Small enough to use? ‘Low yield’ US nukes begin rolling off the production line

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What creates the deterrence for using nukes in the first place is the threat of mutually assured destruction, which is a power emotional incentive to not use nukes. If you remove that emotional incentive, you increase the likelihood that nukes will be used. The only thing restraining anybody from using nukes is pure, unadulterated horror. Remove the horror, remove the restraint. That's bad.

These smaller nukes strengthen the incentive to never use nukes.

 

[Toggle Almendro]

What creates the deterrence for using nukes in the first place is the threat of mutually assured destruction, which is a power emotional incentive to not use nukes. If you remove that emotional incentive, you increase the likelihood that nukes will be used. The only thing restraining anybody from using nukes is pure, unadulterated horror. Remove the horror, remove the restraint. That's bad.

We're making strides in the "pure unadulterated horror" department as well. These small warheads are not the only change that is being made to our arsenal. The ability to put three half-megaton warheads on a Minuteman will make our ICBMs a much more potent threat to any potential aggressor that contemplates nuclear war with the US.

 

[JustHanging]

America or any other country uses a nuke of any kind will become a pariah state immediately

The problem is, the USA, like Trump himself, is quickly becoming just that. It's like Trump on twitter, nobody can beat him, because you can't insult Trump, everyone knows he's about as disgusting and scummy as a person can get without being in jail. And if he wasn't rich, that's exactly where he would almost certainly be. So what could anyone possibly add? Where as everyone else, they care. So if the USA is already a pariah, outside of NK, Russia, and Saudi Arabia, what difference will that make?

It's crazy, but Trump is moulding the USA into a vision of himself: Lying about agreements, "Do what we say or else!" policies, racially motivated policies, a laughing stock, and soon possibly a pariah on the international stage.

 

[Anthony60]

We don't need to use nukes. They are more for a deterrent, and a response if a nuke is used on us. We can rain hell on any country, and destroy their cities, without nukes. Iran? They don't have that capability. They need nukes to ever think about doing that kind of damage to us.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

These nukes are being developed to counter the possibility that an enemy aggressor might try a limited nuclear attack that would give them a decisive advantage over our conventional forces, but at the same time not be enough (in their estimation) to provoke us into using a full-sized nuke against them.

That would probably be a miscalculation on their part. I'm sure that if our conventional forces were overwhelmed with nuclear weapons, we would not hesitate to respond with nuclear weapons.

However, it would be preferable to avoid such miscalculations in the first place. The idea of a smaller, more usable, nuke is to prevent our enemies from making this sort of miscalculation by making it clear that we have an easy way to respond to low-level nuclear attacks.

Actually, it wouldn't have been necessary for the conventional forces to have been "overwhelmed by nuclear weapons" (ref. "Blue Peacock")

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Re: Small enough to use? ‘Low yield’ US nukes begin rolling off the production line

The Non Proliferation Treaty says that it is.



Not legally free according to the Non Proliferation Treaty.



The other governments of the world are not placing sanctions on Iran at the moment. In fact, many governments are trying to help Iran evade the sanctions that Trump is placing on them. But if Iran were to build illegal nuclear weapons, sanctions against them would be imposed by the entire world.

Look at North Korea. The situation that Iran faces right now is not comparable to the sanctions that the entire world has placed on North Korea.

All Iran has to do is to withdraw from the NNPT.

The situation on "illegality" under international law differs from the situation on "illegality" under criminal law in that you don't have the option of declaring that you are no longer covered by the restrictions of the criminal law, but you do have the option of declaring that you are no longer covered by the restrictions of a treaty.

PS - Don't forget that Mr. Trump is threatening to punish those other countries because their governments are failing to comply with the laws of the United States of America. Very few (if any) of those other countries are attempting to get American goods which the American government has declared that Americans cannot sell to Iran into Iran and the US government has no legal standing to prohibit non-American goods being sold by citizens of non-American countries and exported from non-American countries entering Iran. In short, those other countries are NOT "trying to help Iran evade the sanctions that Trump has placed on them" since the US government has no legal power to prohibit them doing what they are doing.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

America or any other country uses a nuke of any kind will become a pariah state immediately

Would Mr. Trump care?

Would that have an adverse economic impact on the owners/operators of luxury resorts and golf courses?

 

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Re: Small enough to use? ‘Low yield’ US nukes begin rolling off the production line

All Iran has to do is to withdraw from the NNPT.

The NPT only allows countries to withdraw for certain legitimate reasons.

Iran wanting to be a rogue state does not count as a legitimate reason.

Therefore if they try to withdraw, the result will be sanctions from the rest of the planet, much like what happened with North Korea's illegitimate withdrawal from the NPT.

In short, those other countries are NOT "trying to help Iran evade the sanctions that Trump has placed on them" since the US government has no legal power to prohibit them doing what they are doing.

The US has the legal power to forbid any party that does business with Iran from also doing business in the United States.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Re: Small enough to use? ‘Low yield’ US nukes begin rolling off the production line

The NPT only allows countries to withdraw for certain legitimate reasons.

Possibly that is technically correct, but the actual wording is

Article X

1. Each Party shall in exercising its national sovereignty have the right to withdraw from the Treaty if it decides that extraordinary events, related to the subject matter of this Treaty, have jeopardized the supreme interests of its country. It shall give notice of such withdrawal to all other parties to the Treaty and to the United Nations Security Council three months in advance. Such notice shall include a statement of the extraordinary events it regards as having jeopardized its supreme interests.
[emphasis added]
​

Iran wanting to be a rogue state does not count as a legitimate reason.

True, but that has zero impact on the "have jeopardized the supreme interests of its country" bit, does it?

Therefore if they try to withdraw, the result will be sanctions from the rest of the planet, much like what happened with North Korea's illegitimate withdrawal from the NPT.

True, and if they don't try to withdraw the result could be sanctions from the rest of the planet too.

The US has the legal power to forbid any party that does business with Iran from also doing business in the United States.

Absolutely.

In fact the US government has the legal power to forbid any country that allows abortion from doing business in the United States of America as well.

Not only that, but in fact the US government has the legal power to forbid any country that doesn't use the US dollar as its national currency from doing business in the United States of America as well.

Not only that, but in fact the US government has the legal power to forbid any country that doesn't elect an extreme right-wing fascist government from doing business in the United States of America as well.

Not only that, but in fact the US government has the legal power to forbid any country that doesn't have English as its official language from doing business in the United States of America as well.

Not only that, but in fact the US government has the legal power to forbid any country that doesn't acknowledge that the President of the United States of America has dictatorial powers in it from doing business in the United States of America as well.

Not only that, but in fact the US government has the legal power to forbid any country that ...

I suspect you get my drift.

PS - You do realize that other countries have the legal power to forbid any country that does NOT do business with Iran from doing business in it, don't you?