Republicans want to speed up death penalty

[Calm2Chaos]

Very interesting thought. Would you like applied to yourself if you can't pay a correct lawyer and are convicted of a crime you didn't commit?

I think that you are confident that your justice system doesn't condemn innocent people, although it has been proved it does (as all judicial systems).

If I could have that confidence, I would agree with you. As I can't, I can't.

CU
Y

I am confident that I do not put myself in a situation were I could be mistaken for things like this. However knowing that mistakes do happen. I am not willing to turn something upside down for a very few possibilities. Verdicts in death penalty cases are not turned over all to often. Yes it happens rarely, but the overall percetage is very very low. I think you have to look at the greater good sometimes, and not the single situation. We seem to be running out of space to house criminals, and money to deal with them. How much does it cost a year to Defend (public defender) house, feed, care for our criminal system in the US? Thats a lot of money coming out of the taxpayers pocket. So if we can't zap em then we should be able to use them as labor.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

Why do they want to speed it up? Why risking executing someone who is innocent for example. Just wondering what the reasoning behind it is

There are several reasons for this. The primary reason is that most inmates which have been sentanced to death rot in prison before getting anywhere near the death chamber so their sentance is never fully carrried out. Apparently republicans are tired of being bogged down by senseless and inane appeals which prevent the sentance from being carried out and I agree. Another reason is that our prisons are overcrowded. If deathrow inmates would be sent to the chamber right away instead of sitting around iin prison wasting tax payer dollars for decades it would certainly allieviate the problem.

 

[Navy Pride]

There are several reasons for this. The primary reason is that most inmates which have been sentanced to death rot in prison before getting anywhere near the death chamber so their sentance is never fully carrried out. Apparently republicans are tired of being bogged down by senseless and inane appeals which prevent the sentance from being carried out and I agree. Another reason is that our prisons are overcrowded. If deathrow inmates would be sent to the chamber right away instead of sitting around iin prison wasting tax payer dollars for decades it would certainly allieviate the problem.

You have got it right..........

 

[epr64]

There are several reasons for this. The primary reason is that most inmates which have been sentanced to death rot in prison before getting anywhere near the death chamber so their sentance is never fully carrried out. Apparently republicans are tired of being bogged down by senseless and inane appeals which prevent the sentance from being carried out and I agree. Another reason is that our prisons are overcrowded. If deathrow inmates would be sent to the chamber right away instead of sitting around iin prison wasting tax payer dollars for decades it would certainly allieviate the problem.

Are you really telling us that you prefer having an innocent dead (as long as appeals can be heard, it means there's the shadow of a doubt..) to free place in jails and to pay less??

Is that the value of human life for you?

Y

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

Are you really telling us that you prefer having an innocent dead (as long as appeals can be heard, it means there's the shadow of a doubt..) to free place in jails and to pay less??

Is that the value of human life for you?

Y

How many prisoners on death row been found innocent after appeal? VERY FEW and NO ONE recent. Most of those appeals are to get out of deathrow not a declaration of innocence. The sentance should be carried out. They shouldn't be permitted to clog the courts and waste taxpayer dollars.

 

[BWG]

So you would put economics over a persons life?



January 13, 2003

Illinois Gov. George Ryan, who leaves office Monday, pardoned four death row inmates Friday after determining they had been tortured into confessing crimes they did not commit.

All four are part of a group of 10 death row prisoners who claim they were tortured into giving confessions under the direction of then-Chicago Police Commander Jon Burge. He was fired after internal police investigators found systemic evidence of physical abuse of suspects.

Capital punishment in Illinois came under the microscope after a group of journalism students at Northwestern began looking into the case of Anthony Porter in the late 1990s.

The students, working with their professor and a private investigator, found evidence that cleared Porter after 17 years on death row. Ryan vowed he would do whatever it took to "prevent another Anthony Porter."

http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/01/11/illinois.death.row/


This is why I'm against the death penalty, not the 'no-doubt-about' murderers. As long as there is that minute chance of killing an innocent person, I don't think it is worth it.

Transpose yourself:
Strapped to a gurney, needle in your arm, you're about to be injected with deadly chemicals, you KNOW you didn't kill anyone, noone BELIEVES you, you are about to die for no reason and you CAN'T do a thing about it.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

So you would put economics over a persons life?



January 13, 2003

Illinois Gov. George Ryan, who leaves office Monday, pardoned four death row inmates Friday after determining they had been tortured into confessing crimes they did not commit.

All four are part of a group of 10 death row prisoners who claim they were tortured into giving confessions under the direction of then-Chicago Police Commander Jon Burge. He was fired after internal police investigators found systemic evidence of physical abuse of suspects.

Capital punishment in Illinois came under the microscope after a group of journalism students at Northwestern began looking into the case of Anthony Porter in the late 1990s.

The students, working with their professor and a private investigator, found evidence that cleared Porter after 17 years on death row. Ryan vowed he would do whatever it took to "prevent another Anthony Porter."

http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/01/11/illinois.death.row/


This is why I'm against the death penalty, not the 'no-doubt-about' murderers. As long as there is that minute chance of killing an innocent person, I don't think it is worth it.

Transpose yourself:
Strapped to a gurney, needle in your arm, you're about to be injected with deadly chemicals, you KNOW you didn't kill anyone, noone BELIEVES you, you are about to die for no reason and you CAN'T do a thing about it.

Yes I would put economics over a criminals life. Would you like to live nextdoor to a maximum security prison? God knows we need them..the prisons are overcrowded so officials release rapists, thieves, and other offenders. Good idea..let a rapist out so he can rape again. I'd rather see him dead. Don't let him go..blow his head off instead. That will make room.
About your last comment. I would die in prison before it ever came to that. 99.9% of deathrow inmates sit around on deathrow for 30 years or more and by the time their execution day comes they've already died of old age.

 

[shuamort]

How many prisoners on death row been found innocent after appeal? VERY FEW and NO ONE recent. Most of those appeals are to get out of deathrow not a declaration of innocence. The sentance should be carried out. They shouldn't be permitted to clog the courts and waste taxpayer dollars.

No prisoners who have been executed have EVER been found to be innocent. No one who has been charged of a crime has been found to be innocent. They've just been found to be not guilty. The problem is, once a person is dead, the courts won't take the time to go over the case to show a person is not guilty. You know why? Because they're dead.

 

[Navy Pride]

This is all about executing people that are guilty..........Where there is no question of guilt..........The appeals process is a mess............Some time and inmate sits on death row up to 25 years before he or she is executed.......That is ridiculous and very costly.............

Ten years should be plenty of time to process all the necessary appeals...............

 

[scottyz]

No prisoners who have been executed have EVER been found to be innocent. No one who has been charged of a crime has been found to be innocent. They've just been found to be not guilty. The problem is, once a person is dead, the courts won't take the time to go over the case to show a person is not guilty. You know why? Because they're dead.

Whaaaaat! you mean they can't hire lawyers from the after life? It's a very convient setup for the legal system.

 

[shuamort]

Whaaaaat! you mean they can't hire lawyers from the after life? It's a very convient setup for the legal system.

Yeah, I'm surprised port-mortem law hasn't caught on more.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

No prisoners who have been executed have EVER been found to be innocent. No one who has been charged of a crime has been found to be innocent. They've just been found to be not guilty. The problem is, once a person is dead, the courts won't take the time to go over the case to show a person is not guilty. You know why? Because they're dead.

My point was that people on death row don't file appeals claiming their innocence of the crime. Hence they aren't claiming they are innocent. They're only doing it to try to get out of the death sentance and or waste time so they can sit around in prison saping tax dollars for a few more decades. About your comment about the governor pardoning criminals...Bill Clinton pardoned Marc Rich..it doesn't mean they're innocent of a crime that a judge and jury found them guilty of it only means that certain government officials have formed opinions on events which had no standing in a court of law. The "torture" argument would have come up in their trials and the jude and jury obviously found it to be untrue.

 

[shuamort]

My point was that people on death row don't file appeals claiming their innocence of the crime. Hence they aren't claiming they are innocent. They're only doing it to try to get out of the death sentance and or waste time so they can sit around in prison saping tax dollars for a few more decades.

You'll, of course, need to prove that with cites.

About your comment about the governor pardoning criminals...Bill Clinton pardoned Marc Rich..it doesn't mean they're innocent of a crime that a judge and jury found them guilty of it only means that certain government officials have formed opinions on events which had no standing in a court of law. The "torture" argument would have come up in their trials and the jude and jury obviously found it to be untrue.

Umm, what comment? I didn't make any comments as such.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

You'll, of course, need to prove that with cites.


Umm, what comment? I didn't make any comments as such.

That comment was ment for someone else but the parts about the judge and jury also apply to you.

 

[shuamort]

That comment was ment for someone else but the parts about the judge and jury also apply to you.

And as such, you'll need to still prove your claim.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

And as such, you'll need to still prove your claim.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-02-09-elder-death_x.htm

http://www.house.gov/apps/list/speech/ca03_lungren/030605deathrowoftenmeansalonglife.html

 

[epr64]

How many prisoners on death row been found innocent after appeal? VERY FEW and NO ONE recent. Most of those appeals are to get out of deathrow not a declaration of innocence. The sentance should be carried out. They shouldn't be permitted to clog the courts and waste taxpayer dollars.

Very few doesn't qualify. Only NONE would qualify. And even then, only if they had first rate lawyers, able to put everything out during a trial.

And you know that's not the case.

It's a bit too easy to kill your neighbour because he costs you a tiny bit of money.

Now, seeing the way you value human life, I understand some of your posts a bit better.

The ONLY case where I could admit death penalty would be the case where someone:
1/ Was caught red-handed
2/ Recognises he killed the victim
3/ Has a top-rated lawyer

And even then, I think that it's our responsibility as a society to allow someone to better himself. We saw cases lately in the US where criminals were evidently changed. That's also one of the goals of the judiciary system.

One can always liberate a criminal that finally understood what he did, or someone wrongly convicted, but one cannot, ever, ressucitate someone wrongly killed.

Y

 

[SKILMATIC]

Re:

Republicans want to speed up death penalty

YAAAAAY:applaud :cheers: :2party:

I THINK YOU GET THE HINT ON WHAT I THINK

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

Very few doesn't qualify. Only NONE would qualify. And even then, only if they had first rate lawyers, able to put everything out during a trial.

And you know that's not the case.

It's a bit too easy to kill your neighbour because he costs you a tiny bit of money.

Now, seeing the way you value human life, I understand some of your posts a bit better.

The ONLY case where I could admit death penalty would be the case where someone:
1/ Was caught red-handed
2/ Recognises he killed the victim
3/ Has a top-rated lawyer

And even then, I think that it's our responsibility as a society to allow someone to better himself. We saw cases lately in the US where criminals were evidently changed. That's also one of the goals of the judiciary system.

One can always liberate a criminal that finally understood what he did, or someone wrongly convicted, but one cannot, ever, ressucitate someone wrongly killed.

Y

There have been plenty of cases when after being "re-educated" these criminals went out and committed the SAME crime sometimes more than twice.

 

[ShamMol]

Very few doesn't qualify. Only NONE would qualify. And even then, only if they had first rate lawyers, able to put everything out during a trial.

And even then, I think that it's our responsibility as a society to allow someone to better himself. We saw cases lately in the US where criminals were evidently changed. That's also one of the goals of the judiciary system.

One can always liberate a criminal that finally understood what he did, or someone wrongly convicted, but one cannot, ever, ressucitate someone wrongly killed.

Join my team...we are taking over. No, I jest. I almost agree completely except for the fact that we can't really ever be sure 100% that someone is guilty because there will always be some sort of evidence that provides doubt. But doesn't take away from guilt-just the 100% part.

I completely agree that we must allow them to have that chance to better themselves, but with that also comes general prison reform, a topic I doubt you want to get into in this thread...

And nightengale-do we punish everyone for the crimes of a few? We don't. We don't say that all muslims are terrorists just because some people of the islamic faith went extreme and blew up the wtc-no. *whacks nose with newspaper*