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Shades of the Six-Day War?

Demon of Light

Demon of Light

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Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and opposition chairman MK Shaul Mofaz (Kadima) reached a surprise agreement early Tuesday morning to form a national unity government.


The move came as the Knesset was preparing to disperse for early elections, which were expected to be scheduled for September 4.
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Source: Haaretz

This immediately struck me as reminiscent of the wartime government formed before Israel launched its "pre-emptive" war on Egypt. It seems there has been speculation that Sarkozy's defeat has increased the chances of a unilateral strike by Israel.
 
Demon of Light said:
Source: Haaretz

This immediately struck me as reminiscent of the wartime government formed before Israel launched its "pre-emptive" war on Egypt. It seems there has been speculation that Sarkozy's defeat has increased the chances of a unilateral strike by Israel.
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No.
Netanyahu doesn't need unity government to strike Iran, all the talks around early elections were forming because of the upcoming vote of the "Tal law" which is supposed to cancel the relieve from military duty for the orthodox Jews and obligate all citizens to do either military service or civilian community service. Netanyahu's government which majority is leaning on two orthodox parties could have never passed this vote, now with Kadima in the coalition, the orthodox parties will not be able to extort Netanyahu by threatening to leave the coalition and disperse the Knesset.
 
Demon of Light said:
Source: Haaretz

This immediately struck me as reminiscent of the wartime government formed before Israel launched its "pre-emptive" war on Egypt. It seems there has been speculation that Sarkozy's defeat has increased the chances of a unilateral strike by Israel.
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I don't agree. Israel does not need a unity government to launch a strike against Iran, if it chooses that path. Despite the sharp differences of view among Israel's political parties, there is overwhelming consensus when it comes to existential issues. If Israel concludes that it has no option but to try to take out Iran's nuclear facilities based on the assessment of its Defense and Intelligence communities, that policy will enjoy strong support, with few but insignificant exceptions. Currently, Israel is still trying to give the international community as much time as possible to resolve the issue of Iran's nuclear activities. However, time is not unlimited and Israel is not likely to completely subordinate existential matters to others. That does not mean that it won't accept a robust deterrence regime, but it won't rule out a military option either.
 
Did Israel need a unity government before the Six-Day War? No. Of course, avoiding an election for the time being would be necessary if Israel were planning an imminent strike.

Here is a little more:

Environment Minister Gilad Erdan said the accord would help build support for potential action against Iran's atomic program which Israel views as an existential threat.

"An election wouldn't stop Iran's nuclear program. When a decision is taken to attack or not, it is better to have a broad political front, that unites the public," he told Israel Radio.
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Source: Orlando Sentinel
 
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Demon of Light said:
Did Israel need a unity government before the Six-Day War? No. Of course, avoiding an election for the time being would be necessary if Israel were planning an imminent strike.

Here is a little more:



Source: Orlando Sentinel
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And Mufaz is one of the leaders who opposed an attack on Iran saying its Bibi's way to distract public opinion from this governments failures in the social field, crime, health and peace process... The unity coalition isn't making life easy for Netanyahu on a decision whether or not to attack Iran, it was already easy before that, he would have been backed by the opposition any way, it does help him keep his chair for one more year and hop over the obstacles he should face soon - the evacuation of the Ulpana neighborhood in beit el (should have been just before the elections and would have cost him lots of right wing voters) and the Tal law which would have caused either Yisrael Beyteinu or the Orthodox parties to leave the coalition and disperse the Knesset.
 
gunner said:
It looks to have been for a multitude of reasons

"Netanyahu said the new coalition would focus on four areas: ending controversial draft exemptions granted to ultra-Orthodox males; reforming the volatile political system; protecting the economy; and promoting a "responsible" peace process with the Palestinians"

Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu unveils new government - Middle East - World - The Independent

Paul
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Paul, the coalition is meant to keep Kadima in the political scene for a little more time, all the polls show Kadima is about to lose ~15 seats (they have 28 seats today) and put the labor party 2nd largest after the Likud. Netanyahu on the other hand won't have to evacuate a settlement in a middle of an elections campaign as supreme court ruled he has to do it by July 1st.

If there will be a reform in the "equal burden" issue and the change of political system than this will be a good thing, but with 3 pathological lairs leading the country, I doubt it. The only change in the political system I see Bibi promote is making him a monarch, hell he has 90+ KMs in the coalition now, he is as close as anyone can get to do so. In 96 I remember the Likud supporters singing "Bibi king of Israel" paraphrasing the song "David king of Israel", who knows...

Anyways, after hijacking 28 mandates from their voters, Kadima is doomed and will probably cease to exist after next elections
 
Demon of Light said:
I just remembered what happened last week. Remember this?:

Six army battalions called up under emergency orders to meet growing threat on Egypt, Syria borders | The Times of Israel

So, a week after authorizing an emergency mobilization, Israel is suddenly forming a national unity government.
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Sure? An emergency mobilization of a thousand troops. Must be for an all out assault on Egypt, Syria and Jordan, just like the 6 day war...

Maybe soon they can start digging the thousands of graves to be ready for the mass casualties that were expected when Egypt launched its "war of annihilation" - oh, sorry - as subtrefuge to pretend that they actually were concerned about being attacked while they plotted world domination.
 
The Six Day war was hardly unprovoked.
 
CJ 2.0 said:
Sure? An emergency mobilization of a thousand troops. Must be for an all out assault on Egypt, Syria and Jordan, just like the 6 day war...

Maybe soon they can start digging the thousands of graves to be ready for the mass casualties that were expected when Egypt launched its "war of annihilation" - oh, sorry - as subtrefuge to pretend that they actually were concerned about being attacked while they plotted world domination.
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:roll: What a horrifically ridiculous response. Six battalions is not "a thousand troops" even if they were dinky little battalions and we were only counting them since the authorization allows them to summon up to 22 battalions altogether, which puts the actual number of reservists being called up at a likely minimum of 10,000. The explanation that it is about growing unrest in Egypt and Syria seems too much like a cover.
 
Demon of Light said:
I just remembered what happened last week. Remember this?:

Six army battalions called up under emergency orders to meet growing threat on Egypt, Syria borders | The Times of Israel

So, a week after authorizing an emergency mobilization, Israel is suddenly forming a national unity government.
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Gosh. I wonder if one major neighboring nation has recently moved to toss overboard a historic peace agreement, and another has recently devolved into bloody chaos? Wonder if a third is developing an existential threat?

Nah. Egypt and Syria surely don't exist. Iran is just enriching uranium as part of a high school science project.



A "cover"? How in the world would Israel need a "cover"?
 
ah yes Israel's "pre-emptive" war on Egypt simalar of course to Polands famous "pre-emptive" war on Germany in 1939.
 
Demon of Light said:
Source: Haaretz

This immediately struck me as reminiscent of the wartime government formed before Israel launched its "pre-emptive" war on Egypt. It seems there has been speculation that Sarkozy's defeat has increased the chances of a unilateral strike by Israel.
Click to expand...


Nah...in my opinion this one with Iran will be longer than six days..months, maybe be even more, until the job is done (to 70% or 80% at least)
 
Demon of Light said:
:roll: What a horrifically ridiculous response. Six battalions is not "a thousand troops" even if they were dinky little battalions and we were only counting them since the authorization allows them to summon up to 22 battalions altogether, which puts the actual number of reservists being called up at a likely minimum of 10,000. The explanation that it is about growing unrest in Egypt and Syria seems too much like a cover.
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You keep pushing with this argument when it just points your ignorance, and we've already discussed this on a different thread.

The IDF didn't call up 6 brigades to the border, the issue reported in Israeli media is that the IDF requested the government a special authorization to call up battalions which already did a reserve duty at the last 3 years, not necessarily at the same time (Israeli law states reserve duty at operational duty is no more than once every 3 years) because its short on manpower, this article makes it sound like Israel is building up massive reserve forces along the border...
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http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...meet-threat-egypt-w-8-a-2.html#post1060461941

In case on an emergency call in the southern border, I would be wearing uniform right now and not at work commenting on your paranoia as our brigade in one of the first to be called in case of an emergency in the south.
 
cpwill said:
Gosh. I wonder if one major neighboring nation has recently moved to toss overboard a historic peace agreement, and another has recently devolved into bloody chaos? Wonder if a third is developing an existential threat?

Nah. Egypt and Syria surely don't exist. Iran is just enriching uranium as part of a high school science project.



A "cover"? How in the world would Israel need a "cover"?
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Please read the thread. I only noted the mobilization because just a week later we have this surprise national unity government. Here is another one of those ominous reports, this one after the unity government:

During the meeting, the Israelis presented a rigid set of demands for the Iranians, a senior Israeli official said. Netanyahu and the three ministers told Ashton that Israel's position leading up to the Baghdad talks is that the talks will be considered as progress only if they would yield an Iranian guarantee – with a clear timetable – to halt uranium enrichment, to remove all enriched uranium out of Iranian soil, and to dismantle the underground enrichment facility in Fordo, which is near Qom.

"Iran is trying to gain time through talks with the West, and has no intention of halting its nuclear program," Netanyahu told Ashton at the meeting.

According to a report published by Israeli newspaper Maariv on Wednesday, several officials who took part in the coalitional negotiations between Mofaz and Netanyahu said the two are "coordinated" over the issue of Iran and are "of one mind" when it comes to stopping Iran's nuclear program.

Despite the fact that the report did not explain the significance of that coordination, it was hinted that, ostensibly, Mofaz changed his mind once more and now supports an attack on Iran. In recent weeks, and even more forcefully since he won the elections to become head of Kadima, Mofaz vigorously attacked Netanyahu over the issue of Iran, claiming he was "frightening the public."
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Source: Haaretz
 
Good. Hopefully that get's Iran to actually put an end to this. Sadly, I don't think they will, and a strike will become necessary to avoid a nuclear-armed Iran.
 
Hmmmm.....


"Cabinet members who oppose a strike on Iran said on Wednesday Kadima head Shaul Mofaz might backtrack and align with the more hawkish Benjamin Netanyahu, now that the two are in the same government ... One member of the forum told Haaretz that Mofaz had been inconsistent about key security issues in the past. "He thought the [Gaza] disengagement was a mistake and that we shouldn't pull out without an agreement," the minister said. "But then he saw that [then-Prime Minister] Ariel Sharon was determined, and he aligned himself with him. The same might happen in the case of Iran."

Israeli ministers fear Mofaz will flip-flop and support strike on Iran - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News
 
shanners said:
Hmmmm.....


"Cabinet members who oppose a strike on Iran said on Wednesday Kadima head Shaul Mofaz might backtrack and align with the more hawkish Benjamin Netanyahu, now that the two are in the same government ... One member of the forum told Haaretz that Mofaz had been inconsistent about key security issues in the past. "He thought the [Gaza] disengagement was a mistake and that we shouldn't pull out without an agreement," the minister said. "But then he saw that [then-Prime Minister] Ariel Sharon was determined, and he aligned himself with him. The same might happen in the case of Iran."

Israeli ministers fear Mofaz will flip-flop and support strike on Iran - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News
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hmmm what? he might also help Netanyahu promote settlement freeze which will lead to peace talks with the Palestinians... he might also wear a tutu and dance on the Knesset podium... lets not get into the "he might" zone...

The unity government is a political survival maneuver made by Kadima to gain some extra time before dissolving completely, and until we'll see some evidence that it has anything to do with the "Tal law" as Mufaz claim or Iran as the anti-Israeli paranoids try to claim, it will just remain a political spin.
 
ido_ said:
The unity government is a political survival maneuver made by Kadima to gain some extra time before dissolving completely, and until we'll see some evidence that it has anything to do with the "Tal law" as Mufaz claim or Iran as the anti-Israeli paranoids try to claim, it will just remain a political spin.
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Seriously dude, it is not "paranoid" to think something is afoot when you have such an unexpected development. Nor is it "anti-Israeli" to suggest Israel might be preparing for imminent "pre-emptive" war. Unless you think all of these news reports are also from "anti-Israeli paranoids" your attacks against me are pretty much just overheated rhetoric.
 
Demon of Light said:
Seriously dude, it is not "paranoid" to think something is afoot when you have such an unexpected development. Nor is it "anti-Israeli" to suggest Israel might be preparing for imminent "pre-emptive" war. Unless you think all of these news reports are also from "anti-Israeli paranoids" your attacks against me are pretty much just overheated rhetoric.
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When foreign media covers Israel it takes it to where it wants to take it, Iran-Israel, who gives a **** in the US or in Europe whether or not orthodox jews go to the army or not, what knowledge do they have or the average reader of their news have about Israeli internal politics? Zero. It reminds me of Israeli media cover of american elections, also always on the attitude on Iran and Israel, as if Americans cast their vote based on Israel rather than the fact that their economy is going downhill. Not everything in Israeli politics evolve around Iran and the Palestinians, in fact most doesn't, not today anyways, sometimes things are just what they seem to be, petty political spins made by spineless politicians

These hypothesis are as good as the hypothesis that Mufaz will push Netanyahu for a deal with the Palestinians, thats what his party was elected for after all.

As for being anti-Israeli or not, I read your crap and shanners crap far to long to base my opinion on you from this single thread... and I'm not sure where I was attacking you...
 
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ido_ said:
When foreign media covers Israel it takes it to where it wants to take it, Iran-Israel, who gives a **** in the US or in Europe whether or not orthodox jews go to the army or not, what knowledge do they have or the average reader of their news have about Israeli internal politics? Zero. It reminds me of Israeli media cover of american elections, also always on the attitude on Iran and Israel, as if Americans cast their vote based on Israel rather than the fact that their economy is going downhill. Not everything in Israeli politics evolve around Iran and the Palestinians, in fact most doesn't, not today anyways, sometimes things are just what they seem to be, petty political spins made by spineless politicians.
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I don't presume that everything in Israel is about Iran, but the circumstances here are a bit different. Netanyahu was in a position where an election was actually more favorable to him than continuing the coalition. There was potential for him to have sidelined Labor, the haredim parties, and Kadima while still being able to form a majority government, a situation where the opposition would be weak and divided. Either way he would have likely come out of an election with a much stronger position. Certainly Mofaz had plenty of reason to join such a government, but there is no discernible reason why Netanyahu would agree.

The simple fact is that national unity governments in Israel tend to only pop up during or prior to periods of war. If no major operation or war is imminent then this would probably be the first time that would not be the case. Of course, maybe Netanyahu really is just concerned about developments in Egypt and Syria, though it seems a little less compelling to me as neither of those situations have anything new about them. When it gets down to it the most likely explanation is that they plan to do something about Iran and want a united government for that purpose.
 
Demon of Light said:
I don't presume that everything in Israel is about Iran, but the circumstances here are a bit different. Netanyahu was in a position where an election was actually more favorable to him than continuing the coalition. There was potential for him to have sidelined Labor, the haredim parties, and Kadima while still being able to form a majority government, a situation where the opposition would be weak and divided. Either way he would have likely come out of an election with a much stronger position. Certainly Mofaz had plenty of reason to join such a government, but there is no discernible reason why Netanyahu would agree.
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Netanyahu went to elections because his coalition would have fallen apart in July when the "Tal Law" would expire, it means either the orthodox parties which are 16 seats in the Knesset or Liberman's Yisrael Beyteinu which have 15 seats in the Knesset would have dropped out of the coalition leading to elections, this was the grounds for him declaring he is not afraid to go to elections, when he did that Kadima, the Labor and the new party Yesh Atid started the race in the media "who will bring the offer to disperse the Knesset first" which Netanyahu couldn't lose. Meanwhile polls shown that Labor is getting stronger while Kadima is crashing and that the day after elections Netanyahu will have a hard time forming a "right wing" coalition as he did last elections and will have to join hands with one of the major central, central-left parties. Add to this Supreme court ruling that he will have to evacuate illegal buildings in one of the biggest settlements in the west bank in the middle of the elections campaign (supreme court ruled to evacuate it by 1st of July) while the Labor are getting stronger and stronger, he had every reason to add Kadima. Now he has a very large coalition where non of the parties in it can extort him by taking it apart.

The simple fact is that national unity governments in Israel tend to only pop up during or prior to periods of war. If no major operation or war is imminent then this would probably be the first time that would not be the case. Of course, maybe Netanyahu really is just concerned about developments in Egypt and Syria, though it seems a little less compelling to me as neither of those situations have anything new about them. When it gets down to it the most likely explanation is that they plan to do something about Iran and want a united government for that purpose.
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Where do you come up with these "simple facts" ???
Israel had 3 unity government between 84-92, 1 at 2001 and 1 at 2005, non of them at war time, the last one was actually in order to execute the disengagement from Gaza
I would even add the Kadima government to this list, as they partnered with labor, the 2nd largest party in the Knesset at that time.
 
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