LeoVlaming
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and the North won, ergo internal conflict.
We should memorialize Americans killed in conflict. there is no reason to marginalize over half a million dead and pretend nothing ever happened. honoring killed confederate soldiers is not honoring the political cause. you're probably the same person who would've been spitting on Vietnam veterans 40 years ago with that attitude. it is sometimes appropriate to separate politics from people.
remember, the south was brought back, slavery was abolished, and also we chose not to prosecute people for treason as a result of the war, and allowed each of the states to return.
Whether or not certain Southern States choose to honour the dead who fought in the Confederate Armies is for those States to decide.
I would point out that Germany and Russia both honour the dead from their wars, including the Second World War, and no reasonable person sees in that any question of honouring or whitewashing the atrocious nature of the regimes for which those soldiers died.
That's a fair point, outside of the meaningless and unnecessary Vietnam shot.
and the North won, ergo internal conflict.
We should memorialize Americans killed in conflict.
there is no reason to marginalize over half a million dead and pretend nothing ever happened. honoring killed confederate soldiers is not honoring the political cause. you're probably the same person who would've been spitting on Vietnam veterans 40 years ago with that attitude. it is sometimes appropriate to separate politics from people.
remember, the south was brought back, slavery was abolished, and also we chose not to prosecute people for treason as a result of the war, and allowed each of the states to return.
Also a fair point.
Honestly, as far as I'm concerned, the South can honor whoever they feel they have to. No skin off my ass.
That said, and this is obviously way before any of us were ever born, but it really pisses me off when those "the south will rise again" racist jerkoffs refer to the Civil War as the "War Of Northern Aggression" when THEY fired the first shots.
That's great, we still don't celebrate soldiers from another nation. Which the saw saw itself as. End of story?
The South never fought to overthrow the Northern Government. that's historical fact.Sure. IF they were part of the United States of America. If they fought to overthrow the US government in their states, and put in place a new one? They're traitors. :shrug:
Save the emotional arguments. Nobody cares for them. Also, you know the whole 'spitting' thing never really happened. Right?
Yep, you're not an American if you fight against the US government under the flag of another. That's treason and should not be celebrated. :shrug:
That's great, we still don't celebrate soldiers from another nation. Which the South saw itself as. End of story?
we celebrates vets of Foreign countries all the time.
The South never fought to overthrow the Northern Government. that's historical fact.
I've heard first hand accounts of it.
and what was in the better interests of the country? hangings all around, or working out the problems?
Did Union troops ever occupy Texas? No. They tried, and tried, and tried, and Texas whooped Union butt every single time.
Texas in the American Civil War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The U.S. Navy blockaded the principal seaport, Galveston, for four years, and federal infantry occupied the city for three months in late 1862.
A few other cities also fell to Union troops at times during the war, including Port Lavaca, Indianola, and Brownsville.
So you tend to agree with those that see this as a war between two different nations and the US "conquered" and "annexed" another country in this conflict?
You're entitled to your opinion, but I believe relatively few really serious people want to endorse the Southern cause in such an explicit way.
Vets... who fought against the US? WHO? WHEN? What holiday? Let me know when it's "Empire of Japan's Veterans Day" or "Nazi Germany's Veterans Days". I'd like to see who the hell is there other than you.
If they decided to secede and put a new government in a place, then they did in fact fight to overthrow the US government. Unless of course you find the creation of a new government as anything other than an overthrow.
That's great. I've also heard first hand accounts of alien abductions. It's still a myth. :shrug:
I never advocated such. all of my distant relatives in the civil war fought for the North. not a huge fan of neo confederatism either, but the reality is, there is nothing wrong with honoring war dead.... What... was in the best interest of the country? That's a personal perspective. What I do know is that it's treason to fight against the armed forces of the US government. If you find differently, may I suggest you refer your arguments to all of the American Jidahis we've bombed over in Yemen and Pakistan? I'm sure they'd love to use your arguments. If you feel differently, may I suggest you try and incite your own personal rebellion against the United States and its territories? Tell us how it works out and what the charges are. :shrug:
Nope. I'm saying that it's their perspective on the issue which should stop anyone within the United States from celebrating it. We don't celebrate traitors, or people who wage fights against the US government.
You're welcome to try and read through the thread so you don't take my words out of context.
You should try to think through what you write.
we don't have holidays,
but we frequently send dignitaries to foreign veterans events in official capacities (with your federal dollars) until recently (due to a very bad decision by Obama) we sent ambassadors to Russia's V-E day celebrations (which honors their WW2 vets, and the regime they fought for cannot in anyway be compared to the south) we sent officials, as did the British Royal Navy to the funeral of Admiral Donitz (commander of the Kreigsmarine, and second Fuhrer of the Third Reich after Hitlers suicide) etc etc etc.
to the best of my knowledge our ambassador to japan goes to that silly peacenik thing they do in Hiroshima every year.
not really, unless you call our country the product of an overthrow, in which case we can sympathize.
:roll:
I never advocated such. all of my distant relatives in the civil war fought for the North. not a huge fan of neo confederatism either, but the reality is, there is nothing wrong with honoring war dead.
Really? From your own cite:
and
Granted, there were few battles and fewer Union victories in Texas. Nevertheless, the state still surrendered after wholesale desertion and looting by its troops (also detailed in your cite).
So...Texas wins some battles and loses the war. Nope, it's Texas (and the rest of the Confederacy) with the butthurt.
That said, and this is obviously way before any of us were ever born, but it really pisses me off when those "the south will rise again" racist jerkoffs refer to the Civil War as the "War Of Northern Aggression" when THEY fired the first shots.
Being blockaded means ships were parked outside Galviston preventing any shipments out
not the same as being occupied.
They tried to occupy Galviston, but were given the ole Texas boot.
The U.S. Navy blockaded the principal seaport, Galveston, for four years, and federal infantry occupied the city for three months in late 1862.
Texas won nearly every battle it fought.
Granted, there were few battles and fewer Union victories in Texas.
A few other cities also fell to Union troops at times during the war, including Port Lavaca, Indianola, and Brownsville.
It surrendered because everyone else already had...a confederacy of one isn't really a confederacy per se.
. Quite the reverse, in fact.win that war and send you running back home with your tails between your legs.
Slavery was legal in several union states as well, so is it wrong to have memorials to union soldiers? or soldiers of the American Revolution? or the War of 1812 since we had slavery as a nation in those conflicts?
So we should have memorial day for Tories?
Yes
The South had a constitutional and legal right to secede. The Civil War was an illegal act perpetrated upon the South by Lincoln and his troops.
The subsequent federalization of our republic has been equally illegal and unjust, and it continues to this day
Please point to the provision in the Constitution that allows for secession.
Confederate Memorial Day - Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaWikipedia said:Confederate Memorial Day, also known as Confederate Decoration Day (Tennessee) and Confederate Heroes Day (Texas), is an official holiday and/or observance day in a number of states in the Southern United States as a day to honor those who died fighting for the Confederate States of America during the American Civil War.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorial_DayWikipedia said:Memorial Day is a federal holiday in the United States for remembering the people who died while serving in the country's armed forces.
The South had a legal right to secede. The civil war was an illegal act of aggression perpetrated against the Southern states who acted within their constitutional rights by seceding.
So inasmuch as southerners are traitors, northerners are usurpers whose disdain for the constitutional law of the land shattered the previously long-held precedent of states rights of self-determination
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