Sanctuary Cities

[TU Curmudgeon]

Are you for sanctuary cities?

Vote Yes or No.

Please give your reason(s) for your vote.

Sorry, your poll question is unanswerable in any logical manner with the choices you have provided. If you had given the option of "Other" it might have been informative.

 

[trixare4kids]

~*~HaPpY~*~ New Year, Trix!
:2dancing:arty

:2dance:arty

It's a good day to be celebrating indoors.
What kind of weather is this? :shock:

 

[trixare4kids]

Sorry, your poll question is unanswerable in any logical manner with the choices you have provided. If you had given the option of "Other" it might have been informative.

Keep your apologies, #58 DP posters disagree with you...

 

[enderpotato00]

I voted yes. If someone is here, and working, paying taxes, sending their children to school, and being law-abiding residents, I have no problem with it.

And before those of you who disagree start screaming, "But they AREN'T law abiding!!" - their crime of crossing the border without papers is only a misdemeanor.

How many of you have been guilty of a misdemeanor? Before you say you haven't, you might want to look into it. I did, and was guilty of several. I smoked pot. I got drunk in public. I made out in the woods with my boyfriend.

Not everything is black and white.

They can't pay taxes they aren't legal citizens.

 

[JMR]

I presented undisputed evidence of sanctuary illegals that are protected from full force of the law and of illegals as criminals exploiting their sanctuary protection. I then provided a narrative to explain why they find that of obvious benefit. You do not dispute the evidence, nor how it supports the logic of my narrative. Rather, you provide a link to Factcheck.

Yet, the link does not falsify the evidence and the narrative, either. Rather, it ignores such empirical evidence by declaring that such a reality cannot exist because their statistical model fails to find what has been already observed - rather like claiming relativity cannot exist because your modeling methods are too crude (or poorly used) to see it. On the other hand its easy to falsify the model; but for the presence of those illegals who have committed violent crimes in Sanctuary cities, those particular crimes and their victims would have happened.

I understand your attraction to citing "studies" that can't find the existence of what we have already observed, but there never has been an empirical verification that sanctuary laws actually accomplish what they claim. Not that any person would for any other crime, after all, no one has ever claimed that by not enforcing drug laws, say, for fear of intimidating drug-using crime victims we will reduce community criminal activity - right?

This deserves further discussion regarding the nature of evidence, and the failure of common sense. But that will come later. Suffice to say, all the abstractions born and unborn from the fevered minds of liberal academics can't change what has been documented and reported.

I understand that you have provided examples of criminal activity in sanctuary cities. I provided a link to a study that claims there is no significant reporting or occurrence of crimes in sanctuary cities. I understand you like your narrative, and that you find any disagreement born of "fevered minds". For the time being I will see the deliberately chosen actions of police in sanctuary cities as their constitutional right, their professional right, and so far supported by the "academic" agencies that conduct studies on the impact those actions have on those locales.

 

[CharisRose]

:2dance:arty

It's a good day to be celebrating indoors.
What kind of weather is this? :shock:

Yes it is!

My kind of weather is 30 degrees and snow.

Weather report said it would just be cloudy, no mention of snow!

Roseann

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Keep your apologies, #58 DP posters disagree with you...

I didn't say that the poll question was completely unanswerable, only that it was unanswerable in any logical manner with the choices you have provided.

 

[polgara]

Yes it is!

My kind of weather is 30 degrees and snow.

Weather report said it would just be cloudy, no mention of snow!

Roseann

Greetings, CharisRose. :2wave:

In my area of NE Ohio, we have had rain all day long! It's wet and Cold which is not anyone's idea of an ideal day to go outdoors - even the dogs know they must go potty outside, rain or shine, poor things! A bunch of towels used to dry them off will get thrown in the washer tomorrow! :thumbs:

I had a phone call from my ornery brother who has been on vacation with his wife in Cancun all week, telling me how much fun they're having and too bad I wasn't there - if he hadn't been laughing during the entire phone call, I might have believed him - :blah: so I just wished them a Happy New Year, and a safe trip home, and told them I'd be watching the ball drop in Times Square at midnight on TV!

 

[trixare4kids]

I didn't say that the poll question was completely unanswerable, only that it was unanswerable in any logical manner with the choices you have provided.

Do us all a big favor, stop the grousing, and add the category, "other", and let's hear what you have to say.
I have no interest in hearing your criticisms of my poll because as I KNOW and you should know, we can't change it now.

 

[trixare4kids]

Yes it is!

My kind of weather is 30 degrees and snow.

Weather report said it would just be cloudy, no mention of snow!

Roseann

I leave for Portland on the 2nd.
Rain, rain, and more cold rain.
I really don't like it but I love my family so I need to stop my grumbling and be thankful that we are able to go.

I know Julian is getting snow so I would imagine you are going to have them beat for accumulation.
What do CA. weatherman know? :lol:

 

[Hawkeye10]

I leave for Portland on the 2nd.
Rain, rain, and more cold rain.
I really don't like it but I love my family so I need to stop my grumbling and be thankful that we are able to go.

I know Julian is getting snow so I would imagine you are going to have them beat for accumulation.
What do CA. weatherman know? :lol:

If I may be nosy will you be going by plane, ancient train, or automobile?

 

[trixare4kids]

If I may be nosy will you be going by plane, ancient train, or automobile?

Plane, and why do you ask?

 

[Hawkeye10]

Plane, and why do you ask?

It can be a very nice trip PNW-Cali, one that I have done rather often, though not in some years. I have gone all three ways and like the train the best, even though the trains on this route used to be better. My first train journey on that route was 1969. I wish we could go by boat like people used to do.

 

[trixare4kids]

It can be a very nice trip PNW-Cali, one that I have done rather often, though not in some years. I have gone all three ways and like the train the best, even though the trains on this route used to be better. My first train journey on that route was 1969. I wish we could go by boat like people used to do.

Haven't considered the train, but I trust that it would be a nice trip sometime down the road in the future.
We drove ONE time up to Portland from SD, and while I thought it was a worthwhile endeavor to see CA. from one end to the other and onward to Portland, it was too long a trip for me to consider it again. IOW, once was enough.

Happy NY, Hawkeye!

 

[CharisRose]

I leave for Portland on the 2nd.
Rain, rain, and more cold rain.
I really don't like it but I love my family so I need to stop my grumbling and be thankful that we are able to go.

I know Julian is getting snow so I would imagine you are going to have them beat for accumulation.
What do CA. weatherman know? :lol:

Blessings for a safe trip. Thankful is much better than grumbling. Family love is one of the joys of life!

First we had a White Christmas (weatherman got that right) Next we had a White New Year (weatherman got that wrong) LOL

Roseann

 

[CharisRose]

Greetings, CharisRose. :2wave:

In my area of NE Ohio, we have had rain all day long! It's wet and Cold which is not anyone's idea of an ideal day to go outdoors - even the dogs know they must go potty outside, rain or shine, poor things! A bunch of towels used to dry them off will get thrown in the washer tomorrow! :thumbs:

I had a phone call from my ornery brother who has been on vacation with his wife in Cancun all week, telling me how much fun they're having and too bad I wasn't there - if he hadn't been laughing during the entire phone call, I might have believed him - :blah: so I just wished them a Happy New Year, and a safe trip home, and told them I'd be watching the ball drop in Times Square at midnight on TV!

Greetings, polgara :2wave:

I've never been to Ohio. I am originally from Chicago and winters there were very very cold. But, I did enjoy when my Dad made a nice big ice rink for us kids to skate on in our backyard!

Thank You for your family story. I enjoyed reading your family story! I also have an ornery brother.LOL My other two brothers are the total opposite of ornery.

I live on top of a mountain in southern CA. 6,400 feet high. The wonderful thing about the snow up here is the majority of the time, the sun shines and melts the beautiful white snow. And not very often does the snow last long enough to turn into what I call "ugly" not so white dirty snow!

Happy New Year! Hoping You and Your Family have a wonderful New Year!

Roseann

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

Trump is using a national security loophole to unilaterally start trade wars like a tinpot dictator. i understand that you are ok with this.

Well, you just said it yourself. he used a national security loophole, which is quite legal. How pray tell does that make him a tinpot dictator? Tin pot dictators do things that are not legal and abuse the concept of separation of powers. And to be honest, we are not in a trade war, nor will we end up in one. This is not the Smoot hawley Era. Canada, Mexico, and Europe have all responded positively. Even China is at least talking to us....even if they may be trying to wait out Trump's tenure in office. And what trump is pushing is fair trade,with a goal of eliminating tariffs altogether. What pray tell is wrong with fair trade? Or should we just freeze unfair trade barriers in place just for the sake of smily faces between ambassadors and the world press?

then we'll go with the data that i posted.

You may go with the data you posted. I simply will not take it seriously for reasons stated.

i support DACA, a Reagan style amnesty, a migrant worker program, and Everify for every job.

It was actually a democrat party sytle amnesty. Reagan accepted it with the promise that congress would provide funding for secure border enforcement. Reagan later expressed regret that he signed the bill when border enforcement never came.

i don't support his ego wall.

I am not hung up on Trump as much as you are. Trump's ego is not my concern. Border security is my concern. You just do not want the wall because you would perceive it as a victory for Trump. Trump seems to be hurting your ego in some way

i heard some of them. seems like he could read and speak English fairly well.

I heard some off the teleprompter speeches that made Obama appear a bit ignorant. Shall we start with his claim to have visited 57 US States? let's be real. All politicians have their awkward moments. Some more then others. Joe Biden famously said he wanted to talk about a three letter word: "Jobs".

oh, i don't know. i'd say that i'm not alone in being against ongoing national embarrassments and slow motion train wrecks.

But then the average leftwinger only seems to be embarrassed when they don't feel accepted by our ahem....European elders. However do mention any given national embarrasment moment that has you concerned.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Do us all a big favor, stop the grousing, and add the category, "other", and let's hear what you have to say.
I have no interest in hearing your criticisms of my poll because as I KNOW and you should know, we can't change it now.

OK.

Please define what it is about what you call "sanctuary cities" we are supposed to express our approval or disapproval of.

Are we supposed to support or oppose - "the unlawful detention of people by city authorities because that will facilitate the work of federal authorities"?

Are we supposed to support or oppose - "the use of city facilities, without payment, by federal authorities"?

Are we supposed to support or oppose - "the random (or even "profiled") stopping and questioning of people by city authorities simply because the person might not be legally allowed to be in the United States of America"?

Personally I don't support any of those so that would count as "support for sanctuary cities".

Are we supposed to support or oppose - "a restriction imposed by city governments on city authorities which precludes those city authorities from checking with federal authorities as to whether or not a person who is legally in the custody of the city authorities is wanted by federal authorities for federal crimes"?

Are we supposed to support or oppose - "deliberate actions by city authorities that result in the "improper" release from custody of a person known to have a federal arrest warrant issued for them because those city authorities don't agree with the federal legislation"?

Personally I oppose both of those, so that would count as "opposition to sanctuary cities".

So you see, I simply cannot answer your question as posed.

PS - One way around the time limit factor is to actually write out what you want your poll to say in advance, read it, revise it, re-read it, re-revise it, put it away for an hour or so, re-read it and think about what you have actually written, re-read it while pretending that you are someone who doesn't know exactly what you mean by the question and answers, revise it again if necessary, and THEN post it.

 

[Moderate Right]

I voted no. They make a mockery of our laws. I feel so bad for immigrants who seek entry legally waiting patiently and following all the rules and then you have those who pour through our borders illegally and find sanctuary in some of our cities awarding them for not doing it legally.

And yet Democrats claim they are for border security and now some places even allow illegals to vote in local elections.

 

[Moderate Right]

No. Lock'em up!

Actually, I am for keeping them out in the first place so we don't have to lock them up. We shouldn't have to lock any of them up.

 

[Helix]

Well, you just said it yourself. he used a national security loophole, which is quite legal. How pray tell does that make him a tinpot dictator? Tin pot dictators do things that are not legal and abuse the concept of separation of powers. And to be honest, we are not in a trade war, nor will we end up in one. This is not the Smoot hawley Era. Canada, Mexico, and Europe have all responded positively. Even China is at least talking to us....even if they may be trying to wait out Trump's tenure in office. And what trump is pushing is fair trade,with a goal of eliminating tariffs altogether. What pray tell is wrong with fair trade? Or should we just freeze unfair trade barriers in place just for the sake of smily faces between ambassadors and the world press?

what's wrong is that i don't support a president being able to unilaterally start a trade war with our friends, as i said. that's really dumb. we might actually need their help at some point, and then we'll get to reap the ill will so that he could have his personal trade war.

You may go with the data you posted. I simply will not take it seriously for reasons stated.

ok, you do that. i'll stop taking this exchange seriously.

It was actually a democrat party sytle amnesty. Reagan accepted it with the promise that congress would provide funding for secure border enforcement. Reagan later expressed regret that he signed the bill when border enforcement never came.

he also wanted employers sanctioned when he was talking about amnesty, because they are the real draw.

I am not hung up on Trump as much as you are. Trump's ego is not my concern. Border security is my concern. You just do not want the wall because you would perceive it as a victory for Trump. Trump seems to be hurting your ego in some way

as an American, i do have a problem with having someone that willfully ignorant embarrass my country on a nearly daily basis. and yeah, he does. either way, this era too shall pass. vote against.

I heard some off the teleprompter speeches that made Obama appear a bit ignorant. Shall we start with his claim to have visited 57 US States? let's be real. All politicians have their awkward moments. Some more then others. Joe Biden famously said he wanted to talk about a three letter word: "Jobs".

But then the average leftwinger only seems to be embarrassed when they don't feel accepted by our ahem....European elders. However do mention any given national embarrasment moment that has you concerned.

i think of them more as peers. i care about the rest of the world's reaction to that idiot, sure.

either way, we're getting nowhere and are mostly going to be repeating ourselves at this point. you can get in the last one if that does anything for you.