Rudy Giuliani: Nails it!

[RetiredUSN]

:doh :doh :doh
Just no.

"Imagine that you’re sitting down to dinner with your family, and while everyone else gets a serving of the meal, you don’t get any. So you say “I should get my fair share.” And as a direct response to this, your dad corrects you, saying, “everyone should get their fair share.” Now, that’s a wonderful sentiment — indeed, everyone should, and that was kinda your point in the first place: that you should be a part of everyone, and you should get your fair share also. However, dad’s smart-ass comment just dismissed you and didn’t solve the problem that you still haven’t gotten any!

The problem is that the statement “I should get my fair share” had an implicit “too” at the end: “I should get my fair share, too, just like everyone else.” But your dad’s response treated your statement as though you meant “only I should get my fair share”, which clearly was not your intention. As a result, his statement that “everyone should get their fair share,” while true, only served to ignore the problem you were trying to point out.

That’s the situation of the “black lives matter” movement. Culture, laws, the arts, religion, and everyone else repeatedly suggest that all lives should matter. Clearly, that message already abounds in our society.


The problem is that, in practice, the world doesn’t work that way. You see the film Nightcrawler? You know the part where Renee Russo tells Jake Gyllenhal that she doesn’t want footage of a black or latino person dying, she wants news stories about affluent white people being killed? That’s not made up out of whole cloth — there is a news bias toward stories that the majority of the audience (who are white) can identify with. So when a young black man gets killed (prior to the recent police shootings), it’s generally not considered “news”, while a middle-aged white woman being killed is treated as news. And to a large degree, that is accurate — young black men are killed in significantly disproportionate numbers, which is why we don’t treat it as anything new. But the result is that, societally, we don’t pay as much attention to certain people’s deaths as we do to others. So, currently, we don’t treat all lives as though they matter equally.

Just like asking dad for your fair share, the phrase “black lives matter” also has an implicit “too” at the end: it’s saying that black lives should also matter. But responding to this by saying “all lives matter” is willfully going back to ignoring the problem. It’s a way of dismissing the statement by falsely suggesting that it means “only black lives matter,” when that is obviously not the case. And so saying “all lives matter” as a direct response to “black lives matter” is essentially saying that we should just go back to ignoring the problem." This is the perfect response to “All Lives Matter” | Fusion

BLM was built on a false premise and continues to operate under the same facade.

 

[blaxshep]

Systemic problems (which is actually what they're claiming) are not the same thing as " systematic conspiracy among all the police"

You're not fooling anyone but yourself.

Nope, pretty much the same thing. Splitting hairs isn't helping your argument.

 

[Gaius46]

Rudy has a record of commitment to public service, with a concentration of work in New York City. I admire what he has done and I think you would too. Please read about him. His Wiki bio should be very eye-opening. His entire body of work proves that he loves NYC and, given the diversity of New Yorkers, if you can love a New Yorker, you can love anybody. He is one of those kinds of people who just doesn't lie.

Thanks.

I was born and raised in NYC and lived there for the first two years of his administration before moving to the burbs in Long Island, though I continued to (and still do) commute to the city for work. I even voted for Rudy while I was a resident.

He was a decent mayor - though a little too dictatorial for my taste. On the other hand it probably takes a dictator to effectively run the city. We called him Mayor Squeegee for his emphasis on low level crimes - "Broken Windows" policing is what it's called I think. As well he and Bill Bratton were obsessed with data driven policing to the point where they'd move massive numbers of cops to higher crime areas only to have the criminals then move to the lower crime areas that the cops had vacated.

But like most NY politicians he was very concerned with being visible. When he was US Attorney for the Southern District of NY he'd often show up a crime scene 5 minutes before the TV cameras and leave 5 minutes afterwards. (Never saw that myself but a number of friends in the NYPD tell the same story). Hence my comment.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

Nope, pretty much the same thing. Splitting hairs isn't helping your argument.

Newp. Not the same thing.

Clearly you're not interested in honestly addressing them or engaging in rational, reality-based dialog.

Bummer

 

[RetiredUSN]

Rudy's comments are what is utter non-sense.

Rudy did save black lives. I was in NYC hundreds of time from the 1970's through the late 90's.

The black murder rate dropped significantly, and the streets were a hell of a lot safer to walk

It was like night and day.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

Rudy did save black lives. I was in NYC hundreds of time from the 1970's through the late 90's.

The black murder rate dropped significantly, and the streets were a hell of a lot safer to walk

It was like night and day.

Oh boy! So since Rudy Giuliani said if you say black lives matter that makes you a racist or it is racist to say those words, and since during his time as mayor of NYC when crime dropped that means Rudy is right when he says saying the words black lives matter is racist?

Also on the Giuliani crime stat claims: How much credit does Giuliani deserve for fighting crime? | PolitiFact

 

[RetiredUSN]

Oh boy! So since Rudy Giuliani said if you say black lives matter that makes you a racist or it is racist to say those words, and since during his time as mayor of NYC when crime dropped that means Rudy is right when he says saying the words black lives matter is racist?

Also on the Giuliani crime stat claims: How much credit does Giuliani deserve for fighting crime? | PolitiFact

OK..you are coming off like a freaking minor bird.

I saw the difference myself, and I do not need to cut and paste some biased article written by some writer with a hard on.

Ask any New Yorker who actually lived there before you post this nonsense........ you are a bright guy, but this isn't one of your better posts.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

OK..you are coming off like a freaking minor bird.

I saw the difference myself, and I do not need to cut and paste some biased article written by some writer with a hard on.

Ask any New Yorker who actually lived there before you post this nonsense........ you are a bright guy, but this isn't one of your better posts.

As usual, you didnt answer the question: So since Rudy Giuliani said if you say black lives matter that makes you a racist or it is racist to say those words, and since during his time as mayor of NYC when crime dropped that means Rudy is right when he says saying the words black lives matter is racist?

 

[Quazimodo]

Thanks.

I was born and raised in NYC and lived there for the first two years of his administration before moving to the burbs in Long Island, though I continued to (and still do) commute to the city for work. I even voted for Rudy while I was a resident.

He was a decent mayor - though a little too dictatorial for my taste. On the other hand it probably takes a dictator to effectively run the city. We called him Mayor Squeegee for his emphasis on low level crimes - "Broken Windows" policing is what it's called I think. As well he and Bill Bratton were obsessed with data driven policing to the point where they'd move massive numbers of cops to higher crime areas only to have the criminals then move to the lower crime areas that the cops had vacated.

But like most NY politicians he was very concerned with being visible. When he was US Attorney for the Southern District of NY he'd often show up a crime scene 5 minutes before the TV cameras and leave 5 minutes afterwards. (Never saw that myself but a number of friends in the NYPD tell the same story). Hence my comment.

Thank you!

The one thing I've always loved about New Yawkahs is that it isn't hard to get an opinion out of 'em. Your experiences are so much more detailed than mine, but I will always admire the way he cleaned the city up. Because of the multi-cultural nature of the NYPD, a leader would have to know a lot just to get along. His track record is what makes me believe he is an expert, you know, "the proof is in the pudding" kind of reaction. I will, however, gladly defer to your "in the field" expertise.

Take care!

 

[RetiredUSN]

As usual, you didnt answer the question: So since Rudy Giuliani said if you say black lives matter that makes you a racist or it is racist to say those words, and since during his time as mayor of NYC when crime dropped that means Rudy is right when he says saying the words black lives matter is racist?

It is racist.......period.

Your own side is saying that " all lives matter " is racist.

Blacks do not deserve special treatment for their inherited skin pigment.

The entire premise of the BLM movement is built on a lie, and continues run with it.

Blacks are not killed disproportionately.............total lie!

 

[TheDemSocialist]

It is racist.......period.

Your own side is saying that " all lives matter " is racist.

Blacks do not deserve special treatment for their inherited skin pigment.

The entire premise of the BLM movement is built on a lie, and continues run with it.

Blacks are not killed disproportionately.............total lie!

So is that a yes to my question? You think its racist because Rudy Giuliani said it?

 

[RetiredUSN]

So is that a yes to my question? You think its racist because Rudy Giuliani said it?

No...I am saying that your accusations (and others on this forum) of racism towards people who respect all lives, is childish, biased, non constructive, and totally ignorant.

Your arrogance is beyond words.

.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

No...I am saying that your accusations (and others on this forum) of racism towards people who respect all lives, is childish, biased, non constructive, and totally ignorant.

Your arrogance is beyond words.

.

:lamo My arrogance? You literally just said I cant disagree with your view on Giuliani and crime rates because you say so. And now your saying its racist, and why? All you have offered is 1.)Giuliani and 2.)"its racist... period".

 

[Gaius46]

Thank you!

The one thing I've always loved about New Yawkahs is that it isn't hard to get an opinion out of 'em. Your experiences are so much more detailed than mine, but I will always admire the way he cleaned the city up. Because of the multi-cultural nature of the NYPD, a leader would have to know a lot just to get along. His track record is what makes me believe he is an expert, you know, "the proof is in the pudding" kind of reaction. I will, however, gladly defer to your "in the field" expertise.

Take care!

New York: 8,000,000 people. 8,000,000 opinions - all of them right

Credit where it's due he did a superlative job of leading city in the days after the terrorist attacks. Not many people could have handled that job as well as he did.

 

[RetiredUSN]

:lamo My arrogance? You literally just said I cant disagree with your view on Giuliani and crime rates because you say so. And now your saying its racist, and why? All you have offered is 1.)Giuliani and 2.)"its racist... period".

Now you you want to twists things around because you are wrong?

You were the one making racism accusations until you got called out on it.

And you are still playing the court jester in the meantime.

 

[Quazimodo]

New York: 8,000,000 people. 8,000,000 opinions - all of them right

Credit where it's due he did a superlative job of leading city in the days after the terrorist attacks. Not many people could have handled that job as well as he did.

Yes, you are right. I can actually remember watching him on the telly and thinking how grateful I was for such a solid voice in what felt like a vast wilderness. I'll never forget him for that. You guys are lucky to have him.

 

[MickeyW]

:doh :doh :doh
Just no.

"Imagine that you’re sitting down to dinner with your family, and while everyone else gets a serving of the meal, you don’t get any. So you say “I should get my fair share.” And as a direct response to this, your dad corrects you, saying, “everyone should get their fair share.” Now, that’s a wonderful sentiment — indeed, everyone should, and that was kinda your point in the first place: that you should be a part of everyone, and you should get your fair share also. However, dad’s smart-ass comment just dismissed you and didn’t solve the problem that you still haven’t gotten any!

The problem is that the statement “I should get my fair share” had an implicit “too” at the end: “I should get my fair share, too, just like everyone else.” But your dad’s response treated your statement as though you meant “only I should get my fair share”, which clearly was not your intention. As a result, his statement that “everyone should get their fair share,” while true, only served to ignore the problem you were trying to point out.

That’s the situation of the “black lives matter” movement. Culture, laws, the arts, religion, and everyone else repeatedly suggest that all lives should matter. Clearly, that message already abounds in our society.


The problem is that, in practice, the world doesn’t work that way. You see the film Nightcrawler? You know the part where Renee Russo tells Jake Gyllenhal that she doesn’t want footage of a black or latino person dying, she wants news stories about affluent white people being killed? That’s not made up out of whole cloth — there is a news bias toward stories that the majority of the audience (who are white) can identify with. So when a young black man gets killed (prior to the recent police shootings), it’s generally not considered “news”, while a middle-aged white woman being killed is treated as news. And to a large degree, that is accurate — young black men are killed in significantly disproportionate numbers, which is why we don’t treat it as anything new. But the result is that, societally, we don’t pay as much attention to certain people’s deaths as we do to others. So, currently, we don’t treat all lives as though they matter equally.

Just like asking dad for your fair share, the phrase “black lives matter” also has an implicit “too” at the end: it’s saying that black lives should also matter. But responding to this by saying “all lives matter” is willfully going back to ignoring the problem. It’s a way of dismissing the statement by falsely suggesting that it means “only black lives matter,” when that is obviously not the case. And so saying “all lives matter” as a direct response to “black lives matter” is essentially saying that we should just go back to ignoring the problem." This is the perfect response to “All Lives Matter” | Fusion

Ahhhhhh.....................so that is why obama talks about all the Black males shot by a citizen or police as his son, but was totally
silent about the young white woman, murdered in SF by a 6 time deported, illegal POS!

Payback...I get it!

Your post is a bunch of putrefied BS!

 

[MickeyW]

Utter non-sense.

It certainly is!

Tell it like it is, Rudy! (and for all you malcontents out there, he is an EXPERT, and he KNOWS what he is talking about)

He sure does and he was the best Mayor NYC has had in recent history.....maybe longer.

I think the kid in your first example didn't do his homework and will be fed, when he has (too).

Yep. Funny how he can design his post around his made up narrative.... with a lot of holes in it!

Rudy's comments are what is utter non-sense.

Not at all, yours are! But, that's always been your M.O.

None of that matters when there is no internal assessment of the situation.
Always, always blaming others, when it's not always others, will not solve the problem, ever.

BLM is foisting up people that were not innocent, as innocent victims.

Situations that are still under investigation, where we don't fully know what happened, as innocent victims.
It's a crock of ****, it's anti intellectual, it's just reactionary mobism.

Absolutely correct!!! :thumbs::thumbs:

Very few of these turds....are innocent!

No, it's not. Trying to dismiss it by simply calling it that indicates it's either over your head or you're simply not interested in honest discourse.

Rudy was as blatantly honest and correct as it gets. I stood up and cheered when he talked.

Why is it that liberals Can't Handle the Truth when it's put to them?

 

[MickeyW]

Bad cops put a target on cops' backs.

False!

 

[Quazimodo]

False!

As I said before, "BAD BLACKS put a target on BAD BLACK'S backs." They get what they deserve.

 

[iguanaman]

It is racist.......period.

Your own side is saying that " all lives matter " is racist.

Blacks do not deserve special treatment for their inherited skin pigment.

The entire premise of the BLM movement is built on a lie, and continues run with it.

Blacks are not killed disproportionately.............total lie!

I guess they just have a disproportionate number of cellphone cameras recording these incidents then? Where are the videos of white drivers that are shot for questionable reasons? I assume you must have seen many of them. How about sharing them.

 

[MickeyW]

As I said before, "BAD BLACKS put a target on BAD BLACK'S backs." They get what they deserve.

You Damn Right they do! :applaud

I guess they just have a disproportionate number of cellphone cameras recording these incidents then? Where are the videos of white drivers that are shot for questionable reasons? I assume you must have seen many of them. How about sharing them.

White drivers as a rule, have more respect for the police and aren't involved in nearly as much crime. However, more Whites are shot by police than Blacks. That fact was posted yesterday...where ya been?

 

[MickeyW]

Blacks were, and still are, profiled, whether the cops will admit it or not. Why? Because they are far more likely to be a threat to the police....

For those who Can't Handle that fact....I'm not surprised.

 

[iguanaman]

You Damn Right they do! :applaud



White drivers as a rule, have more respect for the police and aren't involved in nearly as much crime. However, more Whites are shot by police than Blacks. That fact was posted yesterday...where ya been?

So black drivers get shot more because they deserve it? That is not what a lot of the videos show. Your point would be much more believable if you just had EVEN ONE video of a white driver being shot during a traffic stop.

 

[MickeyW]

So black drivers get shot more because they deserve it? That is not what a lot of the videos show. Your point would be much more believable if you just had EVEN ONE video of a white driver being shot during a traffic stop.

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search...&p=video+of+white+driver+being+shot+by+police.

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search...&p=video+of+white+driver+being+shot+by+police.


Damn! That was soooooo hard to find!