shtf preppers. questions I've never had answered?

[prison/con.net]

you're going to have to carry a backpack of goodies everywhere. So how will you carry more than one longarm, and enough ammo to make them both worth having? How can you shoot a gun that you aint got with you? Why would you NOT want a sound suppressor on your shtf gun? Laws won't mean anything at that point. Noise scares off game and will call to your killers, so why make any noise? Why have any muzzleflash at night?

When you choose a 308 type rifle or a 12 gauge, you are choosing to make noise, cause such guns can't be adequately "silenced", and still have a handy sized longarm. The silencerco 'can" for the 12 ga is a joke, and so is the one by RedJacket. A 20" barreled 308 requires 10" of silencer to be worth a hoot, and that total length is way too long for CQB use. There's a reason why riot shotguns have 20" long barrels, not 30" long, you know. If you chop the 308 barrel shorter, it no longer has any long range advantage over the 223 (of the same overall length for the rifle and silencer).

 

[beerftw]

you're going to have to carry a backpack of goodies everywhere. So how will you carry more than one longarm, and enough ammo to make them both worth having? How can you shoot a gun that you aint got with you? Why would you NOT want a sound suppressor on your shtf gun? Laws won't mean anything at that point. Noise scares off game and will call to your killers, so why make any noise? Why have any muzzleflash at night?

When you choose a 308 type rifle or a 12 gauge, you are choosing to make noise, cause such guns can't be adequately "silenced", and still have a handy sized longarm. The silencerco 'can" for the 12 ga is a joke, and so is the one by RedJacket. A 20" barreled 308 requires 10" of silencer to be worth a hoot, and that total length is way too long for CQB use. There's a reason why riot shotguns have 20" long barrels, not 30" long, you know. If you chop the 308 barrel shorter, it no longer has any long range advantage over the 223 (of the same overall length for the rifle and silencer).

most preppers arent absolute crazy to go into epic detail like you are,except the few that put out 50 youtube videos a year and those who raid every outdoors store wearing camo and smelling like they have never showered,probably in fear they would be killed by the fbi the moment they let their guard down to shower.

most preppers prepare for natural disasters riots and isolated lawlessness,not the end of the world.i myself carry plenty of food and water,and have a decent stockpile of ammo-and no i can not take on the zombie army,but i could probably hunt for a few years off what i have.


fyi if you wanted silenced,you would go straight 22 subsonic anyways.22lr is the undisputed king of poaching due to low noise.the 2lr subsonic is not powerfull enough to kill anything at a range,but is effective close range and quieter than many airguns.plus you can carry way more 22 subsonic than you can larger rounds.

 

[TurtleDude]

most preppers arent absolute crazy to go into epic detail like you are,except the few that put out 50 youtube videos a year and those who raid every outdoors store wearing camo and smelling like they have never showered,probably in fear they would be killed by the fbi the moment they let their guard down to shower.

most preppers prepare for natural disasters riots and isolated lawlessness,not the end of the world.i myself carry plenty of food and water,and have a decent stockpile of ammo-and no i can not take on the zombie army,but i could probably hunt for a few years off what i have.


fyi if you wanted silenced,you would go straight 22 subsonic anyways.22lr is the undisputed king of poaching due to low noise.the 2lr subsonic is not powerfull enough to kill anything at a range,but is effective close range and quieter than many airguns.plus you can carry way more 22 subsonic than you can larger rounds.

the ideal "can" round is the 45 ACP

I have shot a "Lisle" carbine AKA a "welgun" its the quietest rig I ever heard. 45 ACP bolt action carbine

and a 45 ACP is plenty lethal out to at least 100 yards

 

[beerftw]

the ideal "can" round is the 45 ACP

I have shot a "Lisle" carbine AKA a "welgun" its the quietest rig I ever heard. 45 ACP bolt action carbine

and a 45 ACP is plenty lethal out to at least 100 yards

if the op is arguing quiet,i would go 22lr subsonic over any silenced rifle round.

for general killing power it depends on what you intend it for.i would prefer 45 acp over 9mm and 38,but have zero problems with either.if i was in a survival situation,i would mainly use blackpowder musseloaders,as the rounds powder paper primers and flint are easy to make,therefore using less of my prime ammo for things like hunting.

 

[tech30528]

Yeah, preppers are not all the same and are not looking at the same scenarios. I've known a few of the "we're building a bunker in the back yard" types, but most (including myself) consider things like losing a job or an extended illness to be far more likely. Being prepared for missing a few paychecks is much more practical. As for firearms I agree with the suppressed 22 rifle and Turtledude's assessment of the suppressed 45 pistol. I like matched sets, for instance I have 22 pistols and 22 rifles, and 9mm pistol and folding carbine that use the same ammo and magazines. 45acp with it's relatively low chamber pressures is ideal for casting from wheel weight lead, I would think a 45 carbine and pistol, both suppressed, would be the trick. You get about 30 rounds of 45 per pound of lead. The range or the 22 and 45s are going to be about the same, the 22 is more accurate. For defense I would prefer the 45' for hunting I'll take the 22.

 

[prison/con.net]

You do NOT have to limit yourself to having only a .22lr arm, (to get silenced use) , you know. Ciener Firearms makes .22lr conversion units for the AR15, the AK (both .30 cal and 223) , and the Mini-14. HK makes them for both their 308 and 223 guns. Somebody made one for the FAL, too. The kits run about $200, with a 30 rd box mag. There's plenty of youtube videos about these kits, AR15 silencers, etc. With a 223 can on the M4, and with Aquila 60 gr subsonic .22 ammo, the .22 unit sounds like a BB gun, but functions fine and hits 5x as hard as typical .22 or .177 pellet rifles.

Keep the gun in centerfire "mode" until you see a reason/opportunity to use the .22. Make the shot and immediately swap back to centerfire, in case you need the power, range and penetration of the larger rd. The .22 unit will let you practice for 1/4 the ammo price, and it's not considered to be a gun under the law. So it can be mailed to anyone in the US, no dealer, no nothing is required. The savings of 30c per shot quickly pays for a .22kit, and in short order, pays for the $200 tax stamp needed to legally make your own silencer. A day of your labor and $100 for the local machine/welding shop will also be required, but a commercial 223 silencer is $1000+, so it's a day well spent!

With 1.5"x 8.5" of silencer (1" of that telescoped around the barrel threads) an M4/223 can have all of its flash removed, and it can be made to sound like a normal .22lr rifle. In other words, you can only hear the "sonic crack" sound about 1/3rd as far as you would hear the normal 223 blast. 1/2 mile instead of 1.5 miles, on flat, open ground, in cold weather.

 

[Bigfoot 88]

I'm not really a prepper but I enjoy watching the videos and if I had the time it would be a nice hobby. If you are "bugging out" on foot, you definitely won't be carrying two *long* guns. Maybe you will bring combo gun, likely a light .22 rifle that can be stowed in or on your pack. If you are driving, weight is not a problem.

 

[Tazmanian Devil]

My two favorite YouTube preppers are Preparedmind 101 and Survival Lilly (and Dax, her dog).

They are both deadly with bow & arrows and sling shots as well as firearms.

You will learn a LOT from them and enjoy the process.

 

[tech30528]

If you are really worried about weight there is this.
MechTech - Home
You can go Glock or 1911 and use a single lower. You could even share the suppressor.

 

[tech30528]

Need a 22 combo? I recommend a 10 22 and the Walther P22. This particular 10 22 is just over 5 pounds. I saw one with the same collapsible stock and a carbon barrel that was about a pound lighter, but I have $400 in this one and it shoots sub MOA.

 

[tech30528]

How about a compact 9mm package?



Just your basic soft laptop case



Well, maybe not so basic



The pistol is a Glock 33, subcompact .357 sig. But here, it has a threaded 9mm barrel in it.

The Sub 2000 has a Red Lion Precision indexing forend and a reflex sight. They both use the same mags. Those 33 rounders are handy. There are 5 of them in the large pocket and various smaller ones in the other pockets, along with spare batteries for the sight. The carbine weighs about 5 pounds.

 

[Dibbler]

We here at the ATF/FBI/CIA/NSA and numerous other alphabet agencies both domestic and foreign, appreciate you posting your hardware for us to scrutinize.

Thank you, and have a nice day.

 

[tech30528]

We here at the ATF/FBI/CIA/NSA and numerous other alphabet agencies both domestic and foreign, appreciate you posting your hardware for us to scrutinize.

Thank you, and have a nice day.

No real secrets there. Each of them was purchased with a 4473 form and they have all been on public ranges. I'm not that paranoid.

 

[Dibbler]

No real secrets there. Each of them was purchased with a 4473 form and they have all been on public ranges. I'm not that paranoid.

Those are US Federal forms. Do you plan any trips abroad ?

 

[Goshin]

you're going to have to carry a backpack of goodies everywhere. So how will you carry more than one longarm, and enough ammo to make them both worth having? How can you shoot a gun that you aint got with you? Why would you NOT want a sound suppressor on your shtf gun? Laws won't mean anything at that point. Noise scares off game and will call to your killers, so why make any noise? Why have any muzzleflash at night?

When you choose a 308 type rifle or a 12 gauge, you are choosing to make noise, cause such guns can't be adequately "silenced", and still have a handy sized longarm. The silencerco 'can" for the 12 ga is a joke, and so is the one by RedJacket. A 20" barreled 308 requires 10" of silencer to be worth a hoot, and that total length is way too long for CQB use. There's a reason why riot shotguns have 20" long barrels, not 30" long, you know. If you chop the 308 barrel shorter, it no longer has any long range advantage over the 223 (of the same overall length for the rifle and silencer).

I don't know where you get your information on what preppers/survivalists do or plan for, but your query is full of inaccuracies, false assumptions and minor issues to the point I don't feel like bothering to correct it all.


Ok, I'll correct one flawed assumption: No serious prepper that is using his brain at all, has "live out of a backpack and what I can carry" as a primary survival plan.

That's called "being a refugee" and it is a last resort of desperation, not a plan.

 

[beerftw]

I don't know where you get your information on what preppers/survivalists do or plan for, but your query is full of inaccuracies, false assumptions and minor issues to the point I don't feel like bothering to correct it all.


Ok, I'll correct one flawed assumption: No serious prepper that is using his brain at all, has "live out of a backpack and what I can carry" as a primary survival plan.

That's called "being a refugee" and it is a last resort of desperation, not a plan.

do not forget a single backpack loaded with weapons and ammo leaves little for food.

most preppers carry practical,and prepare for anarchy like what happens during riots,maybe short term hunting.but in reality food even in compressed form takes up plenty of room,as does clothes,blanket,water,a survival knife or hatchet,etc.

if i had to live more than 3-5 days off what a backpack could carry,i would end up living like a native american off the land,as that backpack filled to the brim would not last long.

 

[Goshin]

do not forget a single backpack loaded with weapons and ammo leaves little for food.

most preppers carry practical,and prepare for anarchy like what happens during riots,maybe short term hunting.but in reality food even in compressed form takes up plenty of room,as does clothes,blanket,water,a survival knife or hatchet,etc.

if i had to live more than 3-5 days off what a backpack could carry,i would end up living like a native american off the land,as that backpack filled to the brim would not last long.

Exactly right. Son and I are going backpacking soon, and even trying to keep it minimalist, the weight of what you need for 4-5 days completely out of contact with civilization is substantial. "Backpack survivalism" isn't... a survival backpack is only intended to get you HOME, or to your prepared and stocked retreat, and that only as a last resort.

 

[UtahBill]

My survival/get home pack is water, granola bars, guns and ammo, and a set of sharp knives for butchering the long pig that I may need to eat until I get home. Oh, and lots of BBQ sauce....

 

[Chainsaw]

you're going to have to carry a backpack of goodies everywhere. So how will you carry more than one longarm, and enough ammo to make them both worth having? How can you shoot a gun that you aint got with you? Why would you NOT want a sound suppressor on your shtf gun? Laws won't mean anything at that point. Noise scares off game and will call to your killers, so why make any noise? Why have any muzzleflash at night?

When you choose a 308 type rifle or a 12 gauge, you are choosing to make noise, cause such guns can't be adequately "silenced", and still have a handy sized longarm. The silencerco 'can" for the 12 ga is a joke, and so is the one by RedJacket. A 20" barreled 308 requires 10" of silencer to be worth a hoot, and that total length is way too long for CQB use. There's a reason why riot shotguns have 20" long barrels, not 30" long, you know. If you chop the 308 barrel shorter, it no longer has any long range advantage over the 223 (of the same overall length for the rifle and silencer).

I would bug-out away from 'base' with a quality 22 Long-Rifle,......it (or something similar) is the only way to carry enough rounds to be effective.

Unless your are shooting sub-sonic speed rounds, silencers have a limited advantage. I agree, why put on a silencer on a high power rifle, if you have to dial back the bullet velocity to sub-sonic so the report of the rifle is anywhere close to 'silent' Defeats the effectiveness of a high powered rifle.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

I would bug-out away from 'base' with a quality 22 Long-Rifle,......it (or something similar) is the only way to carry enough rounds to be effective.

Unless your are shooting sub-sonic speed rounds, silencers have a limited advantage. I agree, why put on a silencer on a high power rifle, if you have to dial back the bullet velocity to sub-sonic so the report of the rifle is anywhere close to 'silent' Defeats the effectiveness of a high powered rifle.

It doesn't matter much anyway, it would take you firing at least two, probably three shots for someone to know with any accuracy where you are by sound, so if you can down a deer in one shot you wot need a suppressor

 

[VanceMack]

How about a compact 9mm package?

View attachment 67185332

Just your basic soft laptop case

View attachment 67185333

Well, maybe not so basic

View attachment 67185334

The pistol is a Glock 33, subcompact .357 sig. But here, it has a threaded 9mm barrel in it.

The Sub 2000 has a Red Lion Precision indexing forend and a reflex sight. They both use the same mags. Those 33 rounders are handy. There are 5 of them in the large pocket and various smaller ones in the other pockets, along with spare batteries for the sight. The carbine weighs about 5 pounds.

Im a big fan of redundancy. Ive got 2 Sub2ks in .40 and several glocks in .40. Interchangeable ammunition...interchangeable magazines.

 

[tech30528]

I would bug-out away from 'base' with a quality 22 Long-Rifle,......it (or something similar) is the only way to carry enough rounds to be effective.

Unless your are shooting sub-sonic speed rounds, silencers have a limited advantage. I agree, why put on a silencer on a high power rifle, if you have to dial back the bullet velocity to sub-sonic so the report of the rifle is anywhere close to 'silent' Defeats the effectiveness of a high powered rifle.

While there is certainly an advantage to subsonic with a suppressor it is not absolutely necessary. Yes, there will be a sonic report, but the suppressor knocks down the muzzle blast and makes it difficult to locate the shooter.

 

[Chainsaw]

Im a big fan of redundancy. Ive got 2 Sub2ks in .40 and several glocks in .40. Interchangeable ammunition...interchangeable magazines.

View attachment 67185544

I have a Sub in a 40sw also. I love the design and concept, I just wish there wasn't so much composite, especially the sites.

 

[tech30528]

I have a Sub in a 40sw also. I love the design and concept, I just wish there wasn't so much composite, especially the sites.

I didn't care for the sights either, so i removed them. you can break off the lower tab on the rear peep sight so it doesn't stand up when you unfold it. It is still there and you can pull it up if you like but then it doesn't block your other optics.

 

[VanceMack]

I have a Sub in a 40sw also. I love the design and concept, I just wish there wasn't so much composite, especially the sites.

The nex SUb 2K is enhanced. COmes with a rail system and better front sight. Its not an indexing rail. Im playing with an angled rail system that will allow me to keep the red dot in place when it is folded. Minor annoyance.