Socialism = Fascism

[Kelzie]

Ya Clinton didn't pay off sh!t it was the conservative policies of the House and the fact of the matter is that the deficit was still 6trillion dollars when Clinton left office.



Trickle up economics is flawed and has been proven so by the recession following the Clinton administration.

And stop using the wrong terminology. The debt might have been 6 trillion ( not much he can do about that when he has to turn the entire budget around) but the deficit was not.

 

[Kelzie]

And so is Socialism in all its forms, that's why I'm pro total deregulation of the economy, how about no taxes on anyone?

Howbout you go live up in the mountains and leave the rest of the people who want to live in a society alone?

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

Ya Clinton didn't pay off sh!t it was the conservative policies of the House and the fact of the matter is that the deficit was still 6trillion dollars when Clinton left office.

Prove it.

Trickle up economics is flawed and has been proven so by the recession following the Clinton administration.

Trickle down is even more flawed and has been proven so by the enormous recession following the Reagan administration which took 2 presidents and 2 tax hikes to pay off and stabalize. You can't possibly gauge the effect off the tax hikes after an event like 9/11. The recession was primarily caused by events and fluctuations out of Clinton's control ie the dotcom burst, the Enron scandal, the mergings, the outsourcing, 9/11, individual debt is at a reccord high, and Bush's fiscal irresponsibility.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

And stop using the wrong terminology. The debt might have been 6 trillion ( not much he can do about that when he has to turn the entire budget around) but the deficit was not.

He's the one who said that Clinton payed off the national debt.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Howbout you go live up in the mountains and leave the rest of the people who want to live in a society alone?

How about you go live in a Commune and grow soy plants . . . god damn hippy.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Prove it.

It's the accepted reality.

Trickle down is even more flawed and has been proven so by the enormous recession following the Reagan administration which took 2 presidents and 2 tax hikes to pay off and stabalize. You can't possibly gauge the effect off the tax hikes after an event like 9/11. The recession was primarily caused by events and fluctuations out of Clinton's control ie the dotcom burst, the Enron scandal, the mergings, the outsourcing, 9/11, individual debt is at a reccord high, and Bush's fiscal irresponsibility.

lmfao if there's a recession during the Clinton administration following the Reagan administration its Reagans fault but if there's a recession in the Bush administration following the Clinton administration then it's still Bush's fault.

That's the whole problem with liberals they never take responsibility for anything.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

It's the accepted reality.

If you can't provide proof then retract the statement.

lmfao if there's a recession during the Clinton administration following the Reagan administration its Reagans fault but if there's a recession in the Bush administration following the Clinton administration then it's still Bush's fault.

Nothing happened in the Clinton administration that would have caused a recession.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

If you can't provide proof then retract the statement.

No, it's the truth it was the fiscal conservancy of the Republican Congress that led to the surplus.

Nothing happened in the Clinton administration that would have caused a recession.

enn wrong, excessive taxation always leads to recession.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

No, it's the truth it was the fiscal conservancy of the Republican Congress that led to the surplus.

Thats not true. Clinton had to fight tooth and nail to keep the tax hike in the bill.

enn wrong, excessive taxation always leads to recession.

Prove it. Raising taxes is what brought us out of the Reagan recession. The only reason it might lead to another recession is if taxes remain high on all income brackets after the debt is payed off and the recession is over.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Thats not true. Clinton had to fight tooth and nail to keep the tax hike in the bill.

Ya and it took the Republican Congress from stopping him from spending the peoples money like a drunken sailor.

Prove it. Raising taxes is what brought us out of the Reagan recession. The only reason it might lead to another recession is if taxes remain high on all income brackets after the debt is payed off and the recession is over.

Increased taxation creates stagnation which creates recession.

Every tax and spend liberal administration has been followed by recession.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

Ya and it took the Republican Congress from stopping him from spending the peoples money like a drunken sailor.

ROFL. Why don't you remind everyone here how many times the Shrub has asked Congress to increase the budget, how much the republicans have already spent, and how the republicans had to raise the budget again to avoid going into default for the first time in history.

Increased taxation creates stagnation which creates recession.

Only if the tax on the lower income bracket remains increased.

Every tax and spend liberal administration has been followed by recession.

Every spend as much as you can as fast as you can without any means to pay for it republican administration has been followed by a recession which takes a decade to recover from.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

ROFL. Why don't you remind everyone here how many times the Shrub has asked Congress to increase the budget, how much the republicans have already spent, and how the republicans had to raise the budget again to avoid going into default for the first time in history.

Umm maybe because there's a war on???

Only if the tax on the lower income bracket remains increased.

As it was under Clinton.

Every spend as much as you can as fast as you can without any means to pay for it republican administration has been followed by a recession which takes a decade to recover from.

Oh I see now you're psychic.

 

[GarzaUK]

Tell that to the Northern Irish. And like I said their economy went belly up in 2002 and has rebounded only thanks to Privatization and their cuts in corporate taxation.

Hmm I'm Northern Irish and we are far better of than our Southern counterparts. Higher wages, more benefits. Belfast is the second safest city in the EU.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Hmm I'm Northern Irish and we are far better of than our Southern counterparts. Higher wages, more benefits. Belfast is the second safest city in the EU.

Tell that to the Catholic Northern Irish . . . ****in Protestants.

 

[GarzaUK]

Tell that to the Catholic Northern Irish . . . ****in Protestants.

Hmm funny most of my friends in Belfast are Irish Catholics, in fact I've lived with Irish Catholics in the last few years. I never heard them complaining about living in Northern Ireland, in fact one of them is a "westbrit" - and Irish catholic who wants NI to be in the UK.
Maybe they were treated like secong class citizens... 30 years ago. but it's all equal now.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Hmm funny most of my friends in Belfast are Irish Catholics, in fact I've lived with Irish Catholics in the last few years. I never heard them complaining about living in Northern Ireland, in fact one of them is a "westbrit" - and Irish catholic who wants NI to be in the UK.
Maybe they were treated like secong class citizens... 30 years ago. but it's all equal now.

Enh, I'm a sinn fein kind of Irishmen, won't be cow towin ta ya no more Englishmen.

 

[GarzaUK]

Enh, I'm a sinn fein kind of Irishmen, won't be cow towin ta ya no more Englishmen.

Sinn Fein? lol Sinn Fein don't even want a United Ireland. They will lose power in the North if there ever was one. Of course they act like they do, because they have to appeal to the romanticism that comes with a United Ireland. I think most catholics would be statisfied living in an equal Northern Ireland in the UK.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Sinn Fein? lol Sinn Fein don't even want a United Ireland. They will lose power in the North if there ever was one. Of course they act like they do, because they have to appeal to the romanticism that comes with a United Ireland. I think most catholics would be statisfied living in an equal Northern Ireland in the UK.

pfft, I wasn't aware that you red coats had freedom of religion, with your Church of England horseshit so that King tyrant Henry or whatever the **** his name was could divorce or behead his wives.

 

[mixedmedia]

pfft, I wasn't aware that you red coats had freedom of religion, with your Church of England horseshit so that King tyrant Henry or whatever the **** his name was could divorce or behead his wives.

/mod mode/
I think you know this sort of "debate" is quite inappropriate up here Trajan. Cool it! If you can't stay on topic then maybe you need to take a minute to meditate and refocus your attention on the subject being debated.
/mod mode/

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

/mod mode/
I think you know this sort of "debate" is quite inappropriate up here Trajan. Cool it! If you can't stay on topic then maybe you need to take a minute to meditate and refocus your attention on the subject being debated.
/mod mode/

Ya but I started this thread so if I want to bash on red coats why not?

And all I ever hear out of this guy are anti-Bush/anti-U.S. montras so what, is Britian not also fair game?

 

[The Real McCoy]

Prove it.

You mean you're unaware of this?

http://www.publicdebt.treas.gov/opd/opdhisto4.htm

Trickle down is even more flawed and has been proven so by the enormous recession following the Reagan administration which took 2 presidents and 2 tax hikes to pay off and stabalize.

We've had recessions after tax cuts AND tax hikes. This proves nothing.

You can't possibly gauge the effect off the tax hikes after an event like 9/11.

Well, since the recession began before 9/11, I'd say you can.

The recession was primarily caused by events and fluctuations out of Clinton's control ie the dotcom burst

The .com/PC revolution was a primary cause of the economic boom of the 90s that Clinton had the luxury of presiding over.

the outsourcing

Yet unemployment continues to drop.

9/11

Yea, during a recession too. That really would have been an economic catastrophe had it not been for the tax cuts.

individual debt is at a reccord high

So is the price of a hershey bar. That's called inflation.

and Bush's fiscal irresponsibility.

Blaming Bush for a recession he inherited... nice. I would expect nothing less from a liberal.

 

[LeftyHenry]

You mean you're unaware of this?

http://www.publicdebt.treas.gov/opd/opdhisto4.htm

Wow it's worse than Reagan now.

We've had recessions after tax cuts AND tax hikes. This proves nothing.

When with tax hikes?

The .com/PC revolution was a primary cause of the economic boom of the 90s that Clinton had the luxury of presiding over.

Of course typical Con tactic of ignoring the fact that Clinton cleaned the slate of debt and made us even again just so that Bush could come in and ruin it.

Yet unemployment continues to drop.

This doesn't take into account discouraged workers and people in poverty.

Yea, during a recession too. That really would have been an economic catastrophe had it not been for the tax cuts.

Of course because deficit spending doesn't matter does it?

Blaming Bush for a recession he inherited... nice. I would expect nothing less from a liberal.

Inherited? Bah! Recession happened after Clinton was basically done. Besides, every peak has a downfall.

Btw Saw your movie the other night, it's not bad. Breaks the stereotype of only males robbing banks
:lol:

 

[The Real McCoy]

Wow it's worse than Reagan now.

Yes, and it will continue to get worse until we slash government spending.

When with tax hikes?

Nearly every time. How does raising taxes (taking money away from consumers, employers, etc.) possibly stimulate economic growth?

Of course typical Con tactic of ignoring the fact that Clinton cleaned the slate of debt and made us even again just so that Bush could come in and ruin it.

You're confusing the economy with government spending, 2 unrelated topics. The fact remains that Clinton rode the wave of the PC/internet boom.




This doesn't take into account discouraged workers and people in poverty.

"Discouraged workers" represent a small fraction of a percent of the labor force. And our poverty line would be a life of luxury in most countries.

Of course because deficit spending doesn't matter does it?

And the alternative? Raising taxes? Ingenious if your goal is achieving another depression.

Inherited? Bah! Recession happened after Clinton was basically done. Besides, every peak has a downfall.

Doesn't change the fact that the recession began before Bush entered office.

Btw Saw your movie the other night, it's not bad. Breaks the stereotype of only males robbing banks
:lol:

What?

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Yes, and it will continue to get worse until we slash government spending.

Nearly every time. How does raising taxes (taking money away from consumers, employers, etc.) possibly stimulate economic growth?

You're confusing the economy with government spending, 2 unrelated topics. The fact remains that Clinton rode the wave of the PC/internet boom.

This doesn't take into account discouraged workers and people in poverty.

"Discouraged workers" represent a small fraction of a percent of the labor force. And our poverty line would be a life of luxury in most countries.

And the alternative? Raising taxes? Ingenious if your goal is achieving another depression.

Doesn't change the fact that the recession began before Bush entered office.

What?

• If Clinton just rode the .com boom, then why is it that even after the collapse of the dot coms, there is still a net of gain of nearly 20 million jobs during the Clinton years?

• Government spending is a component of GDP. From an economic standpoint, there is no difference between me spending a dollar, a crack addict spending a dollar, and the government spending a dollar. Either way it’s a dollar spent and contributes to GDP.

• There is not one iota of empirical data either way that a modest increase in taxes would either result in greater economic growth or to retard economic growth. In fact, arguably, raising taxes and as a result, reducing deficit spending, would result in more foreign investment which would contribute to economic growth. The Clinton economic miracle followed a tax increase. The Reagan tax cut was followed by the deepest recession since the Great Depression in 1982.

• Anyone who would argue that the Bush tax cuts are the reason for the very shallow recession of 2001 is obviously ignorant of economics. The Bush Tax cuts were largely back loaded. The vast majority of the tax cuts taking place in later years. The total amount of money the tax cuts returned to the private sector in a given year is miniscule compared to GDP. The recession was simply a result of a glut in supply and irrational investing in the previous year. Once that glut in supply was consumed, economic growth resumed. The speed at which it was consumed can be attributed almost directly to the extremely low interest rates.

Every year of the Clinton Presidency the poverty rate went down and median income went up. Every year of the Bush Presidency, the poverty rate has gone up, and median income has gone down. Our unemployment rate is low today, but is still not as low as it reached during the Clinton years. Moreover, as evidenced by the higher median income during the nineties, a higher percentage of the jobs during the nineties were better jobs than what is available today.