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Rumsfeld facing war crimes case in Germany

Schweddy

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Source: Reuters

BERLIN (Reuters) - Lawyers acting for a U.S. advocacy group will today file war crimes charges in Germany against senior U.S. administration officials for their alleged role in torture at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq. "German law in this area is leading the world," Peter Weiss, Vice President of the New York-based Centre for Constitutional Rights (CCR), a human rights group, was quoted as saying in Frankfurter Rundschau newspaper's Tuesday edition.
 

IronTongue

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No worries for Don, we won't hand him over no matter what happens. This also is something that shows how the rest of the world sees the way we do things here.
 

Pacridge

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IMO this is not good. This is not going to help the troops on the ground and is not going to help anything. Need to get these elections going in Iraq and get our troops out ASAP.
 

Ender

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The man broke the convention.

Maybe he -needs- to be tried
 

Ender

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Pacridge said:
IMO this is not good. This is not going to help the troops on the ground and is not going to help anything. Need to get these elections going in Iraq and get our troops out ASAP.
I understand your concern for the troops and share them. But I believe there's little chance at this time of our troops ever fully leaving Iraq.

We've made some allies in the mid-east. We'll use the rest until we're no longer interested in thier oil reserves. They have little other natural resources. They're fools to even sell us oil at this point.

When the oil is gone, they will be mostly forgotten.
 

Pacridge

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Ender said:
I understand your concern for the troops and share them. But I believe there's little chance at this time of our troops ever fully leaving Iraq.

We've made some allies in the mid-east. We'll use the rest until we're no longer interested in thier oil reserves. They have little other natural resources. They're fools to even sell us oil at this point.

When the oil is gone, they will be mostly forgotten.
Wow, so we're basically evil and really just trying to use people for their resources? :eek:

I don't see it in terms quite that black and white myself. Yes, some people profit from war, always have , always will. Nature of the beast. I tend to believe other people firmly believe they're trying to the right thing here, however misguided and or misinformed their attempt may be.

As far as our troops never being able to leave Iraq, there were those who said that same thing regarding Vietnam in 1968. Tell me again the number of troops we currently have in Nam? My concern isn't if we leave. It's how soon, on what terms and what the entire region looks at once we do pull out.

In regards to them being forgotten once the oil runs out- maybe. Maybe the Iraqi. Maybe the Afghanis. But I doubt the Saudi's will be failing off the world radar anytime soon. Oil has bought them a nice large chunk of the worlds and the US economy. They'll be around for a while even after the oil has dripped it's last drop.
 

Ender

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Pacridge said:
Wow, so we're basically evil and really just trying to use people for their resources? :eek:
Evil is a concept. Is the wolf evil for eating the rabbit? Or the rabbit deserving because he wasn't capable enough to survive?

The far left would have you believe the former, the far right, the latter. Most of us just shrug and say "Who cares?" Because we know some rabits are going to die and some wolves are going to starve. All in all, it's not really our concern.

Pacridge said:
I don't see it in terms quite that black and white myself. Yes, some people profit from war, always have , always will. Nature of the beast. I tend to believe other people firmly believe they're trying to the right thing here, however misguided and or misinformed their attempt may be.
That's all well and good. But my point isn't interested in the will of the people. Most Americans wouldn't even be aware of Iraqs existance if not pointed out by our resent and slightly past "wars" with them.

Proof: Castro lives. His people starve. We do nothing. Even tho this dictatorship lives just a short hop from our own shore and we could crush his army like a rotten egg.

Why? If we are so interseted in the liberation of others why not start with our closest neighbors and work our way out?

Which brings me to my point. Being the fact that we'll only do such a thing when it benifits our own interest.

It's not "evil". Just "human".

Pacridge said:
As far as our troops never being able to leave Iraq, there were those who said that same thing regarding Vietnam in 1968. Tell me again the number of troops we currently have in Nam? My concern isn't if we leave. It's how soon, on what terms and what the entire region looks at once we do pull out.
I've little idea of the present condition of veitnam. Don't really care to be honest. Didn't we attack vietnam in an attempt to stifle the "domino effect"?

An "effect" now greatly dissipated. Ie: Not "of great interest".

Pacridge said:
In regards to them being forgotten once the oil runs out- maybe. Maybe the Iraqi. Maybe the Afghanis. But I doubt the Saudi's will be failing off the world radar anytime soon. Oil has bought them a nice large chunk of the worlds and the US economy. They'll be around for a while even after the oil has dripped it's last drop.
Connections are only valid so long as power and convinience is there. We've certainly broken enough treaties and argeements just in the last few years because they were no longer useful to us or our current agenda.

The Saudies really have little but oil. Some mineral deposits I understand, but nothing "long term".

They'll have what little political/economic ties they create while strong which will wither as thier power does the same. At the same time, their population is mostly stagnate. Ie: Not growing at a rate large enough to enduce a consumer economy.

They may have some other resources I'm not aware of but, nothing seems to be pointing to them having any real ability beyond the production of oil.

We're there for intersts in oil. Either the consumption or control of said. Oil = power in this day.

But, not for much longer. And once the oil dries up, so will our interest.
 

Pacridge

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I think when it comes to the Saudi's the resource you're missing is cash, and lot's of it. They, along with everyone else in the region, may not have much in the way of natural resources. But they are loaded with cash and "other" holdings around the globe.
 

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As far as our troops never being able to leave Iraq, there were those who said that same thing regarding Vietnam in 1968. Tell me again the number of troops we currently have in Nam? My concern isn't if we leave. It's how soon, on what terms and what the entire region looks at once we do pull out.
As I recall, we pulled out of Vietnam and the North Vietnamese Army sacked Saigon.

WARNING: Emotionally charged - Unsubstantiated response follows!

It's no secret that I don't like Rumsfeld. I have no love for the way he runs his office or what he is doing to the Reserves and National Guards, but Germany can suck my big hairy toe.

F-You. You can't have him. If anyone's going to beat our boy down, it's going to be us.
 

Pacridge

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Yeah, Rummy's a dick but he's our dick. Germany's going to have to find something else to fill their courts with. But Rummy's still major a dick- or minor dick depending on how you view dicks. Huh maybe we should ask his, never mind.
 
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:roll: The troops have bigger fish to fry then to worry about these things. We never had the time to be concrened with things on Tv at home when I was there in 91 we were far to busy and never let these things effect us.

Saying this stuff is bad for moral seems in many cases to be a way to try to sience oppostion to the current admin.

Things occuring in iraq daily like......people dying...NOW thats something that can effect morale.
 

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Ender said:
The man broke the convention.

Maybe he -needs- to be tried
How the hell did he break the convention
 

Calm2Chaos

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Ender said:
I understand your concern for the troops and share them. But I believe there's little chance at this time of our troops ever fully leaving Iraq.

We've made some allies in the mid-east. We'll use the rest until we're no longer interested in thier oil reserves. They have little other natural resources. They're fools to even sell us oil at this point.

When the oil is gone, they will be mostly forgotten.
Brilliant point. well thought out and very clear. I am paying 3 bucks a gallon for gas the highest now in history I belive. But we are there taking their oil. Completely friggin amazing. If taking there oil cost this much lets give it back. Becuase it doesn't seem to be having the desired effect
 

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Damm does the irony just bubble up on this. Germany the most blood thirsty genocidal society in the the last 8 decades is going to charge someone for war crimes....LMAO

This from a nation that slaughtered more people then the Huns. I guess german law just came into effect rather recently to lead the way. It didn't to a lot of head bobbing when it was performing religious genocide in the millions.
 

Calm2Chaos

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nefarious_plot said:
:roll: The troops have bigger fish to fry then to worry about these things. We never had the time to be concrened with things on Tv at home when I was there in 91 we were far to busy and never let these things effect us.

Saying this stuff is bad for moral seems in many cases to be a way to try to sience oppostion to the current admin.

Things occuring in iraq daily like......people dying...NOW thats something that can effect morale.
If they would stop blowing up there own people they wouldn't be dying...
 
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wwow..Im glad I found the ignore option I tend to get testy. But ahhh serinity.


Serintiy includes not worring about typing on a forum. :mrgreen:
 

Calm2Chaos

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nefarious_plot said:
wwow..Im glad I found the ignore option I tend to get testy. But ahhh serinity.


Serintiy includes not worring about typing on a forum. :mrgreen:

Good for you.. I could have told you were that option was a long time ago. LMAO

But if you have no legitimate facts or argument then you really have no reason to ignore anyone. But it is definetly a good way to eliminate anyone with facts....LMAO
 

Stu Ghatze

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vauge said:


Don't worry, those kooks, & quacks that are leftists will peruse over anything that can indict the current Administration officials cause' afteral, America & Bush are evil!

Perhaps they will even look for culpability in Harry Truman's administration too,.. for the bombings of german civilians in WWII!

No...they won't do that because that WAS the LAST war the liberals thought "justified" to engage in, ..let alone be "permitted" to win!
 

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vauge said:
Smells of Michael Ratner, standard bearer of the CCR.

For decades, Ratner and his organization have built a reputation as an advocate for espionage agents of totalitarian foreign governments, including Cuba, East Germany and the Soviet Union, and for international terrorists.

One of his clients, terrorist Victor Manuel Gerena, joins Osama bin Laden on the FBI's 10 Most Wanted Fugitives list and is believed to be hiding in Cuba.

His choice of clients has had little effect on the New York Times and other liberal news organizations, which portray him as a "civil rights" advocate.....if only the victims of his clients could muster that kind of support!

Ratner is using human rights as a propaganda device against the United States, as his own ideology shows an affinity for repressive regimes....the same Ratner who once expressed support for Fidel Castro's regime...one of the most represive on earth.

"Center for Constitutional Rights"...LOL......
 

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Stu Ghatze said:
Don't worry, those kooks, & quacks that are leftists will peruse over anything that can indict the current Administration officials cause' afteral, America & Bush are evil!

Perhaps they will even look for culpability in Harry Truman's administration too,.. for the bombings of german civilians in WWII!

No...they won't do that because that WAS the LAST war the liberals thought "justified" to engage in, ..let alone be "permitted" to win!
While the german civilians were being bombed wasn't the german army busy bombing and burning almost anything that walked
 

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Rummy is "The Man." I'll bet he is really quaking in his boots over this........:roll:
 

26 X World Champs

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Navy Pride said:
Rummy is "The Man." I'll bet he is really quaking in his boots over this........:roll:
:rofl The man? Is there a more pathetic SOD in our history?
Poll Shows Bush Approval Ratings
Sink to Lowest Point in Presidency


President Bush's job approval ratings are at their lowest point of his presidency as only 40% of U.S. adults have a favorable opinion of his job performance and 58% have a negative opinion, according to a Harris Interactive poll. {snip}

At the same time, Vice President Dick Cheney's approval ratings slipped to 35% from 38% in June, while Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld's approval ratings dropped to 40% from 42%.
If 40% approval makes Rummy "The Man" then I want to work there too! Imagine going into a job review and being told that you've only received acceptable marks from 40% of your bosses? Do you think you'd get to keep your job? Think you'd get a raise? :rofl

Source: http://online.wsj.com/public/articl...7fXMITSkTO2yCR8ZiM_20060824,00.html?mod=blogs
 

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26 X World Champs said:
:rofl The man? Is there a more pathetic SOD in our history?

If 40% approval makes Rummy "The Man" then I want to work there too! Imagine going into a job review and being told that you've only received acceptable marks from 40% of your bosses? Do you think you'd get to keep your job? Think you'd get a raise? :rofl

Source: http://online.wsj.com/public/articl...7fXMITSkTO2yCR8ZiM_20060824,00.html?mod=blogs
I love it how you liberals quote the polls when they favor you.........I can still remember prior to the 2004 elections you liberals and Bush haters were so happy that the polls showed his approval rating in the mid forties and then what happened.........He was re elected by over 3,000,000 votes.......So much for your left wing media's polls........
 

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Navy Pride said:
I love it how you liberals quote the polls when they favor you.........I can still remember prior to the 2004 elections you liberals and Bush haters were so happy that the polls showed his approval rating in the mid forties and then what happened.........He was re elected by over 3,000,000 votes.......So much for your left wing media's polls........
LOL Media polls are something like a fox guarding the hen house.:lol:
 
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