islam has declared war against he West. Especially in Europe, muslims are threatening to become a dominant political force. IF europe is going to allow muslims to emigrate, they have a right to demand that they assimilate and accept European culture. If they want to live under muslim rules, let them go back to Syria, Saudia Arabia or whereever...

How exactly does wearing a veil warrant a defense of culture?

 

[Simon W. Moon]

IF europe is going to allow muslims to emigrate, they have a right to demand that they assimilate and accept European culture. If they want to live under muslim rules, let them go back to Syria, Saudia Arabia or whereever...

Should we send the Amish back to Switzerland for their failure to assimilate?

 

[Gardener]

He may be putting their lives in danger should they comply.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

He may be putting their lives in danger should they comply.

I guess I didn't realize women's rights in the United Kingdom were so lacking.

 

[Tashah]

Of the two choices, I choose 'disrespectful' rather than apalling.

Would it also be disrespectful to ask that a Muslim woman remove her veil for a passport photo? Just curious.

 

[Gardener]

I guess I didn't realize women's rights in the United Kingdom were so lacking.

You don't realize much, true.

 

[McTojo]

I think England, Europe and America have a right to defend their culture. Whether its cartoon riots or death threats against "blasphemous" writers, or simple terrorism, radical Islam has declared war against he West. Especially in Europe, muslims are threatening to become a dominant political force. IF europe is going to allow muslims to emigrate, they have a right to demand that they assimilate and accept European culture. If they want to live under muslim rules, let them go back to Syria, Saudia Arabia or whereever...

Ooh wee...aren't we fiesty ? Why is it only western societies have a right to defend their own culture ? You are one-sided and obtuse to say the least. Radical western imperialism has been declaring war on Islamic culture and other civilizations for centuries ! You don't go telling Jewish Rabbi's in France and England to cut their beards off or French men to take a showers, do you ? Where is your cultural authority now ?

 

[Tashah]

You don't go telling Jewish Rabbi's in France and England to cut their beards off or French men to take a showers, do you ?

Straw never requested Muslim men or any male visitors to shave their beards. Nor did he ask Muslim women to expose their hair. On the whole, I don't think his simple request was either outrageous or disrespectful in any way.

 

[McTojo]

Straw never requested Muslim men or any male visitors to shave their beards. Nor did he ask Muslim women to expose their hair. On the whole, I don't think his simple request was either outrageous or disrespectful in any way.

Straw is asking that Muslim women refrain from wearing their shawls when visiting his office. This is no different then if he were to ask a clergy man to shave his beard or leave his bible at home when visiting him. It's a shawl. Some muslim women wear them for religious reasons.

 

[Tashah]

Straw is asking that Muslim women refrain from wearing their shawls when visiting his office. This is no different then if he were to ask a clergy man to shave his beard or leave his bible at home when visiting him. It's a shawl. Some muslim women wear them for religious reasons.

Perhaps you didn't read the entire story, or didn't comprehend it. Straw did not ask Muslim women to expose their hair. He merely asked them to release one side of their veil so he could read their facial expressions.

A veil is not the same as a hijab, and one does not have to remove the hijab to adjust the veil. Perhaps instead of smelling school seats, you should brush up on Muslim female clothing and accessories.

 

[McTojo]

Perhaps you didn't read the entire story, or didn't comprehend it. Straw did not ask Muslim women to expose their hair. He merely asked them to release one side of their veil so he could read their facial expressions.

A veil is not the same as a hijab, and one does not have to remove the hijab to adjust the veil. Perhaps instead of smelling school seats, you should brush up on Muslim female clothing and accessories.

Who said anything about exposing their hair ??? I mentioned their shawl or whatever terms you used. Hijab or Veil makes no difference. The fact that he asked them to remove or adjust in some way is ludricous. Smelling school seats is a lot better than kissing up to Straw. Maybe you need a new hobby.

 

[Tashah]

Who said anything about exposing their hair ??? I mentioned their shawl or whatever terms you used. Hijab or Veil makes no difference. The fact that he asked them to remove or adjust in some way is ludricous. Smelling school seats is a lot better than kissing up to Straw. Maybe you need a new hobby.

Maybe you need an attitude adjustment.

 

[Gardener]

Maybe you need an attitude adjustment.

If there were a commom element to his weird little hobby of smelling seats and his support for the veiling of women, it would be in the sexist and demeaning attitude he displays towards women.

that you are a strong woman standing up to him and neither a giggling school girl object of his desires nor one who has accepted their fate as second class chatal must annoy him to no end.

 

[McTojo]

If there were a commom element to his weird little hobby of smelling seats and his support for the veiling of women, it would be in the sexist and demeaning attitude he displays towards women.

that you are a strong woman standing up to him and neither a giggling school girl object of his desires nor one who has accepted their fate as second class chatal must annoy him to no end.

Sexist and demeaning attitude towards women ? Seat pwanfing is the highest compliment a man can pay to a woman from a canine point of view.
Don't misunderstand me. I am a Japanese nationalist who loves women.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

You don't realize much, true.

Let us both end this immaturity. I realize my comment was full of a smart-*** type of tone, but I did so because I felt like your previous comment was filled with prejudice rather than some sort insightful or witty social commentary. As a knee jerk reaction I resorted to sarcasm and for that I apologize.

My point is...

Women in the United Kingdom have rights. You insist that their lives would be in danger by taking off a veil, and that's kind of silly. These women weren't bought at the corner market, they chose the husband that they are with, and their aren't a whole lot of women in western societies, Muslim or otherwise that are going to marry a man who is so jealous as to call down the wrath of a God that probably has better things to do because someone saw his wife's nose.

 

[Gardener]

Let us both end this immaturity. I realize my comment was full of a smart-*** type of tone, but I did so because I felt like your previous comment was filled with prejudice rather than some sort insightful or witty social commentary. As a knee jerk reaction I resorted to sarcasm and for that I apologize.

My point is...

Women in the United Kingdom have rights. You insist that their lives would be in danger by taking off a veil, and that's kind of silly. These women weren't bought at the corner market, they chose the husband that they are with, and their aren't a whole lot of women in western societies, Muslim or otherwise that are going to marry a man who is so jealous as to call down the wrath of a God that probably has better things to do because someone saw his wife's nose.

I accept your apology, but I really think you should familiarize yourself with the practice of honor killings and how they have now extended into Western Europe. Police estimates in Great Britain place the number at somewhere in excess of 100 Muslim women now killed for "honor" in Great Britain, and so I do not consider this a "silly" notion at all. Far from it, as it represents the ultimate abridgement of human rights and arises from the very group of men who demand their women remain veiled as a sign of male control.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

I accept your apology, but I really think you should familiarize yourself with the practice of honor killings and how they have now extended into Western Europe. Police estimates in Great Britain place the number at somewhere in excess of 100 Muslim women now killed for "honor" in Great Britain, and so I do not consider this a "silly" notion at all. Far from it, as it represents the ultimate abridgement of human rights and arises from the very group of men who demand their women remain veiled as a sign of male control.

First of all "honor killings" are not a Muslim tradition or an Islamic tenet, they are a South Asian tradition normally associated with various tribes. This is mostly in Pakistan. Second of all women are generally not killed for their veil practices, but for sex before or outside of marriage and/or getting pregnant out of wedlock. This is a tribal tradition associated with giving away virgin brides, dowries, etc.

Try as I might I couldn't find your statistic, but supposing it is true, this is not a Muslim tradition or practice.

 

[dsanthony]

Should we send the Amish back to Switzerland for their failure to assimilate?

There have been no Amish bombings I'm aware of. And Amish are not demanding changes to laws and popular culture to accomodate their beliefs.

We're in a battle of civilizations. I've made several posts about how the US and Europe are losing that battle. Europe has 2000 years of history and culture, and they have a right to preserve that culture. I think the immigration of Muslims will be sharply curtailed soon (at least I hope).

Your knee jerk liberal answers have no weight. Cultures battle continually through history. When people like you have control over western culture, it will cease to exist.

 

[Gardener]

First of all "honor killings" are not a Muslim tradition or an Islamic tenet, they are a South Asian tradition normally associated with various tribes. This is mostly in Pakistan. Second of all women are generally not killed for their veil practices, but for sex before or outside of marriage and/or getting pregnant out of wedlock. This is a tribal tradition associated with giving away virgin brides, dowries, etc.

Try as I might I couldn't find your statistic, but supposing it is true, this is not a Muslim tradition or practice.

Heck,all you have to do is google up the words "honor" "Killing" and "Britain".

That shouldn't be too hard.

And as far as your assertions as to where and under what conditions it is practiced, you are dead wrong. The very highlevel of honor killing among Palestinians testifies to that.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

And as far as your assertions as to where and under what conditions it is practiced, you are dead wrong. The very highlevel of honor killing among Palestinians testifies to that.

I don't think I'm "dead wrong," but I was able to substantiate this, though even these websites they admitted that they were not Islamic practices and not related to dress code.

 

[dsanthony]

I don't think I'm "dead wrong," but I was able to substantiate this, though even these websites they admitted that they were not Islamic practices and not related to dress code.

Gandhi? It's easy to be a "holy man" when you have no power. He unleashed a civil war between muslims and hindus which killed thousands. Like MLK, his sexual deviancy was covered up during his life. He was a hack.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Gandhi? It's easy to be a "holy man" when you have no power. He unleashed a civil war between muslims and hindus which killed thousands. Like MLK, his sexual deviancy was covered up during his life. He was a hack.

This thread isn't about Gandhi, but based on your comments I can tell you're an ***. Start a thread on Mr. Gandhi if you insist on the subject.