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Religion and World Peace

Most religions teach a version of "thou shalt not kill" but almost none have failed in finding frequent exceptions.

"just war theory"? Yeah, okay. The commandment must have an asterisk I missed or something.

It's just like anything else, everybody wants to speak for God. Some people think "kill" simply means to end the life processes of a person or animal, others understand "kill" means to murder, or terminate with extreme prejudice. Ya gotta think these things through.

This is why I don't carry a gun. I don't want the responsibility of having to decide in a split second what to do with it. My brother thinks I am shirking my responsibility as a shepherd. I say if God wants me and the flock to be safe He will see to it.

BUT...that doesn't mean I can't go hunting.
 
So you agree that 'some' wars were fought for religious reasons. Seems we are in agreement.....moving on.....

That wasn't the premise of your thread, and you know it.
 
Nah, what really screws it up every time is when the religious and the political become intertwined...

That was the gist/meaning of my 1st sentence. The money and power whores from both camps get in bed with one another all the time. Go back to the 1930's. Some really embarrassing bonding back then.
 
It's just like anything else, everybody wants to speak for God. Some people think "kill" simply means to end the life processes of a person or animal, others understand "kill" means to murder, or terminate with extreme prejudice. Ya gotta think these things through.

This is why I don't carry a gun. I don't want the responsibility of having to decide in a split second what to do with it. My brother thinks I am shirking my responsibility as a shepherd. I say if God wants me and the flock to be safe He will see to it.

BUT...that doesn't mean I can't go hunting.

In what I wrote there I was going with the extreme prejudice meaning - war being extreme. I don't read that commandment to be saying submit yourself or your family to a killer. I support the 2nd amendment and the right of any truly responsible (and sane) adult to carry a weapon. I haven't personally crossed that bridge to carrying, and for a version of the same reason you give.
 
Why can't you get this.

Atheists have no shared beliefs - they simply had a shared disbelief that a god or gods exist.

Some Atheists may say that religion causes war, some may not. For myself I think the answer is obvious that it has.


Atheists have general tendencies to share certain beliefs. As you just verified.
 
Atheists have general tendencies to share certain beliefs. As you just verified.

...which is why they are all here, giving assent to their "non belief", and they expect us to believe them instead of our own lying eyes.
 
With all of the differing religious theologies, some of which direct their followers to go forth and convert all to believe as they do, some even using physical force, is there any scenario in which it is conceivable world wide peace can ever be achieved ?

There is a religion, the Baha'i Faith, which believes that religion is the only way to achieve world peace. Their message is that all of the religions of the world are from the same God. The reason for the differences in message was that he was speaking to difference people, different cultures, at different points in history. But God has never stopped speaking to man.

His latest message is that mankind has matured now to a stage where it can lay aside its differences on religion, race, nationality, sex, etc... and create a world of peace. They were even talking about a United Nations, with law enforcement capability, in the middle of the 19th century- before WWI and WWII. They felt that a forum where differences of opinion and conflicts could be talked out in a public forum, and a democratic world government with a system of enforceable law and order was the only way peace and prosperity.

Unfortunately, they arose out of 19th century Persia (now Iran). The religion grew too rapidly for the taste of the Islamic clergy there, and they exiled the founder of the faith, Baha'u'llah, and massacred most of his followers in Persia.

Now, the religion numbers about 5 million people, and spread thoughout the world, from Japan to Africa. It's an interesting thought: to use religion as a force for peace and unity, rather than war and division.

If people gotta have religion, this is as good as any.

"The Great Peace towards which people of goodwill throughout the centuries have inclined their hearts, of which seers and poets for countless generations have expressed their vision, and for which from age to age the sacred scriptures of mankind have constantly held the promise, is now at long last within the reach of the nations. For the first time in history it is possible for everyone to view the entire planet, with all its myriad diversified peoples, in one perspective. World peace is not only possible but inevitable.

Whether this peace is to be reached only after unimaginable horrors precipitated by humanity’s stubborn clinging to old patterns of behavior, or is to be embraced now by an act of consultative will, is the choice before all who inhabit the earth. At this critical juncture when the intractable problems confronting nations have been fused into one common concern for the whole world, failure to stem the tide of conflict and disorder would be unconscionably irresponsible...

To choose such a course is not to deny humanity’s past but to understand it. The Bahá’í Faith regards the current world confusion and calamitous condition in human affairs as a natural phase in an organic process leading ultimately and irresistibly to the unification of the human race in a single social order whose boundaries are those of the planet. The human race, as a distinct, organic unit, has passed through evolutionary stages analogous to the stages of infancy and childhood in the lives of its individual members, and is now in the culminating period of its turbulent adolescence approaching its long-awaited coming of age.

A candid acknowledgement that prejudice, war and exploitation have been the expression of immature stages in a vast historical process and that the human race is today experiencing the unavoidable tumult which marks its collective coming of age is not a reason for despair but a prerequisite to undertaking the stupendous enterprise of building a peaceful world. That such an enterprise is possible, that the necessary constructive forces do exist, that unifying social structures can be erected, is the theme we urge you to examine. "
https://www.bahai.org/beliefs/universal-peace/promise-world-peace/
 
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There is a religion, the Baha'i Faith, which believes that religion is the only way to achieve world peace. Their message is that all of the religions of the world are from the same God. The reason for the differences in message was that he was speaking to difference people, different cultures, at different points in history. But God has never stopped speaking to man.

His latest message is that mankind has matured now to a stage where it can lay aside its differences on religion, race, nationality, sex, etc... and create a world of peace. They were even talking about a United Nations, with law enforcement capability, in the middle of the 19th century- before WWI and WWII. They felt that a forum where differences of opinion and conflicts could be talked out in a public forum, and a democratic world government with a system of enforceable law and order was the only way peace and prosperity.

Unfortunately, they arose out of 19th century Persia (now Iran). The religion grew too rapidly for the taste of the Islamic clergy there, and they exiled the founder of the faith, Baha'u'llah, and massacred most of his followers in Persia.

Now, the religion if about 5 million people, and spread thoughout the world, from Japan to Africa. It's an interesting thought: to use religion as a force for peace and unity, rather than war and division.

Back in 1998, I had worked for a man who fled from Iran who practiced Baha'i Faith. He tried to convert me, but wasn't overly pushy in doing so, especially after I informed him I was a religious skeptic. All -in-all a good man and a rather interesting religious concept.
 
Why can't you get this.

Atheists have no shared beliefs - they simply had a shared disbelief that a god or gods exist.

Some Atheists may say that religion causes war, some may not. For myself I think the answer is obvious that it has.
That is a testable hypothesis: Using Pew 2014 relgious data we can isolate at least 3 religion groups about the same size as atheists & throw in agnostics to compare. Then we look at the chance you make an acurate guess based on the combined averages closest to the stereotype[top result]. The five comparison groups I pulled being Atheists, Agnostics, Methodists, Pentecostals & Nondenominational Evangelicals as they are around the same size.

Atheists
Guess: Male, White, Non-immigrant, Non-Parent

~36% chance of being right

Guess: Liberal leaning Democrat

39% chance of being right

Ratio of agreement of 5 contraversial questions:

8.11 : 1

Agnostics
Guess: Male, White, Non-immigrant, Non-Parent

~35% chance of being right

Guess: Liberal leaning Democrat

30% chance of being right

Ratio of agreement of 5 controversial questions:

7.73 : 1

Methodists
Guess: female, White, Non-immigrant, Non-Parent

~38% chance of being right

Guess: Conservative leaning Republican

23%

Ratio of agreement of 5 controversial questions:

1.68 : 1

Pentecostals
Guess: female, White, Non-immigrant, Non-Parent

~38% chance of being right

Guess: Conservative leaning Republican

24% chance of being right

Ratio of agreement of 5 controversial questions:

1.60 : 1

Nondenominational Evangelical
Guess: female, White, Non-immigrant, Non-Parent

~23% chance of being right

Guess: Conservative leaning Republican

34% chance of being right

Ratio of agreement of 5 controversial questions:

1.87 : 1


In other words, "atheists"/"agnostics" at least in America are slightly more homogenous and predicable than similar religious groups. Does that change when the question is something less political like universal wonder, well-being, relative morality & sources of guidance on right and wrong? Not really, you still find a slightly higher to simlar homogeneity. Does that change if we use lower probabaility with more specific generalizations like education, income or age? No.

So, sorry theoretically that may be true but in practice you can pretty accurately guess.

PS: I would note knowing gender or age + religion you could be even more accurate. As all that is based on religion alone.
 
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Back in 1998, I had worked for a man who fled from Iran who practiced Baha'i Faith. He tried to convert me, but wasn't overly pushy in doing so, especially after I informed him I was a religious skeptic. All -in-all a good man and a rather interesting religious concept.

My nephew married an Iranian woman from Australia whose family fled Iran due to their Baha'i faith because their lives literally depended on it. He has since converted to her faith. That's what love can do.
 
Contemporary New Atheists are very likely to believe in transhumanism. They are very likely to believe in the "modern synthesis" theory of evolution. They are very likely to think consciousness is generated by physical brains, and that it will be possible some day to build functioning brains. They think it is possible, or probable, that medical science will cure all diseases.

Those are some typical examples of things that New Atheists agree on. If you are a New Atheist, and you disagree with any of them, I would be very surprised.

Atheism, especially New Atheism, is an ideology.
 
Contemporary New Atheists are very likely to believe in transhumanism. They are very likely to believe in the "modern synthesis" theory of evolution. They are very likely to think consciousness is generated by physical brains, and that it will be possible some day to build functioning brains. They think it is possible, or probable, that medical science will cure all diseases.

Those are some typical examples of things that New Atheists agree on. If you are a New Atheist, and you disagree with any of them, I would be very surprised.

Atheism, especially New Atheism, is an ideology.

credible, verifiable, citation (s) to support these positive claims ?
 
credible, verifiable, citation (s) to support these positive claims ?

Anyone here who is a New Atheist and disagrees with any of them can tell us.
 
So, no citations = claim(s) dismissed.

If all the atheists here agree with all of those statements, then you will see I know what I'm talking about.
 
If all the atheists here agree with all of those statements, then you will see I know what I'm talking about.

On that note, based on many,many posts in this forum area by numerous atheists, clearly you do not know what you are talking about.
 
On that note, based on many,many posts in this forum area by numerous atheists, clearly you do not know what you are talking about.

If they disagree with any of it, they can tell us.
 
They already have numerous times in numerous threads....moving on .......

I haven't seen any who disagreed with any statements I listed. They are welcome to disagree now. You are welcome to show us which ones you disagree with.
 
So, no citations = claim(s) dismissed.

You don't have any room to dismiss anyone else's posts after your weak response to the information I provided you.
 
You don't have any room to dismiss anyone else's posts after your weak response to the information I provided you.

Your 'information' was summarily dismissed because you tried and failed to read another's mind, which is waaaaay above your pay scale.
 
With all of the differing religious theologies, some of which direct their followers to go forth and convert all to believe as they do, some even using physical force, is there any scenario in which it is conceivable world wide peace can ever be achieved ?

When Jesus returns, slaughters His enemies, and sets up His kingdom on earth it will be mission accomplished.
 
When Jesus returns, slaughters His enemies, and sets up His kingdom on earth it will be mission accomplished.

/////// slaughters his enemies ///// :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:
 
With all of the differing religious theologies, some of which direct their followers to go forth and convert all to believe as they do, some even using physical force, is there any scenario in which it is conceivable world wide peace can ever be achieved ?

one group violently conquers all others and elimats all who won't convert unlikely but that might do it till the next schism hits
 
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