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School uniforms

What is your position on School uniforms in Public schools?

  • It should be up to the district - I see no issues with it.

    Votes: 22 36.1%
  • Totally disagree - economic, social, or government impediment issue. [please post]

    Votes: 22 36.1%
  • The parents should decide via election

    Votes: 14 23.0%
  • Not sure either way

    Votes: 3 4.9%

  • Total voters
    61

MeChMAN

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Fantasea said:
anomaly said:
Individualism among school kids looks like this.

The girls struggle to reveal as much skin as possible and make sure that the boys get a good look at their lingerie. They apply warpaint with a touch so delicate as to make a Sioux brave jealous. They punch holes wherever they can and fill them up with scrap metal.

The boys start from the top and work down. Hairdos that defy belief in shape and phony color. Ears drilled and filled to make the girls look like pikers. Shirts unworthy of the name carrying whatever degree of obscenity they can get away with. Pants that with the aid of a couple of poles could be pitched as tents, yet can't quite cover the butt crack. For years none have worn shoes and if they ever did, would not know how to tie them. Just a succession of athletic shoes, even though they are not athletes, in which they shuffle to and fro as penguins slithering along on ice.

This is the individuality to which you allude.

Since we can't shoot irresponsible parents and you oppose uniforms on juvenile grounds, perhaps there is an alternative that you would like to propose.
We are not creating soldiers we are making individuals that have to learn to make their own decisions in life. I understand that the clothes kids wear is not always appropriate for a learning enviornment. So I would like to propose an alternative to the prison style type of learning enviornment that the school and misunderstood parents are trying to create. It's simple, just be strict let the kids pick their own clothing but when it becomes a disstraction don't make them go home just tell them not to wear that item of clothing again. Simple as that. I guess parents don't remember being a kid in school, because if they did they would remember how the teachers and school board despised what they wear and this is no different than now so why force uniforms on your kids when you never had to wear them.
 

The Thing

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vauge said:
This was an incorrect asumption on my behalf. Same IP address, but I researched it more.

Nice homepages btw guys. You should link to it in your signatures, and thank you for the link to us.

Welcome to Debate Politics!!
Everyone is human. Thanks for checking out our website. :)
 

Fantasea

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KrazyPrince said:
From your observations,HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. I'm a STUDENT that has been in over a half a dozen scool systems. From MY observations (and there is a good deal of it), what I said earlier is very true.Oh, and I wasn't being humoring.
From the quality of your spelling, punctuation, grammar, sentence formation, etc., one easily could have guessed that.

I notice, too, that you rarely address a point and attempt to refute it. You just toss off wisecracks and denials. Why is that?
 

Fantasea

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MeChMAN said:
Fantasea said:
We are not creating soldiers we are making individuals that have to learn to make their own decisions in life.
If what you say is true, then why should we even bother to send them to school? Afer all, isn't one of the more important benefits of a good education the learning of how to be able to make decisions which are in one's best interests? Adults who don't know how to do this never learned as children.
I understand that the clothes kids wear is not always appropriate for a learning enviornment. So I would like to propose an alternative to the prison style type of learning enviornment that the school and misunderstood parents are trying to create.
Prison style learning environment? Is dressing in a considerate, dignified, modest, plain style your idea if a prison environment? Or, are you simply out of touch with anything not adolescent?
It's simple, just be strict let the kids pick their own clothing but when it becomes a disstraction don't make them go home just tell them not to wear that item of clothing again. Simple as that.
It is not that simple. It begins with an enforceable definition of what is a distraction, when does a distraction rise to the level of concern, and what, specifically, caused the distraction. It would provide a field day for the ACLU who would be called by parents who have no control over their kids.
I guess parents don't remember being a kid in school, because if they did they would remember how the teachers and school board despised what they wear and this is no different than now so why force uniforms on your kids when you never had to wear them.
If kids today dressed and behaved the way their parents did, the problem we are discussing, how to better educate children, would be a lot easier to solve, wouldn't it?
 

MeChMAN

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It is prison style when all the kids have to dress exactly the same. You don't see too many prisoners with a right to wear the clothing of their choice. Why don't we just have kids wear orange jumpsuits and stand in formation to do roll call before entering a class room. As far as being out of touch with adolescents yeah I probably am I don't wear obscene shirts, hell I don't wear any shirts that have writing on them. I don't have peircings or tattoos so I guess I am out of touch with your misunderstood picture of adolescent life. Hey my parents have told me about the way they dressed and the way they took alot of flack from their parents and teachers over their look. The next generation is no different from the preceding one. This uniform thing will never work anyway because we live in a democracy.
 

Chaos10187

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MeChMAN said:
It is prison style when all the kids have to dress exactly the same. You don't see too many prisoners with a right to wear the clothing of their choice. Why don't we just have kids wear orange jumpsuits and stand in formation to do roll call before entering a class room. As far as being out of touch with adolescents yeah I probably am I don't wear obscene shirts, hell I don't wear any shirts that have writing on them. I don't have peircings or tattoos so I guess I am out of touch with your misunderstood picture of adolescent life. Hey my parents have told me about the way they dressed and the way they took alot of flack from their parents and teachers over their look. The next generation is no different from the preceding one. This uniform thing will never work anyway because we live in a democracy.
Equality is not a challenge of freedom. You still have a choice.
 

Naughty Nurse

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Fantasea said:
From the quality of your spelling, punctuation, grammar, sentence formation, etc., one easily could have guessed that.
People who live in glass houses, Fantasea.:naughty

Will you never desist with the grammar fascism?
 

Fantasea

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MeChMAN said:
It is prison style when all the kids have to dress exactly the same. You don't see too many prisoners with a right to wear the clothing of their choice. Why don't we just have kids wear orange jumpsuits and stand in formation to do roll call before entering a class room. As far as being out of touch with adolescents yeah I probably am I don't wear obscene shirts, hell I don't wear any shirts that have writing on them. I don't have peircings or tattoos so I guess I am out of touch with your misunderstood picture of adolescent life. Hey my parents have told me about the way they dressed and the way they took alot of flack from their parents and teachers over their look. The next generation is no different from the preceding one. This uniform thing will never work anyway because we live in a democracy.
I asked, a while back, for solutions to the problem of why so many kids do poorly in school.

Thus far, no solutions, only complaints about uniforms.
 

MeChMAN

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Fantasea said:
I asked, a while back, for solutions to the problem of why so many kids do poorly in school.

Thus far, no solutions, only complaints about uniforms.

I gave you the solution a while back for the problem of kids doing poorly in school.

Thus far, no compliance, just selfish complaints about children having freedom in a free nation
 

Fantasea

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MeChMAN said:
I gave you the solution a while back for the problem of kids doing poorly in school.

Thus far, no compliance, just selfish complaints about children having freedom in a free nation
Kindly tell us how you would implement and monitor compliance with the solution you proposed.

If your solution could not be implemented or monotired, would we then give up and continue to accept the failure of so many kids to become educated?
 

gypsy0032

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What about the "uniforms should be implemented" option? I went to a Catholic High School where uniforms were mandatory, for 2 years anyway. I think they should be implemented across the board.
 

Chaos10187

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gypsy0032 said:
What about the "uniforms should be implemented" option? I went to a Catholic High School where uniforms were mandatory, for 2 years anyway. I think they should be implemented across the board.
I personally think it should be left up to the district. Always give the people a choice. As I said a while back, if they dont like uniforms, give the families an alternative, such as another school district where uniforms are optional. If you enforced it across the board there would be complains and protests about the uniforms being a challenge of freedom, no real way around that.
 

gypsy0032

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Chaos10187 said:
I personally think it should be left up to the district. Always give the people a choice. As I said a while back, if they dont like uniforms, give the families an alternative, such as another school district where uniforms are optional. If you enforced it across the board there would be complains and protests about the uniforms being a challenge of freedom, no real way around that.
Very true.
However, school is supposed to be a place of education, not a fashion show. I think that uniforms would alleviate more problems than they would cause. I can already feel the flames headed my way.:D
 

Chaos10187

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gypsy0032 said:
Very true.
However, school is supposed to be a place of education, not a fashion show. I think that uniforms would alleviate more problems than they would cause. I can already feel the flames headed my way.:D
At the beginning yes, but I feel after everyone stops complaining, they would get used to it.
 

IndependentTexan

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Chaos10187 said:
At the beginning yes, but I feel after everyone stops complaining, they would get used to it.
Look, my school voted on rather or not to get uniforms. They sent a voting flyer to every home in my city. Kids, however, didn't get a say in this. They were just tossed aside. Some people that voted didn't even have kids that were in school. The voting was 80% to 20 percent in favor, without the vote of 8,000 kids. If we have uniforms, what will we be teaching our kids? It will be giving a message about how individuality isn't important. It will show to just go along with the flow. As a student, I want to be able to wear what I want and feel good about myself. Dress code is the main reason why we are getting uniforms. But the teachers don't even enforce the dress code. about 20% of students are breaking dress code. Why don't they just enforce it instead of punishing the 80% who do comply to the dress code? Uniforms will do nothing but anger the students. It will just inflame the situation further.
 

Fantasea

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IndependentTexan said:
Look, my school voted on rather or not to get uniforms. They sent a voting flyer to every home in my city. Kids, however, didn't get a say in this. They were just tossed aside. Some people that voted didn't even have kids that were in school. The voting was 80% to 20 percent in favor, without the vote of 8,000 kids. If we have uniforms, what will we be teaching our kids? It will be giving a message about how individuality isn't important. It will show to just go along with the flow. As a student, I want to be able to wear what I want and feel good about myself. Dress code is the main reason why we are getting uniforms. But the teachers don't even enforce the dress code. about 20% of students are breaking dress code. Why don't they just enforce it instead of punishing the 80% who do comply to the dress code? Uniforms will do nothing but anger the students. It will just inflame the situation further.
As you note, there is a problem that is being caused by about 1,600 students. If the remaining 6,400 students are unable to convince them to 'wise up', then what choice is left?

If all of the students dress alike, they'll all feel alike. After school, change into whatever you wish.
 

Gabo

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Fantasea said:
If all of the students dress alike, they'll all feel alike.
Yet another step towards mediocrity, collectivism, and elimination of individuality.


If we continue this pace, we'll eliminate all free will and abstract thinking from our offspring in no time!


That'll be the perfect setting for them to ignore the horrible crisis the government is in, and encourage them to simply vote between our two money-hoarding socialist parties without questioning anything the government ever does.
 

Fantasea

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Gabo said:
Yet another step towards mediocrity, collectivism, and elimination of individuality.


If we continue this pace, we'll eliminate all free will and abstract thinking from our offspring in no time!


That'll be the perfect setting for them to ignore the horrible crisis the government is in, and encourage them to simply vote between our two money-hoarding socialist parties without questioning anything the government ever does.
Perhaps uniforms will instill the kind of esprit de corps in the student body what will permit the elimination of metal detectors and armed guards in public schools.

By the way, does anyone know of a private or parochial school, even in an inner city ghetto, which utilizes metal detectors or armed guards?
 

IndependentTexan

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Fantasea said:
As you note, there is a problem that is being caused by about 1,600 students. If the remaining 6,400 students are unable to convince them to 'wise up', then what choice is left?

If all of the students dress alike, they'll all feel alike. After school, change into whatever you wish.

Enforcing the dress code is not our responsibility, it is the school's. If the school can't make the 1,600 students meet the dress code standards that is their fault. Our school doesn't even enforce the dress code strictly. Even if they make us wear uniforms, what will stop the 1,600 students from not wearing them? and I am sure that some of the 6,400 students will rally and not wear them either.
 

Fantasea

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IndependentTexan said:
Enforcing the dress code is not our responsibility, it is the school's. If the school can't make the 1,600 students meet the dress code standards that is their fault. Our school doesn't even enforce the dress code strictly. Even if they make us wear uniforms, what will stop the 1,600 students from not wearing them? and I am sure that some of the 6,400 students will rally and not wear them either.
So, I guess that that mysterious "peer pressure" thing is just a myth.
 

anomaly

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Gabo said:
Yet another step towards mediocrity, collectivism, and elimination of individuality.


If we continue this pace, we'll eliminate all free will and abstract thinking from our offspring in no time!


That'll be the perfect setting for them to ignore the horrible crisis the government is in, and encourage them to simply vote between our two money-hoarding socialist parties without questioning anything the government ever does.
I'd hardly consider uniforms a 'collectivist' effort, as the majority doesn't want them. Also, you must realize that neither the Republican nor Democratic even accept socialism. They are hardly socialist, which is why we saw inequality rise throughout the 90s even with a Dem president.
 

Gabo

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anomaly said:
Also, you must realize that neither the Republican nor Democratic even accept socialism. They are hardly socialist, which is why we saw inequality rise throughout the 90s even with a Dem president.
Oh yes, of course the US isn't socialist....



PS: I definitely wouldn't want to let slip the fact that the US currently follows (either completely or partially) EVERY SINGLE POINT in the Communist Manifesto.
 
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