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Schiavo was brain dead

shuamort

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What's also interesting is that the autopsy showed no abuse either (which was claimed as being done by her husband).
 

Squawker

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I didn't believe that abuse story as she was bulimic, but this gives "closure". Don't ya love that word? barf. The parents may never accept the results though and that will be unfortunate.
 

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Pacridge said:
So much for the reports of her asking for a diet coke. Seems Bill First is actually not any better at medical diagnoses then he is at being a politician.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&u=/ap/20050615/ap_on_re_us/schiavo_autopsy_18
Yes I'd like to see Bobby Schindler explain his statements that she recognized people when they came into the room and joked with them.

Or the nurses who signed affidavits saying they took her out into the lobby and she joked with them.

She did not have the parts of the brain which account of cognitive functions.

Even if she had any cognitive function apparently she was blind. My mother has been blind for 40 years, she is fully cognitive but can't recognize people when they walk into room.

The autopshy shows that the court appointed doctors told the truth, the court appointed guardians ad litem's told the truth, that her husband and his family accurately spoke or her condition. It shows that the Schindler family spoke from misguided emotion at best, out right lies at worse. I thought Bobby was a liar and a con man from the start, I still believe that.
 

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Squawker said:
I didn't believe that abuse story as she was bulimic, but this gives "closure". Don't ya love that word? barf. The parents may never accept the results though and that will be unfortunate.
I can't fault her parents. I have no idea what I would do should something happen to my daughter. I would hope I'd be able to listen to the doctors and would be able to "let her go." But I don't think any one can say what their reaction would be until face with the situation.

I do hold the people who turned this into a circus to blame. Many purely for their own gain. And I include the press to blame, at least partly. Reporting every lame story they could find, exploiting the poor family in an effort to make money, sick. And the politicians who tried to use her sad situation for political gain was also sick.
 
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shuamort

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Frist: Schiavo autopsy results end case

Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, a surgeon who had questioned Terri Schiavo's diagnosis during the intense national debate on whether to remove her feeding tube, said the autopsy documenting her severe brain damage brings "a very sad chapter to a close."

Frist, R-Tenn., said he never made his own diagnosis but did argue there wasn't enough information about Schiavo's condition to justify allowing her husband to remove her feeding tube against her parents' wishes.

"I raised the question, 'Is she in a persistent vegetative state or not?' I never made the diagnosis, never said that she was not. I did say that certain tests should be performed to determine that before starving her to death," Frist said in the interview.

"The diagnosis they made is exactly right. It's the pathology, I'll respect that. I think it's time to move on," Frist said on CBS' "The Early Show."
Back in March:
Frist, a heart surgeon and senator with White House ambitions, questioned the physicians' diagnosis in a Senate speech. He said he had viewed a videotape of Schiavo, read medical documents submitted to court and talked to a neurologist who had seen her.
More
As debate began last week over a bill that would let a federal court hear Schiavo's case, thereby extending her life, Frist, a heart-lung surgeon from Tennessee, questioned the diagnosis.

"I question it based on a review of the video footage ... And that footage, to me, depicted something very different than persistent vegetative state," Frist said last Thursday, explaining he had also spoken to members of Schiavo's family and neurologists who reviewed her case.
 

Pacridge

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shuamort said:
Yeah but those two sources or quotes come from Newsmax. They're so bad they almost make FNC look legit, almost.

But this time they may actually have reported something factual, that surely doesn't happen everyday. Least not at Newsmax. I saw Frist on CNN making those very statements. He clearly said the video he saw was very different from the vegetative state her doctors claimed she was in.
 

ShamMol

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Pacridge said:
I can't fault her parents. I have no idea what I would do should something happen to my daughter. I would hope I'd be able to listen to the doctors and would be able to "let her go." But I don't think any one can say what their reaction would be until face with the situation.

I do hold the people who turned this into a circus to blame. Many purely for their own gain. And I include the press to blame, at least partly. Reporting every lame story they could find, exploiting the poor family in an effort to make money, sick. And the politicians who tried to use her sad situation for political gain was also sick.
Her parents are likely going to file suit or something, but I have no idea on what grounds...probably malpractice, that seems to be the only avenue.

I hold everyone responsible, not the people who kept conversations about this by the "water cooler," but those who brought it out. The parents, the church-goers who got involved for pure theatrics, the politicians, and most importantly the media. The love of media hype by our country has increased so much since Billy Boy's romp in the hay that now anything can be blown into a huge thing.
 

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ShamMol said:
Her parents are likely going to file suit or something, but I have no idea on what grounds...probably malpractice, that seems to be the only avenue.
Against who? The malpractice suits were settled years ago.


I hold everyone responsible
For what?

not the people who kept conversations about this by the "water cooler," but those who brought it out. The parents, the church-goers who got involved for pure theatrics, the politicians, and most importantly the media. The love of media hype by our country has increased so much since Billy Boy's romp in the hay that now anything can be blown into a huge thing.
From the stand-point that probably a couple of hundred people have died or been allowed to die under similar circumstances since Terri's death and none of them were made a national issue I see your point. I find it upsetting that Hannity is now trying to start a case against her husband with his "we must go back to the beginning because the autopsy did not concluded what caused this in the first place" and Furman trying to insinuate that her husband may have caused it while at the same time presenting nothing at all that points to that. Or Tony Snow talking about even if she had no brain and no consciousness or hope for better we should respect "life". What does he mean, we should no longer pull the plug on the brain dead when it is hopeless?
 

ShamMol

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Stinger said:
Against who? The malpractice suits were settled years ago.
Against the doctors who allowed her to be taken off the life support.
CNN said:
LARGO, Florida (CNN) -- ut without removal of the feeding tube, and if conditions such as pneumonia and urinary tract infections -- common in bed-ridden patients -- were treated, Terri Schiavo could have lived another decade, Thogmartin estimated.

"Their report shows what we have said -- that Terri was not terminal," said the Schindlers' attorney, David Gibbs. "Terri Schiavo was not in an end-of-life situation. The decision was made to end her life, and we believe it was done in a barbaric manner."
That is likely what they will focus on.
For what?
The media circus this became.
From the stand-point that probably a couple of hundred people have died or been allowed to die under similar circumstances since Terri's death and none of them were made a national issue I see your point. I find it upsetting that Hannity is now trying to start a case against her husband with his "we must go back to the beginning because the autopsy did not concluded what caused this in the first place" and Furman trying to insinuate that her husband may have caused it while at the same time presenting nothing at all that points to that. Or Tony Snow talking about even if she had no brain and no consciousness or hope for better we should respect "life". What does he mean, we should no longer pull the plug on the brain dead when it is hopeless?
My grandmother was brain dead and it wasn't about life at that point, it was about respecting her memory. We knew that she wouldn't like to be seen like this, she wouldn't want to live like that. I think that the only good thing to come out of this case is, as you mentioned, the fact that people now can die in peace thanks to an upsurge in living wills.
 
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Fu_chick

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ShamMol said:
The parents, the church-goers who got involved for pure theatrics, the politicians, and most importantly the media. The love of media hype by our country has increased so much since Billy Boy's romp in the hay that now anything can be blown into a huge thing.
I don't think that you can be hard on her parents. I mean, it's their kid, I'm not a parent, but I can't imagine how incredible hard it would be to see your child go through that. When they said she was responding she was probably seeing what she wanted to see. And the rest of the family and close friends--well that's what they're there for-support. Mind you, I don't agree that she should have been kept on life support as long as she was. I think it would have been better for everyone if they had just let her go.

I agree about the rest of the circus though--they did it for the attention and the political gain, which is unfortunate but not surprising.
 

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Fu_chick said:
I don't think that you can be hard on her parents. I mean, it's their kid, I'm not a parent, but I can't imagine how incredible hard it would be to see your child go through that. When they said she was responding she was probably seeing what she wanted to see. And the rest of the family and close friends--well that's what they're there for-support. Mind you, I don't agree that she should have been kept on life support as long as she was. I think it would have been better for everyone if they had just let her go.

I agree about the rest of the circus though--they did it for the attention and the political gain, which is unfortunate but not surprising.
Ah, you don't think her parents should be held to blame. But I do. You see, the media probably wouldn't have gotten involved if it hadn't been for their public pleas on the media and it would have just remained a court case which reached the exact same conclusion. Support her, don't create a media circus, stay by her side in her time of need and not go on tv.
 

Fu_chick

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ShamMol said:
Ah, you don't think her parents should be held to blame. But I do. You see, the media probably wouldn't have gotten involved if it hadn't been for their public pleas on the media and it would have just remained a court case which reached the exact same conclusion. Support her, don't create a media circus, stay by her side in her time of need and not go on tv.

They probably felt that the best way to get help to save their kid was to ask for the public's help. And hey, it nearly worked. Again, I don't think that it was a good idea, but these people have been through enough. I AGREE with the husband's position and I can't imagine how I would react if it were my kid it that hospital.
 

shuamort

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Next up in this carnival of souls, John Ellis Bush (also known to the yokels as Jeb) has decided to really crack this stale nut.:

Gov. Jeb Bush asked a prosecutor Friday to investigate why Terri Schiavo collapsed 15 years ago, calling into question how long it took her husband to call 911 after he found her.

...Michael Schiavo testified in a 1992 medical malpractice trial that he found his wife collapsed at 5 a.m., and he said in a 2003 television interview that he found her about 4:30 a.m. He called 911 at 5:40 a.m.

"Between 40 and 70 minutes elapsed before the call was made, and I am aware of no explanation for the delay," Bush wrote. "In light of this new information, I urge you to take a fresh look at this case without any preconceptions as to the outcome."
Don't we all remember minute details about time in things that happened that many years ago? :roll:
 

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shuamort said:
Next up in this carnival of souls, John Ellis Bush (also known to the yokels as Jeb) has decided to really crack this stale nut.:



Don't we all remember minute details about time in things that happened that many years ago? :roll:
Why am I not surprised? :roll: Gotta win that Christian conservative vote back for the White House bid.
 

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Why am I not surprised? Gotta win that Christian conservative vote back for the White House bid.
I don't think Jeb will run, but if he does he will not win the primary. I could be wrong but I think the investigation is a result of findings from the autopsy.
 

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Squawker said:
I don't think Jeb will run, but if he does he will not win the primary. I could be wrong but I think the investigation is a result of findings from the autopsy.
Everything politicians do is for political gain. There were many people who thought that he did not do enough to keep Schiavo alive.
 
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