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Saudis rebuff Rice, side with Hamas

ludahai

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danarhea said:
I agree with all 3 statements you have made.

In regard to your first statement, Rice doesnt need to be in a kitchen. She is a pragmatist, as opposed to a Neocon, and she is doing a good job, in fact, such a good job that she has been able to effectively neuter Donald Rumsfeld in foreign policy matters. :)

Rice is pragmatic in a Kissingerian sort of way. I wish she would take a stronger line with China though. Appeasement isn't the way to go with them. However, Kid Rocks would probably cheer if the attacked Taiwan andgot the US embroiled in another war.
 
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KidRocks said:
President Bush, beneath "Mission Accomplished" banner, gives a thumbs-up after declaring an end to major combat in Iraq, May 1, 2003
You obviously don't know anything about that Mission Accomplished banner. Seems as if you ought to go educate yourself.
 

NYStateofMind

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Calm2Chaos said:
WRONG..... from the begining he stated that we would be in this for the long haul. And that this was not going to be a quick fight. Thats another nice little liberal myth

You just keep right on trying to rewrite history. Unfortunately, my memory is just fine, and I was around when the claim was made that we would be bringing the majority of the troops home in a few months. I was also around when we sent in too few troops to protect the supply lines, secure the ammo dumps, provide security, etc, etc, etc...... If we had done it right, MAYBE those rosy predictions would have been more realistic.

I know Bush has a hard time admitting mistakes. Fortunately, I have no problem recognizing them without his help. :mrgreen:
 

BWG

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Top officials, including Cheney and Rumsfeld, said the war would last "weeks, not months."

Vice President Cheney, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and Gen. Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, spoke optimistically in interviews and at briefings about the prospects that the war would be short, Iraqi resistance limited and Iraqi citizens welcoming.

Myers who spoke with reporters about "a short, short conflict" against an Iraqi force that was "much weaker" than it was in the 1991 Gulf War.

:roll:
 

DivineComedy

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KCConservative said:
KidRocks proves my signature every time he posts. :cool:
Yep, looks like that to me too!

How many times before we even got to Afghanistan did we hear the “liberals” say, “one man’s freedom fighter is another man’s terrorist?” It is obvious the so-called “freedom” of the terrorists, like Al Quacka, means no other social contract is legitimate, which is similar to what many old school commie “liberals” want in making the Tenth Amendment only good for picking State flowers. The same people we saw at the first “International A.n.s.w.e.r.” rally on C-span against the war, looked to my parents like the same gray headed pony tailed hippies that were spitting “baby killer,” but this time they were chanting “Free Palestine, Free Palestine, Free Palestine” at the same rally Ramsey Clark attended—no surprise at the PLO rally either considering the Arab League created the PLO prior to the 1967 borders the Saudis claimed they would accept now, in a pigs eye—the same “liberals” claim to “support the troops” in the “terrorist‘s” Bush war: Is their Democracy Hypocrisy?

How many times have we heard the “liberals” say, “unjust, immoral, unnecessary and unconstitutional,” when referring to the war in Iraq, and they weren‘t talking about the Iraqi “insurgency?”

I believe the “Liberals” will be doing a jig if Democracy in Iraq fails: they prefer the endless lukewarm “liberal” arts of war of containment, which only has the chance of teaching “freedom fighters” in its schools instead of reading, writing, and arithmetic.
 

DivineComedy

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NYStateofMind said:
I was also around when we sent in too few troops to protect the supply lines, secure the ammo dumps, provide security, etc, etc, etc...... If we had done it right, MAYBE those rosy predictions would have been more realistic.

I know Bush has a hard time admitting mistakes. Fortunately, I have no problem recognizing them without his help. :mrgreen:

You may be right.

Fine, we didn’t have enough troops, I admit that if Bush can‘t, why do you think people have been screaming that the war is justified from day one, when the other side was yelling that it wasn't, we wanted our side to get help, HELP, to hell with that, it is old news for the next war. Answer me something.

Could you rotate 300, 000 troops, without the problems your memory remembers with less troops, and for how long? Till the Iraqis solve their problems, get a constitution, form an army that never swore an oath to Saddam…
 

NYStateofMind

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DivineComedy said:
You may be right.

Fine, we didn’t have enough troops, I admit that if Bush can‘t, why do you think people have been screaming that the war is justified from day one, when the other side was yelling that it wasn't, we wanted our side to get help, HELP, to hell with that, it is old news for the next war. Answer me something.

Could you rotate 300, 000 troops, without the problems your memory remembers with less troops, and for how long? Till the Iraqis solve their problems, get a constitution, form an army that never swore an oath to Saddam…
I completely disagree that the war was justified or necessary. That's a whole different discussion though.

Once the decision was made to go in, we were in entirely too much of a hurry to do it right. There was nowhere near enough planning done. In the Gulf War, we sent a HUGE force, spent the time necessary to put the support necessary in place, and we had no intention of occupying Iraq. This time, when we intended to occupy Iraq, we sent a small force, not even close to adequate to do the job right. The fact that we didn't do it right is the reason that we are now in the position we are in re: the insurgency, the terrorists, the inadequacy of the new Iraqi army and police, etc. It was a mistake to disolve the Iraqi army completely. It was an enormous mistake to not secure the weapons left behind by Saddam's regime. It was an enormous mistake to not secure Iraq's borders. All of those things put us YEARS behind where we could have been if we had enough troops to begin with and used them to restructure the army, secure the arms, and secure the borders. We bungled this invasion horribly....because the Bush administration didn't do the necessary planning. They didn't use the intelligence community to help them do that planning until it was far too late to be of any benefit. It's a very simple principle that my mother taught me when I was a little girl. Always look before you leap.....not after, BEFORE.

If we sent the necessary troops in the beginning, we wouldn't have needed to keep a huge force there for long. I'm a firm believer in COME BIG OR STAY HOME. If you can't come big, don't go. You're seeing the reason I say that every day in Iraq. Now we have a sizable force that HAS to stay for years. We have no choice. This was a war of choice, we made the decision to overthrow their government, we now have an obligation to the Iraqis to stay until there is no longer a power vacuum. But we could have avoided the huge problem of a large and growing insurgency and the infiltration of terrorists if we had done it right in the beginning. The terrorists are there because we didn't secure the borders. The insurgency is armed with the weapons that we failed to secure in the beginning. We would need a lot less troops there TODAY if we had avoided those mistakes.

If there was a problem with sending adequate troops to do the job right, we shouldn't have gone in the first place.
 

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Kid, you're going making liberals look stupid with your idiocy...

Continue to not rebuff other people's point, use ad hominems as the base of your arguement, and bashing your opposing objects with wordplay isn't going to win the debate here..

Some of your statements are just false that even a liberal can see that..

And at the OP, you sided with a terrorist organization that kills hundreds of people.... sheesh.

The dress code is a law passed way before the war in iraq for SOTU.

The calls being monitored are international calls..
 
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KidRocks

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Synch said:
Kid, you're going making liberals look stupid with your idiocy...

Continue to not rebuff other people's point, use ad hominems as the base of your arguement, and bashing your opposing objects with wordplay isn't going to win the debate here..

Some of your statements are just false that even a liberal can see that..

And at the OP, you sided with a terrorist organization that kills hundreds of people.... sheesh.

The dress code is a law passed way before the war in iraq for SOTU.

The calls being monitored are international calls..



I realize I'm a little rough on the extremists but it's for their own good, it's called "tough-love" and I'm sure they will thank me later when they reach maximum development form as mature adults, that is when they will see the errors of their dittohead ways.

Meanwhile I'll stoop to their level as long as it takes. Resorting to ad hominems, bashing and soundbites is what they understand, what they respect, they are like children and I understand their situation.

They have to be carefully weaned from Rush Limbaugh dependency. :2wave:
 

Calm2Chaos

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danarhea said:
Hmmm. Nothing about the Iraqi's greeting us with flowers, huh? I can provide the quote and link if you would like. Am just giving you a chance to take back your little attempt to rewrite history.


Your little attempt at trying to troll a wrong quote from me won't work. Nthing in the quote I brought up said anything about how the people reacted. So your attempt at putting words in my mouth has officially failed..

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.... :roll: :roll:
 

Calm2Chaos

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KidRocks said:
President Bush, beneath "Mission Accomplished" banner, gives a thumbs-up after declaring an end to major combat in Iraq, May 1, 2003

I know for a fact you have gone over this very topic before... And yet you pull out this BS even though you know the banner had nothing to do with the speech. See this is you.... Pathetic as it is...... using something you know to be false to try and prove your point. And by doing so you make yourself look ridiculous.

As for the end of major combat... well it was, wasn't however the end of the war...
 

Calm2Chaos

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NYStateofMind said:
You just keep right on trying to rewrite history. Unfortunately, my memory is just fine, and I was around when the claim was made that we would be bringing the majority of the troops home in a few months. I was also around when we sent in too few troops to protect the supply lines, secure the ammo dumps, provide security, etc, etc, etc...... If we had done it right, MAYBE those rosy predictions would have been more realistic.

I know Bush has a hard time admitting mistakes. Fortunately, I have no problem recognizing them without his help. :mrgreen:


OK your memory is fine... Find me the qoutes of him saying the war was going to be over in a few months after it started. Find me the qoutes of him saying the soldiers would only be there a month or two... Please show them to me.. I want to see these qoutes of him saying that this war was going to be over in no time at all..
 
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KidRocks said:
I realize I'm a little rough on the extremists but it's for their own good....

I'm sure they will thank me later when .......

Meanwhile I'll stoop to their level .....

they are like children .....

They have to be carefully weaned ....

It is your foolish comments that leaves you without any credibility.
 

KidRocks

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KCConservative said:
It is your foolish comments that leaves you without any credibility.


To quote someone out of context is a great compliment, thank you I am honored that you shaken to your foundations by my original summation on dittoheads and "tough-love".

Here it is in it's full context again...

I realize I'm a little rough on the extremists but it's for their own good, it's called "tough-love" and I'm sure they will thank me later when they reach maximum development form as mature adults, that is when they will see the errors of their dittohead ways.

Meanwhile I'll stoop to their level as long as it takes. Resorting to ad hominems, bashing and soundbites is what they understand, what they respect, they are like children and I understand their situation.

They have to be carefully weaned from Rush Limbaugh dependency.
 

DivineComedy

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NYStateofMind said:
If there was a problem with sending adequate troops to do the job right, we shouldn't have gone in the first place.
We should keep that in mind, before we get involved in another United Nations (of tyrants too) conflict like the “First” Gulf War (which I was against due to it leaving the problem in power), because when something is started we are obligated to try and finish it and not leave the problem to fester under our skin forever, and that goes to justification and necessity, especially considering outcome of Al Quacka’s February 23, 1998 fatwa in anticipation of Clinton’s “wag the dog” of Operation Desert Fox.
 

battleax86

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danarhea said:
Hmmm. Nothing about the Iraqi's greeting us with flowers, huh? I can provide the quote and link if you would like. Am just giving you a chance to take back your little attempt to rewrite history.
Rewriting history, eh? As I recall, our troops WERE greeted with flowers...

blog5.jpg


10flower.jpg


Female%20Soldier%20-%20Iraqi%20gives%20flowers%20-%20AP.JPG
 

KidRocks

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battleax86 said:
Rewriting history, eh? As I recall, our troops WERE greeted with flowers...

blog5.jpg


10flower.jpg


Female%20Soldier%20-%20Iraqi%20gives%20flowers%20-%20AP.JPG



Where have all the flowers gone?
 

battleax86

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My guess would be the floral shop...
 

KidRocks

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battleax86 said:
My guess would be the floral shop...




WHERE HAVE ALL THE FLOWERS GONE
words and music by Pete Seeger
performed by Pete Seeger and Tao Rodriguez-Seeger

Where have all the flowers gone?
Long time passing
Where have all the flowers gone?
Long time ago
Where have all the flowers gone?
Girls have picked them every one
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the young girls gone?
Long time passing
Where have all the young girls gone?
Long time ago
Where have all the young girls gone?
Taken husbands every one
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the young men gone?
Long time passing
Where have all the young men gone?
Long time ago
Where have all the young men gone?
Gone for soldiers every one
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the soldiers gone?
Long time passing
Where have all the soldiers gone?
Long time ago
Where have all the soldiers gone?
Gone to graveyards every one
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the graveyards gone?
Long time passing
Where have all the graveyards gone?
Long time ago
Where have all the graveyards gone?
Covered with flowers every one
When will we ever learn?
When will we ever learn?

©1961 (Renewed) Fall River Music Inc
All Rights Reserved.
 

KidRocks

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battleax86 said:
Rewriting history, eh? As I recall, our troops WERE greeted with flowers...

blog5.jpg


10flower.jpg


Female%20Soldier%20-%20Iraqi%20gives%20flowers%20-%20AP.JPG






Lyrics to WAR
(Whitfield/Strong)

War, huh, yeah
What is it good for?
Absolutely (nothing), ah, ha, ha, ha


War, huh, yeah
What is it good for?
Absolutely (nothing)
Say it again, y'all


War, huh, look out!
What is it good for?
Absolutely (nothing)
Listen to me


War I despise
'cause it means destruction of innocent lives
War means tears to thousands of mother's eyes
When their sons go out to fight and lose their lives


I said, war, huh, good God y'all
What is it good for
Absolutely (nothing)
geh, say it again


War (Huh)
Woh, woh, woh, woh
What is it good for?
Absolutely (nothing)
Listen to me


War, it ain't nothin' but a heartbreaker
War, friend only to the undertaker


Ah, war is an enemy of all mankind
The thought of war blows my mind
War has caused unrest within the younger generation
Induction then destruction
Who wants to die ? Ah....


War, good God, y'all
What is it good for ?
Absolutely (nothing)
Say it, say it, say it


War, ah ha yeah, huh,
What is it good for?
Absolutely (nothing)
Listen to me


War, it ain't nothin' but a heartbreaker
War, got one friend that's the undertaker


Ah, war has shattered many a young man's dreams
Made him disabled, bitter and mean


Life is much too short and precious
To spend fighting wars each day
War can't give life
It can only take it away


Ahh ,war, (Huh)
Good God y'all
What is it good for?
Absolutely nothing
Say it again


(War, huh)
 

battleax86

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KidRocks said:
War, huh, yeah
What is it good for?
Absolutely (nothing), ah, ha, ha, ha
Except for achieving independence, preventing and eventually ending slavery, ending a Nazi state, defeating Japanese imperialism, preventing the spread of communism, liberating over 40 million people in the Muslim world, liberating South Korea, liberating Kuwait, and letting people know that they can't successfully f**k with the United States...yeah, you're right.

BTW, thanks for revealing yourself for the peacenik hippy that you are. :cool:
 

KidRocks

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battleax86 said:
Except for achieving independence, preventing and eventually ending slavery, ending a Nazi state, defeating Japanese imperialism, preventing the spread of communism, liberating over 40 million people in the Muslim world, liberating South Korea, liberating Kuwait, and letting people know that they can't successfully f**k with the United States...yeah, you're right.

BTW, thanks for revealing yourself for the peacenik hippy that you are. :cool:



But look at what we ended up with... President Bush.

Someone who's managing to destroy almost everything we've fought for going back hundreds of years. :cry:
 

ludahai

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battleax86 said:
Except for achieving independence, preventing and eventually ending slavery, ending a Nazi state, defeating Japanese imperialism, preventing the spread of communism, liberating over 40 million people in the Muslim world, liberating South Korea, liberating Kuwait, and letting people know that they can't successfully f**k with the United States...yeah, you're right.

BTW, thanks for revealing yourself for the peacenik hippy that you are.

KidRocks said:
But look at what we ended up with... President Bush.

Someone who's managing to destroy almost everything we've fought for going back hundreds of years. :cry:

Seems like Bush43 had a hand in liberating nearly 50 million Muslims actually. What did Clinton do? Get a $^% job in the Oval Office? Bomb a factory in Sudan to divert attention from something else? Lie under oath? Must I go on?
 
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