Saudis rebuff Rice, side with Hamas

[battleax86]

50 million freed to potentially kill American troops is what President Bush really accomplished in Iraq.

Let's work on getting your numbers straight, first. The population of Iraq is about 26 million, not 50 million. Secondly, you're under the mistaken impression that the entire population wants to kill our troops when, in fact, most of the attacks are carried out by foreign insurgents and native insurgents make up an incredibly tiny portion of the population.

You are correct in that terrorism existed in Iraq long before Bush invaded yet Bush still chose to needlessly put our troops in harms way,

Again, they were not put in harm's way needlessly, as I've explained already. Also, don't you think it's much better that the terrorists are having to fight a losing battle to stay in Iraq when they had government protection before the war?

chose to send our troops to be slaughtered indiscriminately

Slaughtered indiscriminately? We're losing troops around the rate of two per day. That's not a slaughter. If anything, we're slaughtering them.

knowing full well that the Middle East has been unstable for centuries.

And that's why we're here - to put stable democracies in the place of dictators. It's going to be a fight to do that, but it's one that we WILL win.

President Clinton knew attacking Iraq was stupid and suicidal and he was not about to send our troops to die needlessly as Bush did!

Which is why he attacked Iraq on numerous occasions throughout his presidency...the absurdity of the idea that attacking Iraq was suicidal notwithstanding.

President Bush has freed not one Iraqi untill the killing stops, until the slaughter ends, until Iraq is free from terrorism and terrorists!

The idea that Iraqis are not free until the there are no more terrorist attacks in Iraq is ridiculous. That would be like saying that we were not a free country on 9/11 and are not a free country until every single al-Qaeda operative in the United States is found and expelled.

That has not happened and never will, especially with our troops over there.

No, it will happen BECAUSE our troops are there fighting the terrorists and training the Iraqis to fight them on their own.

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS-BRING THEM HOME ALIVE!

Our troops don't want your version of support. They want you to support their victory, not their defeat.

Iraqi insurgents and rebels are just the beginning and just in Iraq, President Bush's invasion of Iraq unleashed far greater numbers of terrorists world-wide to aid Iraq against our troops and President Bush.

Bulls**t. Most of the terrorist focus is in Iraq itself. They have redirected most of their resources there and they are getting slaughtered.

President Bush's invasion of Iraq has united hundreds of millions of ordinary Arabs and Islamists world-wide against his occupation of Iraq.

No, most of the Arab world is going about their business just like they were before the invasion, but it doesn't help any when the Islamists can get propaganda from you and the rest of the American anti-war crowd to recruit people.

President Bush's invasion of Iraq has unleashed a pandora's box just as I and many world-wide predicted!

It HAS unleashed a Pandora's box, but not anything like the one that you and the rest of the anti-war crowd predicted. This is a Pandora's box for the dictators and terrorists of the world. Democracy and democratic reforms have spread throughout the Middle East because of our invasion. Libya has given up its WMD programs for Qaddafi's fear of ending up in a spider hole. The wall has fallen and the whole Arab world can see it.

 

[DivineComedy]

You give me Saddam's speeches to show a connection between Saddam and AQ? Saddam was well known for being full of hot air and would have welcomed anyone's actions against the US. Of course he approved of anyone who was interested in attacking the US....the enemy of my enemy is my friend....that doesn't prove he was helping them. Show me evidence, not speeches.

Under Clinton, the CIA had a plan to capture Bin Laden in Afghanistan, which was scrapped at the last minute. I'm sure everyone wishes that had gone forward, looking back now! There was enough evidence to show that Bin Laden was a serious problem that needed to be addressed. You don't go out and make speeches about covert action though...that wouldn't be too smart, would it?

Speeches are PR, they don't tell you very much about what is really going on.:roll:

NYStateofMind Saddam’s speeches were hot air just like Al Quacka’s speech must have been hot air:

“He went on to warn that ‘If the present injustice continues…, it will inevitably move the battle to American soil.’” (Page 48 THE 9/11 COMMISSION REPORT)

Right?

But, Al Quacka’s fatwa was not hot air, and considering his position as ruler Saddam’s letter to us was according to Webster’s was the “art of conducting state affairs,” or statecraft.

We have a word for those that our are “friends” in a war and that word is “allies.” Apply the word NYStateofMind where it needs to be applied, apply the word.

You said: “You don't go out and make speeches about covert action though...that wouldn't be too smart, would it?”

Exactly, “need to know,” learned that in the military! It is also why you didn’t unequivocally tell me who the magical “they” are in that quote from Saddam‘s letter to you, not enough evidence, right? Even though you know the magical “they” had to be criminals operating according to their “own ideas” of justice, which is the very definition of a terrorist; it just so happens Saddam‘s letter to us was in response to September 11, 2001, which is something you would have us ignore as not being sufficient evidence. It should be easier to catch vermin covertly than stomping around, especially if you have no intention of changing the landscape with the goal of eliminating the state crafted philosophy that breeds the vermin.

Don’t change the landscape, and eventually a generation that twiddled its thumbs in the barracks during the 444 days of glory in Iran, after a French Airline delivered the Ayatollah, get to see the idolaters that swirl around black stone idols mindlessly chant “Death to America” long enough for a generation to come of age, and see the nukes: don‘t worry, the same guys that invaded Afghanistan in the same year Socialist Saddam came to power will help them keep their nuke program “peaceful.”

Do we want our friends to continue down the road of a moral hypocrisy that supports terrorism, or do we want our “friends” in Saudi Arabia to see the light?

Mutual is the fear of any terror,
Assured we contest the allied should partake,
Destructions to apply till equal
portion share,
fear
I
Say to sponsors of terror!​

Speaking to the choir. Playing a numbers game where we say it is better to just let the State Sponsors of Terrorism do their thing, accepting the “nuisance” of terrorism for fewer casualties on their side, believing we can reason with them when getting what they deserve will not teach them, is ridiculous. Like John Kerry said, "we have to get back to the place we were, where terrorists are not the focus of our lives but they're a nuisance," to its supporters!

The containment of the Nazi rooted Baathist regime of Saddam for the Peace for Greed of Oil for Food on the backs of the disenfranchised, which was the epitome of the endless lukewarm “liberal” arts of war, was WRONG; according to the so-called “Muslim“ hypocrites (hypocrisy being the most hated of G-d) it is terrorism!

Right now it is sadly ironic that the very “own ideas” of justice, which is the tyrannical terrorist use of civilian disguise in warfare in violation of the Islamic Golden Rule, is coming home to roost—remembering the many terrorist groups supported by the Arab League, that wanted to destroy the self-determination of a Jews, to destroy their own kin, as if that could get the self-determination of a viable “Palestinian” State—the very terror that was supported by Muslims, now has so-called “Muslims” killing Muslims; at some point you would think that we would all learn that “what goes around, comes around;”

“Do unto all men as you would wish to have done unto you; and reject for others what you would reject for yourself."

Of the terrorists and those that are allies of them, that cannot learn the clear communications, “their guardians are Shaitans who take them out of the light into the darkness.”

 

[NYStateofMind]

Do you feel better now? That was a lot of hot air too.

Where's the evidence? You still haven't shown me any.

 

[DivineComedy]

Do you feel better now? That was a lot of hot air too.

Where's the evidence? You still haven't shown me any.

Hey, I got my way: “…What was gained by keeping Saddam? Nothing but a future of deadly bedlam…“ (Created Sunday, September 23, 2001, 8:46:10 PM) So it isn’t up to me to prove and give evidence anymore. It was up to you to prove and give evidence that a civilian clothed Hamas terrorist and Saddam were not allies in the death of a fourteen year old American girl on a bus March 5, 2003, after UN resolution 1441. It is up to you to prove and give evidence that the Hamas Charter does not ally them with Al Quacka. With a “former” State Sponsor of Terrorism right next door to Saudi Arabia (where 15 of 19 Al Quacka came from) faced with the very vermin they supported for decades. Now “peaceful” Muslims are jumping off cliffs and getting slaughtered at the market, at weddings, at temple, and on the bus for all filthy terrorist sponsoring “peaceful” hypocritical Moslem vermin to see what they really are. Justice is served!

Why should Iraq have been spared from fighting the terrorists?

 

[NYStateofMind]

Hey, I got my way: “…What was gained by keeping Saddam? Nothing but a future of deadly bedlam…“ (Created Sunday, September 23, 2001, 8:46:10 PM) So it isn’t up to me to prove and give evidence anymore. It was up to you to prove and give evidence that a civilian clothed Hamas terrorist and Saddam were not allies in the death of a fourteen year old American girl on a bus March 5, 2003, after UN resolution 1441. It is up to you to prove and give evidence that the Hamas Charter does not ally them with Al Quacka. With a “former” State Sponsor of Terrorism right next door to Saudi Arabia (where 15 of 19 Al Quacka came from) faced with the very vermin they supported for decades. Now “peaceful” Muslims are jumping off cliffs and getting slaughtered at the market, at weddings, at temple, and on the bus for all filthy terrorist sponsoring “peaceful” hypocritical Moslem vermin to see what they really are. Justice is served!

Why should Iraq have been spared from fighting the terrorists?

Still no evidence to back it up.

Changing the subject isn't providing proof.

Show me evidence that Saddam was involved with 9/11. Show me proof that he was giving operational support to AQ. Good luck with that.:2wave:

 

[DivineComedy]

Still no evidence to back it up.

Changing the subject isn't providing proof.

Show me evidence that Saddam was involved with 9/11. Show me proof that he was giving operational support to AQ. Good luck with that.:2wave:

I ask again: “Why should Iraq have been spared from fighting the terrorists?”


Try and understand, I do not have to provide you with evidence that Saddam was involved with or gave operational support to September 11, 2001, that is irrelevant to justification, I am claiming Saddam and Al Quacka are allies. {period} I got my way; containment is over, Oil for Food is over, Saddam is over: for better or worse, the Iraqis are now going to have to fight the terrorists or lose their enfranchisement, and the smart ones know it.

The ball is really in the Iraqi court now, and if the Iraqis lose due to a lack of international support I can only blame those terrorist sympathizers and appeasers that would not use the word “Allies” when talking of the relationship between Al Quacka and the Nazi rooted Baath Party of Saddam.

Here is an already existing thread on the subject of the October 29, 2001 letter to us by Saddam:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/showthread.php?t=2947

*****

Saddam was not involved with or gave operational support in the following attack against America by the terrorist group Hamas either, but it is obvious to anyone that Saddam was an ally of Hamas, and I would expect terrorist sympathizers, terrorist propagandists, and terrorist appeasers to dispute that irrefutable fact:

“The suicide bomber was 20 years old, a student of the Hebron Polytechnic University (from which a large number of suicide bombers have emerged) and a member of the Hamas terrorist organization.” http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/861590/posts

March 13, 2003: “(CBS) Saddam Hussein has distributed $260,000 to 26 families of Palestinians killed in 29 months of fighting with Israel, including a $10,000 check to the family of a Hamas suicide bomber.

In a packed banquet hall on Wednesday, the families came one-by-one to receive their $10,000 checks. A large banner said: ‘The Arab Baath Party Welcomes the Families of the Martyrs for the Distribution of Blessings of Saddam Hussein.’“ http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/03/14/world/main543981.shtml

I also would expect terrorist sympathizers, terrorist propagandists, and terrorist appeasers to refute the irrefutable fact that the Hamas Charter makes Hamas, Saddam, and Al Quacka Allies:

“The Islamic Resistance Movement's Relation With the Moslem Brotherhood Group:
Article Two:
The Islamic Resistance Movement is one of the wings of Moslem Brotherhood in Palestine. Moslem Brotherhood Movement is a universal organization which constitutes the largest Islamic movement in modern times. It is characterised by its deep understanding, accurate comprehension and its complete embrace of all Islamic concepts of all aspects of life, culture, creed, politics, economics, education, society, justice and judgement, the spreading of Islam, education, art, information, science of the occult and conversion to Islam.”

“Jihad Against Jews and Crusaders
World Islamic Front Statement
23 February 1998
Shaykh Usamah Bin-Muhammad Bin-Ladin
Ayman al-Zawahiri”

“By fourteen he had joined the Muslim Brotherhood”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayman_al-Zawahiri

“The Islamic Resistance Movement is Composed of Soldiers:
Article Thirty-Six:
While paving its way, the Islamic Resistance Movement, emphasizes time and again to all the sons of our people, to the Arab and Islamic nations, that it does not seek personal fame, material gain, or social prominence. It does not aim to compete against any one from among our people, or take his place. Nothing of the sort at all. It will not act against any of the sons of Moslems or those who are peaceful towards it from among non-Moslems, be they here or anywhere else. It will only serve as a support for all groupings and organizations operating against the Zionist enemy and its lackeys.”
http://www.mideastweb.org/hamas.htm

It is up to you to provide evidence and proof that Saddam and Al Quacka are not Allies.

 

[Calm2Chaos]

But it's your side that needlessly sent them there to die in the first place.

Take a good look because that's reality pal, President Bush is responsible for those coffins.

He didn't have to attack Iraq! It was his choice and it was his order and his order only. No one else could of directed the order to attack! No one!

"Your Side"? Please explain to me "Your Side". Unless "Your Side" is the one trying to secure this country, while "the Other Side" is doing everything in it's power to weaken and demean it. Then I get lost on who's side your talking about

 

[Calm2Chaos]

50 million freed to potentially kill American troops is what President Bush really accomplished in Iraq. You are correct in that terrorism existed in Iraq long before Bush invaded yet Bush still chose to needlessly put our troops in harms way, chose to send our troops to be slaughtered indiscriminately knowing full well that the Middle East has been unstable for centuries.

President Clinton knew attacking Iraq was stupid and suicidal and he was not about to send our troops to die needlessly as Bush did! President Bush has freed not one Iraqi untill the killing stops, until the slaughter ends, until Iraq is free from terrorism and terrorists!

That has not happened and never will, especially with our troops over there.

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS-BRING THEM HOME ALIVE!

NO... HE just alowed them to be targets and killed with doing nothing at al in retaliation. I wonder what would ever give the present day terrorist the idea they could even get away with such an act without reprisal... Hmmmmm Clinton maybe ...LOL yes yes yes .. that would be the right answer