Should the presidential election be eliminated?

[Lutherf]

What I hate is the ignorance of the fact that the Georgia votes were counted THREE times with the same results.
I'm suggesting those that want to throw out legal ballots because they do not like the results are traitors to the Constitution. None of the so called evidence has any meaning. We have the safest elections in the world. That is without question and Biden crushed the one term mistake. Be an American and stand behind him or STFU.

FWIW, the video evidence that was presented indicated that there may have been "spare" ballots injected into the system.

If you have a collection of 500 verified ballots and 500 unverified ballots then you have 1000 ballots and if you count them 1000 times it should always come out that you have 1000 ballots. What those recounts miss, however, is the issue of whether those unverified ballots were cast legitimately or fraudulently.

 

[Lutherf]

I've found the evidence to be lacking, and the fact that it gets more and more preposterous, with old claims quickly dropped when the lack of supporting facts comes out, while new claims are made with a similar lack of evidence.

The courts seem to agree with my assessment thus far.

If you watched the video you saw people pulling boxes of ballots from underneath a table and running them through a machine while there were no observers in the room. Is it not at least worth finding out what was going on in that situation?

 

[Rich2018]

I understand the claim that the hundreds of witnesses are all liars and it is A-OK if the chips, mail in envelopes and ballots are throw away to prevent any auditing. But even if true, that means that it is literally impossible to have any way to know if the election was legitimate or not. Lack of prove of a crime or who committed it never means there was no crime. Despite this, massive billions upon billions are spent on the election and campaigning.

Rather than having fake elections for show, should elections be eliminated? A small group of the international super rich own all television stations, newspapers and nearly all internet "news" outlets that now are censoring anything contrary to their profit and power interests. There is no manner to police mail-in ballots since all this is done by partisan political election offices on a local basis for which it only takes one corrupt partisan official to completely reverse election outcomes with exactly nothing anyone can do about it.

Wouldn't it be more truth to have a committee consisting of the top 12 richest people in the USA, the current heads of the NSA, CIA, DOJ and FBI, and the top Republican and Democrat of the Senate and House to meet and elect the president. An alternative would be to have the Senate or House of Representatives pick the president - or some other parliamentary system? If each state's legislature picked their electors directly it would preserve the electoral college.

The recent election was the most secure and reliable presidential election ever

However, if you want to make it even better, divorce the offices of head of government and head of state.
Make the president a purely honorary/ceremonial one
Make the head of government the speaker of the house and institute a parliamentary system of government that almost every democracy has and not the current presidential form of government that almost every third world country with a tin pot dictator has.

 

[LouC]

Terrible Poll. No options for me to choose!

 

[Xilnik]

FWIW, the video evidence that was presented indicated that there may have been "spare" ballots injected into the system.

If you have a collection of 500 verified ballots and 500 unverified ballots then you have 1000 ballots and if you count them 1000 times it should always come out that you have 1000 ballots. What those recounts miss, however, is the issue of whether those unverified ballots were cast legitimately or fraudulently.

There is no evidence that there were actually unverified ballots. Yes, the video is concerning, but it is not really proof in and of itself. Let us suppose that you are correct for the sake of your argument. How would they then determine which ballots were unverified, or potentially fraudulent, a month later?

 

[eohrnberger]

They are the only patriots left in your party. The rest are either traitors or spineless wimps. Which one are you?

I reject your binary thinking. It's part of the problem which has arrived us at our present chaotic, identity politics, tribal situation.

 

[ASHES]

If you watched the video you saw people pulling boxes of ballots from underneath a table and running them through a machine while there were no observers in the room. Is it not at least worth finding out what was going on in that situation?

That's nitpicking, not evidence of widespread voter fraud. It is much more likely that the video is being misinterpreted, either accidentally, or willfully.

 

[eohrnberger]

So you are assuming that all elections before 2020 were possibly fraudulent too and we have not done anything to make them safe in the past? In fact you are questioning elections in general aren't you? I would remind you that the one term mistake claimed months ago that any election that he loses would be a fraud. Is that a valid reason to question the current election? It is currently the most "valid" reason they have found. This election was not even a close one either. Biden CRUSHED Mr. One and done.

I assume nothing of the sort. I'm observing the alleged irregularities in this election, and my post clearly calls out 'if true'.

The entire chaos surrounding this election was planned by the Democrats, including the vote by mail and other proposed national institution destructions.

• Pelosi’s HR 1 is a threat to free speech
  
  
• PART 2—AUTOMATIC VOTER REGISTRATION
• Sec. 1031. Same day registration.
• Sec. 2201. Findings relating to District of Columbia statehood.
  
  
• Specifically, the bill expands voter registration and voting access and limits removing voters from voter rolls.
  
  
• “SEC. 307. Promoting ability of voters to vote by mail.
  “(a) In General.—If an individual in a State is eligible to cast a vote in an election for Federal office, the State may not impose any additional conditions or requirements on the eligibility of the individual to cast the vote in such election by absentee ballot by mail, except as required under subsection (b) and except to the extent that the State imposes a deadline for requesting the ballot and related voting materials from the appropriate State or local election official and for returning the ballot to the appropriate State or local election official.

HR1 wasn't taken up by the Senate being recognized for the danger to the Republic that it contained, thank goodness.

But yes, the chaos of this election was the Democrat's plan from very early on (Introduced 01/03/2019), and the pandemic was the excuse used to shovel in the mail in voting, i.e. uncontrolled distribution of absentee voting applications (previously, they had to be voter requested - so a control and protection of the voting, which was eliminated).

 

[washunut]

I understand the claim that the hundreds of witnesses are all liars and it is A-OK if the chips, mail in envelopes and ballots are throw away to prevent any auditing. But even if true, that means that it is literally impossible to have any way to know if the election was legitimate or not. Lack of prove of a crime or who committed it never means there was no crime. Despite this, massive billions upon billions are spent on the election and campaigning.

Rather than having fake elections for show, should elections be eliminated? A small group of the international super rich own all television stations, newspapers and nearly all internet "news" outlets that now are censoring anything contrary to their profit and power interests. There is no manner to police mail-in ballots since all this is done by partisan political election offices on a local basis for which it only takes one corrupt partisan official to completely reverse election outcomes with exactly nothing anyone can do about it.

Wouldn't it be more truth to have a committee consisting of the top 12 richest people in the USA, the current heads of the NSA, CIA, DOJ and FBI, and the top Republican and Democrat of the Senate and House to meet and elect the president. An alternative would be to have the Senate or House of Representatives pick the president - or some other parliamentary system? If each state's legislature picked their electors directly it would preserve the electoral college.

This isn't the first time a presidential election may have been tampered with and probably will not be the last. Most congressional seats are gerrymandered, a different form of tampering. Elections are necessary to give the unwashed a sense of fairness of those governing IMHO.

 

[lwf]

No. Presidential elections are 100% accurate in that they are binary. The one who gets the most votes is the president. Full stop. The existence of a few questionable ballots is irrelevant when the margin is in the millions.

 

[Perotista]

I understand the claim that the hundreds of witnesses are all liars and it is A-OK if the chips, mail in envelopes and ballots are throw away to prevent any auditing. But even if true, that means that it is literally impossible to have any way to know if the election was legitimate or not. Lack of prove of a crime or who committed it never means there was no crime. Despite this, massive billions upon billions are spent on the election and campaigning.

Rather than having fake elections for show, should elections be eliminated? A small group of the international super rich own all television stations, newspapers and nearly all internet "news" outlets that now are censoring anything contrary to their profit and power interests. There is no manner to police mail-in ballots since all this is done by partisan political election offices on a local basis for which it only takes one corrupt partisan official to completely reverse election outcomes with exactly nothing anyone can do about it.

Wouldn't it be more truth to have a committee consisting of the top 12 richest people in the USA, the current heads of the NSA, CIA, DOJ and FBI, and the top Republican and Democrat of the Senate and House to meet and elect the president. An alternative would be to have the Senate or House of Representatives pick the president - or some other parliamentary system? If each state's legislature picked their electors directly it would preserve the electoral college.

The original intent of the framers was to have state legislatures cast electoral votes. The people elect their state legislatures to represent them, then as the people's representatives, they cast the states electoral votes. Or more commonly known as representative government.

 

[haymarket]

The reform that is needed is the elimination of the leftover from the 1700's - the Electoral College.

 

[pamak]

What are you trying to get at? Are you suggesting that voting fraud is protected by the Constitution or, at least, that investigating such accusations is prohibited?

I know you'll hate the link but the video in this link was part of the presentation in Georgia today. It shows people scanning ballots that were pulled from under a table and doing so well after the room had been cleared of observers. At a minimum, this shows something that needs to be investigated.
https://www.theepochtimes.com/state...dium=email&utm_campaign=breaking-2020-12-03-3

You have been douped again.

Here is what you saw in the video:

At night, the director of that center chose to send home most of his crew because they were so tired, it was counterproductive to keep them to continue counting. He retained though a few poll workers to continue counting up until about 2:00 am. . As the number of poll workers was reduced, it also reduced the requirement to retain the original number of monitors to observe them. So, some of the republican monitors who went home chose to mislead people by claiming in an affidavit that the counting continued after they went home which was technically correct but still misleading.

By the way, Georgia had a full recounting and the result did not change

 

[washunut]

The reform that is needed is the elimination of the leftover from the 1700's - the Electoral College.

Great idea. Lets get of the senate while we at it. Let California and New York run the country.

 

[Lutherf]

There is no evidence that there were actually unverified ballots. Yes, the video is concerning, but it is not really proof in and of itself. Let us suppose that you are correct for the sake of your argument. How would they then determine which ballots were unverified, or potentially fraudulent, a month later?

You're right that it isn't proof of anything other than an irregularity. That irregularity, however, needs to be explained. Someone else in this thread has claimed that it was just a function of thinning out the crew because there wasn't enough work to warrant retaining everyone at the processing center. If that's the case then what we saw might well be reasonable and simply a matter of poor management. However, ASSUMING that's the case is the wrong thing to do. At some point there needs to be a thorough audit of the ballots including tracing ballots back to voters and verifying that voters listed as voting actually did so knowingly. There isn't a need to audit every vote but auditing a sample large enough to provide a reasonable assurance of the integrity of the process is not only important but also necessary.

 

[Old 'N Chill]

Terrible Poll. No options for me to choose!

I bypassed it, consider it just another troll poll.

 

[haymarket]

Great idea. Lets get of the senate while we at it. Let California and New York run the country.

California and New York do not together have enough votes to do that. Your idea makes no sense.

 

[Xilnik]

You're right that it isn't proof of anything other than an irregularity. That irregularity, however, needs to be explained. Someone else in this thread has claimed that it was just a function of thinning out the crew because there wasn't enough work to warrant retaining everyone at the processing center. If that's the case then what we saw might well be reasonable and simply a matter of poor management. However, ASSUMING that's the case is the wrong thing to do. At some point there needs to be a thorough audit of the ballots including tracing ballots back to voters and verifying that voters listed as voting actually did so knowingly. There isn't a need to audit every vote but auditing a sample large enough to provide a reasonable assurance of the integrity of the process is not only important but also necessary.

Unfortunately, that is not possible with the way ballots are handled. Once the sleeve is verified, the sleeve is discarded, and the ballots are all that remain. We would have to change how ballots and sleeves are handled, e.g. having some ID # on the sleeve and ballot to cross reference in the event that an audit occurs while keeping both the ballots and the sleeves in separate filing areas to preserve secrecy unless it is necessary to perform an audit. For efficiency, we would then need machines that could sort the ballots and sleeves into matching containers after the fact.

 

[SMTA]

I understand the claim that the hundreds of witnesses are all liars and it is A-OK if the chips, mail in envelopes and ballots are throw away to prevent any auditing. But even if true, that means that it is literally impossible to have any way to know if the election was legitimate or not. Lack of prove of a crime or who committed it never means there was no crime. Despite this, massive billions upon billions are spent on the election and campaigning.

Rather than having fake elections for show, should elections be eliminated? A small group of the international super rich own all television stations, newspapers and nearly all internet "news" outlets that now are censoring anything contrary to their profit and power interests. There is no manner to police mail-in ballots since all this is done by partisan political election offices on a local basis for which it only takes one corrupt partisan official to completely reverse election outcomes with exactly nothing anyone can do about it.

Wouldn't it be more truth to have a committee consisting of the top 12 richest people in the USA, the current heads of the NSA, CIA, DOJ and FBI, and the top Republican and Democrat of the Senate and House to meet and elect the president. An alternative would be to have the Senate or House of Representatives pick the president - or some other parliamentary system? If each state's legislature picked their electors directly it would preserve the electoral college.

This is the all time stupidest thread ever.

 

[Xilnik]

I bypassed it, consider it just another troll poll.

You could have just said it is just another joko poll. I rarely participate in them unless I want to pick a response he considers serious but I consider sarcastic.

 

[iguanaman]

So, as far as you're concerned, it's fine to assume that there is no fraud but it's insane to consider video, statistical and testimonial evidence evidence that there might have been fraud.

You are assuming there is fraud because you do not like the results. Therefore you grasp at straws to prove your assumption. That is the optitime of a sore loser and in this case it means you are committing sedition. Americans must by definition accept losses as well as wins and yes that means you are no longer an American

 

[pamak]

There is no evidence that there were actually unverified ballots. Yes, the video is concerning, but it is not really proof in and of itself. Let us suppose that you are correct for the sake of your argument. How would they then determine which ballots were unverified, or potentially fraudulent, a month later?

The video is presented within a particuar context which some peope want to create.

Here is a link which gives a diffeent context:

Georgia opens 2 investigations into Fulton’s elections operations

The Secretary of State’s office is investigating how Fulton County handled the Nov. 3 election.

www.ajc.com

Barron said he sent almost all of his staff home because some were tired to the point of being “counter-productive.” And so GOP observers left because they thought counting was done for the night. But five county workers stayed to process more ballots until 1 a.m.

...

Sterling said investigators had pulled video footage from that night to determine what happened. Officials have said the state’s independent monitor was there to witness counting.

The monitor was approved the Friday before Election Day, when the State Elections Board signed a negotiated consent order with Fulton requiring the county continue to improve how it runs elections or face that $50,000 fine.

Anybody is free to believe that the republiccan monitors were too naive to leave the place when they were told to do so without making sure that everybody leaves including the indepedent monitor. Most probably, the reduction of the number of poll workers led to the reduction of the monitors' number and some of them who went home then made misleading comments that the counting continued "in secrecy" after they left.

 

[eohrnberger]

They are the only patriots left in your party. The rest are either traitors or spineless wimps. Which one are you?

Oh, that's a good one.

Are these the same guys that are threatening the Jones Day lawyers? One of the biggest law firms in the country? Simply for representing a client? Harass the lawyers at Jones Day for representing the Pennsylvania Republican Party in court?

Why, yes, yes they are.

So you are supporting those who would threaten and curtail someone's legal right to representation in the court of law, are you?

Seems to be me that you are the one with a fascism and tyranny problem as well as a problem with the law and the right of legal representation.
That kinda sucks on you.

 

[bearpoker]

I would rather have martial law, declare the current election invalid and give the Presidency to the rightful winner...Trump. (if it comes down to that)

And THEN...spend the next four years making sure this illegal election fraud can never happen again.

They should cut out the bullshit and let you pick the president.

 

[Antiwar]

MAGA has turned into GOO GOO GAGA.