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Should the US emulate other countries' Abortion Laws? (1 Viewer)

Should the US emulate other countries' abortion laws?

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MrNiceGuy

MrNiceGuy

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In Austria, abortions can be performed on demand in hospitals for women during the first three months from the beginning of the pregnancy. Abortions can be performed later if there is a physical or mental health threat to the pregnant woman, if there is an incurable problem with the development of the fetus, or if the patient is under the age of 14. There is generally no punishment for doctors who choose not to perform abortions based on personal or religious convictions. There are very few abortion clinics or hospitals with abortion capability outside major cities, making it next to impossible to have an abortion in rural areas. Abortions are not paid for by the government health system.

In France, abortion is legal during the first 14 weeks of pregnancy. Abortions at later stages of pregnancy are allowed if two physicians certify that the abortion will be done to prevent grave permanent injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman; a risk to the life of the pregnant woman; or that the child will suffer from a particularly severe illness recognized as incurable

In Britain, abortion is permitted on the grounds of:
  • risk to the life of the pregnant woman;
  • preventing grave permanent injury to her physical or mental health;
  • risk of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman or any existing children of her family (up to a term limit of 24 weeks) or
  • substantial risk that, if the child were born, he or she would “suffer from such physical or mental abnormalities as to be seriously handicapped”
Can you believe that? In Britain, there must be "grounds" to have an abortion. Unless a woman has those grounds, an abortion would be illegal.

In Mexico, brazil, Chile, and Ireland, for example, abortion is legal only to save a woman's life.

So, those were a few examples - what other country's laws about abortion are so much better than the laws in the US?
 
MrNiceGuy said:
In Austria, abortions can be performed on demand in hospitals for women during the first three months from the beginning of the pregnancy. Abortions can be performed later if there is a physical or mental health threat to the pregnant woman, if there is an incurable problem with the development of the fetus, or if the patient is under the age of 14. There is generally no punishment for doctors who choose not to perform abortions based on personal or religious convictions. There are very few abortion clinics or hospitals with abortion capability outside major cities, making it next to impossible to have an abortion in rural areas. Abortions are not paid for by the government health system.
Click to expand...

Thanks for posting.

Some clarifications:

Austria is not as rural as the US though. Public transportation is everywhere and cheap. You are in a bigger city from every spot of the country in about 30 minutes by bus or train. So, that is not an argument.

The bigger problem is the 2nd sentence: Abortions are NOT paid for by the government health system.

That makes Austria one of the last Western European countries where abortion is not covered by universal health insurance. "Thanks" to our conservative and far-right parties. That means a lot of (young) women cannot afford it and become single mothers, stuck at home, without any chance at a good career ...
 

Should the US emulate other countries' abortion laws?​

No. We don't emulate anybody. They emulate us.
 
MrNiceGuy said:
Can you believe that? In Britain, there must be "grounds" to have an abortion. Unless a woman has those grounds, an abortion would be illegal.
Click to expand...
Chomsky said:
Interesting. I wasn't aware Britain was so strict in preventing abortion.
Click to expand...
England and Wales are not that strict. You're sorely misrepresenting English attitudes, MrNiceGuy.

Just a reminder that the NHS is a publicly-funded and government-run healthcare service — and has a website has a page for abortion that highlights to the English public,
  • Abortions are free of charge
  • Have less than a 2 week wait time
  • Provides handy URL hyperlinks to three other abortion providers in England
  • That the "decision to have an abortion is yours alone"
www.nhs.uk

Abortion

Find out what an abortion involves, how you can get one on the NHS, and what support is available to help you make a decision.
www.nhs.uk www.nhs.uk
 
Mycroft said:

Should the US emulate other countries' abortion laws?​

No. We don't emulate anybody. They emulate us.
Click to expand...
No. When it comes to healthcare issues, they either shake their heads in bewilderment, or laugh at us outright.
 
Mycroft said:

Should the US emulate other countries' abortion laws?​

No. We don't emulate anybody. They emulate us.
Click to expand...
Apparently...not.
 
MrNiceGuy said:
In Austria, abortions can be performed on demand in hospitals for women during the first three months from the beginning of the pregnancy. Abortions can be performed later if there is a physical or mental health threat to the pregnant woman, if there is an incurable problem with the development of the fetus, or if the patient is under the age of 14. There is generally no punishment for doctors who choose not to perform abortions based on personal or religious convictions. There are very few abortion clinics or hospitals with abortion capability outside major cities, making it next to impossible to have an abortion in rural areas. Abortions are not paid for by the government health system.

In France, abortion is legal during the first 14 weeks of pregnancy. Abortions at later stages of pregnancy are allowed if two physicians certify that the abortion will be done to prevent grave permanent injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman; a risk to the life of the pregnant woman; or that the child will suffer from a particularly severe illness recognized as incurable

In Britain, abortion is permitted on the grounds of:
  • risk to the life of the pregnant woman;
  • preventing grave permanent injury to her physical or mental health;
  • risk of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman or any existing children of her family (up to a term limit of 24 weeks) or
  • substantial risk that, if the child were born, he or she would “suffer from such physical or mental abnormalities as to be seriously handicapped”
Can you believe that? In Britain, there must be "grounds" to have an abortion. Unless a woman has those grounds, an abortion would be illegal.

In Mexico, brazil, Chile, and Ireland, for example, abortion is legal only to save a woman's life.

So, those were a few examples - what other country's laws about abortion are so much better than the laws in the US?
Click to expand...
Not true for Ireland anymore. Abortion is legal up to 12 weeks and there are certain exceptions after that. Abortion is also legal in many areas of Mexico including Mexico city. Chile also relaxed abortion laws recently and abortion is legal up to 12 weeks and there are specific exceptions.
 
brothern said:
England and Wales are not that strict. You're sorely misrepresenting English attitudes, MrNiceGuy.

Just a reminder that the NHS is a publicly-funded and government-run healthcare service — and has a website has a page for abortion that highlights to the English public,
  • Abortions are free of charge
  • Have less than a 2 week wait time
  • Provides handy URL hyperlinks to three other abortion providers in England
  • That the "decision to have an abortion is yours alone"
www.nhs.uk

Abortion

Find out what an abortion involves, how you can get one on the NHS, and what support is available to help you make a decision.
www.nhs.uk www.nhs.uk
Click to expand...
I used Wiki as my source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_the_United_Kingdom
Loulit01 said:
Not true for Ireland anymore. Abortion is legal up to 12 weeks and there are certain exceptions after that. Abortion is also legal in many areas of Mexico including Mexico city. Chile also relaxed abortion laws recently and abortion is legal up to 12 weeks and there are specific exceptions.
Click to expand...
That's nice. If an American State tries to cut anything off at 12 weeks, though, the entire world seems to get up in arms about it.
 
Superfly said:
You're using Wikipedia as a source and not ashamed to admit it?

Damn. :ROFLMAO:
Click to expand...
Not for a general question like this. I'm not going to search the law codes of foreign countries, and wikipedia is at least as reliable as mainstream news sources (most reporters these days plagiarize from wikipedia all the time).

I wouldn't expect wikipedia to be too far off base on these items, and from what I see it wasn't. The wiki article is, in fact, correct about the law in Britain.
 
MamboDervish said:
No. When it comes to healthcare issues, they either shake their heads in bewilderment, or laugh at us outright.
Click to expand...
Until they examine their own laws and systems, and see how really it's a matter of not understanding either their own laws or American laws.
 
MrNiceGuy said:
Until they examine their own laws and systems, and see how really it's a matter of not understanding either their own laws or American laws.
Click to expand...
You're in total denial.

ceoworld.biz

Countries With The Best Health Care Systems, 2024 - CEOWORLD magazine

According to the 2024 edition of the CEOWORLD magazine Health Care Index, Taiwan has been ranked as the country with the best healthcare system in the world. This index ranks 110 countries based on various factors that contribute to overall health. Two other Asian countries, South Korea (second...
ceoworld.biz ceoworld.biz
www.cntraveler.com

The Happiest Countries in the World in 2024

The United States and Germany dropped off the top 20 list, which added new entrants Costa Rica and Kuwait.
www.cntraveler.com www.cntraveler.com

Standard of Living by Country | Quality of Life by Country 2024

worldpopulationreview.com worldpopulationreview.com

Wake up!
 
MrNiceGuy said:
In Austria, abortions can be performed on demand in hospitals for women during the first three months from the beginning of the pregnancy. Abortions can be performed later if there is a physical or mental health threat to the pregnant woman, if there is an incurable problem with the development of the fetus, or if the patient is under the age of 14. There is generally no punishment for doctors who choose not to perform abortions based on personal or religious convictions. There are very few abortion clinics or hospitals with abortion capability outside major cities, making it next to impossible to have an abortion in rural areas. Abortions are not paid for by the government health system.

In France, abortion is legal during the first 14 weeks of pregnancy. Abortions at later stages of pregnancy are allowed if two physicians certify that the abortion will be done to prevent grave permanent injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman; a risk to the life of the pregnant woman; or that the child will suffer from a particularly severe illness recognized as incurable

In Britain, abortion is permitted on the grounds of:
  • risk to the life of the pregnant woman;
  • preventing grave permanent injury to her physical or mental health;
  • risk of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman or any existing children of her family (up to a term limit of 24 weeks) or
  • substantial risk that, if the child were born, he or she would “suffer from such physical or mental abnormalities as to be seriously handicapped”
Can you believe that? In Britain, there must be "grounds" to have an abortion. Unless a woman has those grounds, an abortion would be illegal.

In Mexico, brazil, Chile, and Ireland, for example, abortion is legal only to save a woman's life.

So, those were a few examples - what other country's laws about abortion are so much better than the laws in the US?
Click to expand...
You are wrong about Ireland.

Abortion in Ireland is regulated by the Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Act 2018. Abortion is permitted in Ireland during the first twelve weeks of pregnancy, and later in cases where the pregnant woman's life or health is at risk, or in the cases of a fatal foetal abnormality. Abortion services commenced on 1 January 2019, following its legalisation by the aforementioned Act, which became law on 20 December 2018. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_the_Republic_of_Ireland

You are wrong about Mexico.

Since 2021, Abortion in Mexico is no longer a crime, although its legalisation still varies by state. On 7 September 2021, the Mexican Supreme Court unanimously ruled that penalising abortion is unconstitutional, setting an important precedent across the whole country.[1][2] The procedure is easily available on request to any woman up to twelve weeks into a pregnancy in Mexico City and the states of Oaxaca, Hidalgo, Veracruz, Colima, Baja California and Sinaloa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Mexico

You are wrong about Chile.

Abortion in Chile is legal in the following cases: when the mother's life is at risk, when the fetus will not survive the pregnancy, and during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy (14 weeks, if the woman is under 14 years old) in the case of rape. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Chile
 
MrNiceGuy said:
Not for a general question like this. I'm not going to search the law codes of foreign countries, and wikipedia is at least as reliable as mainstream news sources (most reporters these days plagiarize from wikipedia all the time).

I wouldn't expect wikipedia to be too far off base on these items, and from what I see it wasn't. The wiki article is, in fact, correct about the law in Britain.
Click to expand...

Dig on down, dude. Wikipedia is easily editable, but hey. Die on that hill, ok? We won't laugh at your ridiculous sources ... much.
 
MamboDervish said:
Among the educated nations of the world, we are an international punchline to many jokes.
Click to expand...

Been going on for a while.

US-Election-IQ2004.jpg
 
Tender Branson said:
Thanks for posting.

Some clarifications:

Austria is not as rural as the US though. Public transportation is everywhere and cheap. You are in a bigger city from every spot of the country in about 30 minutes by bus or train. So, that is not an argument.

The bigger problem is the 2nd sentence: Abortions are NOT paid for by the government health system.

That makes Austria one of the last Western European countries where abortion is not covered by universal health insurance. "Thanks" to our conservative and far-right parties. That means a lot of (young) women cannot afford it and become single mothers, stuck at home, without any chance at a good career ...
Click to expand...
Is adoption illegal in Austria?
 
beefheart said:
You are wrong about Ireland.

Abortion in Ireland is regulated by the Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Act 2018. Abortion is permitted in Ireland during the first twelve weeks of pregnancy, and later in cases where the pregnant woman's life or health is at risk, or in the cases of a fatal foetal abnormality. Abortion services commenced on 1 January 2019, following its legalisation by the aforementioned Act, which became law on 20 December 2018. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_the_Republic_of_Ireland

You are wrong about Mexico.

Since 2021, Abortion in Mexico is no longer a crime, although its legalisation still varies by state. On 7 September 2021, the Mexican Supreme Court unanimously ruled that penalising abortion is unconstitutional, setting an important precedent across the whole country.[1][2] The procedure is easily available on request to any woman up to twelve weeks into a pregnancy in Mexico City and the states of Oaxaca, Hidalgo, Veracruz, Colima, Baja California and Sinaloa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Mexico

You are wrong about Chile.

Abortion in Chile is legal in the following cases: when the mother's life is at risk, when the fetus will not survive the pregnancy, and during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy (14 weeks, if the woman is under 14 years old) in the case of rape. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Chile
Click to expand...
1651607999302.png
 
is abortion murder.....is war murder....
conservatives will say abortion is murder and that war is ok with God...'it's in the Bible'

liberals will say that abortion is not murder but killing in self defense overrules 'thou shalt not kill'
 
Just because a person is pro-choice doesn't automatically mean that they bear absolutist views on the issue.
I don't think many of the statutes quoted above are all that onerous, although I'd stick with the twenty-week line, and of course, the
provisions for cases where the pregnant woman's life or health is at risk, or in the cases of a fatal fetal abnormality.
That last one is something the pro-life movement blithely ignores or pretends is something a female should just endure because it's
God's Will. I do not believe in the standard traditional view of "God" as some humanoid deity, thus I cannot imagine a God who would
sit back and chuckle watching a baby suffer in agony for a few weeks, days or hours due to abnormalities no sane person would inflict
on their worst enemies.

When people choose abortion as a means of simple birth control it's a decision made of sloth, ignorance and laziness, and a lot of that
CAN be avoided by making birth control widely available and providing sex education on contraception and explaining why it's important.

I am indeed pro-choice but I'd like to see the number of abortions reduced as much as is practical.
I'm not a "baby killer"...just a realist who understands there are times when it becomes necessary.
And I do not personally know a single female who has cavalier views on the subject.
 
Have you seen the list of the countries we'll soon be joining? It will be something for us to hang our head in shame for.

Let's start with Iraq and Egypt.
 
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