Some Racist whiteguy think Hitler is an civil right leader

[Tucker Case]

Im not wining bitching or complaining, Im only asking for things to be equal.

How is rejecting the existence of their culture and trying to get them to adopt yours equal?

no more racist "African-American", no more Affirmative Action. No more focus on one group's racist acts while ignoring the others. No more excusing racism because, "They were so oppressed for so long, we understand."
No more generalizations that all blacks are poor, uneducated morons. No more generalizations that all whites live privleged lives. No more generalizations that all hispanics are illegal immigrants.

I don't think anyone would disagree with these things.

 

[Southern Man]

As I stated, there are some similarities. However that does not mean they are the same ideology. So far, you have only shown that they are similar. Now you have to show that they are equivelent.

That's not my goal. My goal is to show that they are largely similar at the core, which they are.

 

[Southern Man]

Well then please link to them.

Post 11, dude.

 

[Slartibartfast]

That's not my goal. My goal is to show that they are largely similar at the core, which they are.

Than you have achieved you goal, but ultimately it is meaningless since all ideologies have similarities.

 

[Gardener]

and some thoroughly deluded individuals think the racist, Islamist thugs who attacked the IDF while pulling a publicity stunt are "humanitarians".

Go figure.

 

[Southern Man]

Than you have achieved you goal, but ultimately it is meaningless since all ideologies have similarities.

In this case there are many.

 

[Slartibartfast]

In this case there are many.

There are many similarities to capitalism as well.

 

[Southern Man]

There are many similarities to capitalism as well.

Cite some examples.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Cite some examples.

1. Anti-union sentiment
2. Private ownership and property
3. High involvement of corporations in government decision making
4. Acceptance of different social classes as a part of the economy
5. The belief that the successful should guide society (social darwinism)
6. The use of a market economy
7. A history of deregulation
8. A history of tax reduction

 

[Southern Man]

1. Anti-union sentiment
2. Private ownership and property
3. High involvement of corporations in government decision making
4. Acceptance of different social classes as a part of the economy
5. The belief that the successful should guide society (social darwinism)
6. The use of a market economy
7. A history of deregulation
8. A history of tax reduction

Several of those appear to be the exact opposite of the Nazi platform. Which ones are you against?

 

[Slartibartfast]

Several of those appear to be the exact opposite of the Nazi platform. Which ones are you against?

Naziism isn't the only incarnation of fascism. I took a look at Spain, Italy, and Germany to come up with a common list of things. But that ultimately supports my point. Fascism is a bit of a nebulus ideology and its economic policy tends to be more pragmatic than ideological. So at times it can go socialist or capitalist, as needed for the good of the state. Also, it means every incarnation of fascism will look a little different.

Personally, 1 and 3 as a general rule. For #1, I strongly support people's right to organize and for #3 I think the government and businesses should have a large firewall between them. The rest I may be for or against depending on circumstances and my best judgement of what good or harm a particular policy will do.

 

[Southern Man]

Naziism isn't the only incarnation of fascism. I took a look at Spain, Italy, and Germany to come up with a common list of things. But that ultimately supports my point. Fascism is a bit of a nebulus ideology and its economic policy tends to be more pragmatic than ideological. So at times it can go socialist or capitalist, as needed for the good of the state. Also, it means every incarnation of fascism will look a little different.

Personally, 1 and 3 as a general rule. For #1, I strongly support people's right to organize and for #3 I think the government and businesses should have a large firewall between them. The rest I may be for or against depending on circumstances and my best judgement of what good or harm a particular policy will do.

That's all great, Meg, but here we're talking specifically about the 1920 Nazi platform and how much it has in common with the modern Democrat Party platform.

With regards to "high involvement of corporations in government decision making", that is largely a straw-man on your part. No one advocates the wolf guarding the hen house, not when either Party does it. But it is unwise not to listen to industry when regulating industry.

 

[Slartibartfast]

That's all great, Meg, but here we're talking specifically about the 1920 Nazi platform and how much it has in common with the modern Democrat Party platform.

With regards to "high involvement of corporations in government decision making", that is largely a straw-man on your part. No one advocates the wolf guarding the hen house, not when either Party does it. But it is unwise not to listen to industry when regulating industry.

Don't assume I am not angry at the democrats for this as well. Wrong is wrong, no matter who does it.

Also, I disagree that it is not relevent. It is because, the nazis were primarily a fascist government, which is a point I made in a post I previously made. While there were some policies that are similar, they would have been nazis with or without the policies. This stems off the point I made two posts up. Sure there were some similarities, but don't think for a moment that they were a core piece of the fascist ideology.

 

[Southern Man]

Don't assume I am not angry at the democrats for this as well. Wrong is wrong, no matter who does it.

Also, I disagree that it is not relevent. It is because, the nazis were primarily a fascist government, which is a point I made in a post I previously made. While there were some policies that are similar, they would have been nazis with or without the policies. This stems off the point I made two posts up. Sure there were some similarities, but don't think for a moment that they were a core piece of the fascist ideology.

The Nazis gained power by using these policies, just like the Democrat Party. One more reason to despise the treasonous Democrat Party. Learn from history or repeat its failures.

 

[Slartibartfast]

The Nazis gained power by using these policies, just like the Democrat Party. One more reason to despise the treasonous Democrat Party. Learn from history or repeat its failures.

As I previosuly stated. Fascism (and naziism) take from the right and left as needed. I can just as easily say that they used capitalist policies to gain power as well. Ultimately, when you look at certain policies in isolation and decide that because there is some commonality than the evils of one must mean that there are evil in the other, you are doing yourself a disservice and are taking a logical shortcut. Which is what I believe that you are doing in this instance. The best thing to do is to look at socialism and naziism as a whole, including the things that are similar and dissimilar and make a fair analysis of everything and not just a subset of the policies.

 

[Southern Man]

As I previosuly stated. Fascism (and naziism) take from the right and left as needed. I can just as easily say that they used capitalist policies to gain power as well. Ultimately, when you look at certain policies in isolation and decide that because there is some commonality than the evils of one must mean that there are evil in the other, you are doing yourself a disservice and are taking a logical shortcut. Which is what I believe that you are doing in this instance. The best thing to do is to look at socialism and naziism as a whole, including the things that are similar and dissimilar and make a fair analysis of everything and not just a subset of the policies.

But, again, there are many more commonalities between 1920's Nazis and the Modern Democrat Party than the GOP, especially when you remove the obvious historical references from the 1920 platform.

 

[Slartibartfast]

But, again, there are many more commonalities between 1920's Nazis and the Modern Democrat Party than the GOP, especially when you remove the obvious historical references from the 1920 platform.

And even if there are MANY (which I do not doubt) more commonalities, it does not mean that they are the same or even similar when you look at the whole thing. The very fact that the stated goals of the nazis and modern democrats are completely different is enough to say that they are different and should be look on that way.

One small example I can think of is that Howard Dean and Obama are not advocating taking over other countries and killing off millions to make "elbow room" (from Mein Kampf) for a particular group of people. Another difference is that I don't believe that the Democrats are all the interested in world conquest or a 1000 year reign. They just want fair wages and health care.

 

[Southern Man]

And even if there are MANY (which I do not doubt) more commonalities, it does not mean that they are the same or even similar when you look at the whole thing. The very fact that the stated goals of the nazis and modern democrats are completely different is enough to say that they are different and should be look on that way.

One small example I can think of is that Howard Dean and Obama are not advocating taking over other countries and killing off millions to make "elbow room" (from Mein Kampf) for a particular group of people.

"Stated goals." This is where you are wrong. You can rarely tell true intentions of evil by their "stated goals". Where in the 1920 Nazi platform does it say that they want to exterminate Jews and take over the world? Nor is that the true goal of the Democrat Party, which is to turn the USA into a socialist state like Europe.

 

[Slartibartfast]

"Stated goals." This is where you are wrong. You can rarely tell true intentions of evil by their "stated goals". Where in the 1920 Nazi platform does it say that they want to exterminate Jews and take over the world? Nor is that the true goal of the Democrat Party, which is to turn the USA into a socialist state like Europe.

Mein Kampf, which was a very popular book which was authored by the leader of the Nazi party and was basically the Nazi bible. So, yeah, the goal was very much stated.

The Democratic party is made up of different elements from the blue dogs to people who are very socialist. This is a dissimilarity to the Nazi party, which was much more uniform in ideology. At best, because of the different factions in the Democratic party, the stated goals are the party platforms. However, there are elements within it that do oppose a European style system and there are those who are for it.

Can you support your assertion about the goal of the democratic party?

 

[Southern Man]

Mein Kampf, which was a very popular book which was authored by the leader of the Nazi party and was basically the Nazi bible. So, yeah, the goal was very much stated.

The Democratic party is made up of different elements from the blue dogs to people who are very socialist. This is a dissimilarity to the Nazi party, which was much more uniform in ideology. At best, because of the different factions in the Democratic party, the stated goals are the party platforms. However, there are elements within it that do oppose a European style system and there are those who are for it.

Can you support your assertion about the goal of the democratic party?

Absolutely. Look at the college writings of Obama- oops, he's got those hidden from us. Well, then look at the writings of his associates: Frank Marshall Davis, William Ayers, Carl Davidson, and others.

Obama’s Communist Mentor

 

[Slartibartfast]

Absolutely. Look at the college writings of Obama- oops, he's got those hidden from us. Well, then look at the writings of his associates: Frank Marshall Davis, William Ayers, Carl Davidson, and others.

Obama’s Communist Mentor

Except for the fact that the Democratic party is not solely Obama's to control. If you wish to continue to push your assertion, you would have to account for all factions (including the centrists and mild conservatives in the party, such as the blue dogs), not merely the president.

Do you understand the difference between how the democratic and nazi parties function?

 

[Southern Man]

Except for the fact that the Democratic party is not solely Obama's to control. If you wish to continue to push your assertion, you would have to account for all factions (including the centrists and mild conservatives in the party, such as the blue dogs), not merely the president.

Do you understand the difference between how the democratic and nazi parties function?

He's the leader of the Democrat Party, and has enjoyed lock-step support from Democratics in Congress.

 

[Slartibartfast]

He's the leader of the Democrat Party, and has enjoyed lock-step support from Democratics in Congress.

Then you were not paying attention to all the negotiation necessary to pass various controversial laws lately. I would contrast this pretty heavily with the relationship Bush had with the Republican congress, which would be an example of lock-step support.

As I stated, the Democratic party is made up of multiple factions, the length of time it took to pass health care is pretty good proof of this assertion.

 

[Southern Man]

Then you were not paying attention to all the negotiation necessary to pass various controversial laws lately. I would contrast this pretty heavily with the relationship Bush had with the Republican congress, which would be an example of lock-step support.

As I stated, the Democratic party is made up of multiple factions, the length of time it took to pass health care is pretty good proof of this assertion.

The only different factions of the Democrat Party are those who have to face a re-election in a contested seat, thus hold out for more pork. In the end all the Democratics voted lock-step for the issues that Obama, Dear Leader, held dear.

 

[Slartibartfast]

The only different factions of the Democrat Party are those who have to face a re-election in a contested seat, thus hold out for more pork. In the end all the Democratics voted lock-step for the issues that Obama, Dear Leader, held dear.

That is not true. There were many Nay votes for that piece of legislation. http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2009/roll887.xml

Besides, you just supported my point and admitted to the existence of those factions.

Anyway, is there any point to this anymore, given the fact that you have been reduced to conspiracy theories (bill ayers) and outright lies (lock-step support)?