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Religion and Addictive Personalities

Why would anyone want to deny a person right to do so?

Who is talking about denying people the right to "pick an imaginary man in the sky (or the North Pole) to bow down to"?
 
Why would anyone want to deny a person right to do so?

How would you stop them if you wanted to? You can't control what goes on inside their head. That doesn't make it the factually correct thing to do though.
 
I did the same thing with cigarettes, but how long is "a while"? I smoked 5 years, 0.5 - 2 packs/day, so I definitely had to fight through a withdrawal period. (Mainly consisting of two weeks of ignoring mental whispers along the lines of "who are they to tell you not to smoke? You can do what you want. Besides, withdrawal isn't so bad. You could do this at any time" and, the worst bit, waking up every 30-60 minutes every night because, in a dream, I had decided to smoke again. I'd wake up sucking in pillow, quite literally).

I ask because nicotine is physically addictive as well as psychologically addictive. So while someone who isn't psychologically addicted isn't likely to have the same oral fixation about smoke inhalation, place/time triggers, etc., they'll still have to deal with the physical symptoms and any resulting mental effects.

I didn't. I decided I didn't want to do it anymore and I just didn't. No withdrawals, no cravings, no nothing. My desire went out like a light.
 
Who is talking about denying people the right to "pick an imaginary man in the sky (or the North Pole) to bow down to"?

A poster who assumes one would be crazy to do so. Perhaps I should have said "being critical" same as denying.
 
How would you stop them if you wanted to? You can't control what goes on inside their head. That doesn't make it the factually correct thing to do though.

Those would be your facts, your reality.
 
Anyway.....addictive personalities and religion? I don't really see a cross-over.

I've known plenty of people who will tell me that they know God cannot be proven/disproven and even doubt its existence, but still participate in organized religion for other reasons. Community, a sense of peacefulness, etc. All sorts.

Then there are people who will tell me they fully believe but realize it is irrational, that is beyond empirical proof or disproof. l=

Then there is the almost but not entirely universally applicable saying, that everyone in the trenches believes. There's some kind of deep reassurance that comes and comes harder the more fervent belief, which fervent belief is more natural the more perilous the situation. Started to fall off a cliff while taking a selfie, but managed to stop the slide 10 feet down with another 500 below you? I suspect only the most ardent atheist would refuse to think some kind of prayer as they try to save themselves from certain death. Etc.

Other people seem to believe mainly because facing general uncertainty causes anxiety. Worried about getting killed by a drunk driver? A terrorist? Disease? A tree limb? Has something horrible happened in your life? Well, then maybe it'll feel better if you tell yourself that it all happens for some unfathomable reason, for some reason that transcends everything your brain is screaming at you and explains why that horrible thing had to happen.



None of those sound like the same kind of risk-reward cycles that underlie addiction, and that is only a few examples. It's more of a mental balm, which admittedly is part - but only part - of addiction's draw (and not the only one). And it doesn't always work, does it? Or maybe I'm wrong. If one can truly be "addicted" to video game playing (I doubt this), then perhaps it's close enough. It provides some kind of thing that the individual may find necessary rather than simply pleasurable or relieving.
 
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I didn't. I decided I didn't want to do it anymore and I just didn't. No withdrawals, no cravings, no nothing. My desire went out like a light.

Well, if you don't want to reveal anything personal, that's fine. I was curious because having a "non-addictive personality" doesn't exempt a person from physical withdrawal. It only makes them rather less susceptible to psychological addiction.

I guarantee you that every single person with a "non-addictive personality" would go throw a hell of withdrawal if they shot heroin twice a day for six months straight. And cigarettes, like heroin, are physically addictive. Just takes a tad longer and the withdrawal is nothing in comparison (ok, from what I've heard. I would not do heroin).
 
Those would be your facts, your reality.

There is no "your" reality. There is only reality. If your thoughts are out of sync with reality, you are just wrong.
 
Well, if you don't want to reveal anything personal, that's fine. I was curious because having a "non-addictive personality" doesn't exempt a person from physical withdrawal. It only makes them rather less susceptible to psychological addiction.

I guarantee you that every single person with a "non-addictive personality" would go throw a hell of withdrawal if they shot heroin twice a day for six months straight. And cigarettes, like heroin, are physically addictive. Just takes a tad longer and the withdrawal is nothing in comparison (ok, from what I've heard. I would not do heroin).

I didn't have any physical withdrawal. You can choose not to believe me if you like, I couldn't care less.
 
I didn't have any physical withdrawal. You can choose not to believe me if you like, I couldn't care less.

I simply asked how much/long you smoked, out of curiosity. I have no idea why that elicited belligerence. Whatever, life is short........

:2wave:
 
I simply asked how much/long you smoked, out of curiosity. I have no idea why that elicited belligerence. Whatever, life is short........

:2wave:

Probably 2-3 years, at least a pack a day.
 
I did the same thing with cigarettes, but how long is "a while"? I smoked 5 years, 0.5 - 2 packs/day, so I definitely had to fight through a withdrawal period. (Mainly consisting of two weeks of ignoring mental whispers along the lines of "who are they to tell you not to smoke? You can do what you want. Besides, withdrawal isn't so bad. You could do this at any time" and, the worst bit, waking up every 30-60 minutes every night because, in a dream, I had decided to smoke again. I'd wake up sucking in pillow, quite literally).

I ask because nicotine is physically addictive as well as psychologically addictive. So while someone who isn't psychologically addicted isn't likely to have the same oral fixation about smoke inhalation, place/time triggers, etc., they'll still have to deal with the physical symptoms and any resulting mental effects.

I don't know but I expect that psychological addiction, particularly when it is such a deeply self identity thing, would be harder.
 
Obviously, not everyone who is religious also has an addictive personality; many are born into religious families and never question their beliefs.

But, this thread is about those who convert to religion from a non-religious, or agnostic state.

I propose that there is a link between addictive personalities and conversion to religion. This came to my attention a few years ago when a family member who works in law enforcement explained how recruiting inmates was so easy. "They just go from one addiction, whether that be drugs, alcohol, sex or whatever, to another addition -- religion."

In fact, 12-Step recovery programs tend to focus on converting the addict to religion by claiming that they cannot control themselves, only a higher authority can. An ex-neighbor went to those meetings and she became quite inundated in the rhetoric. She stopped drinking, but only for a few years, then she went back on the bottle and claimed God had forsaken her. It was pathetic to watch.

Interestingly, I've read many other accounts of people who were heavy into booze/drugs who came out of their own accord (no religion), and their results seemed to be lasting.

Some may say that it's easy to convert this type of person because they are at a low point in their lives, but, I think it's more likely that they can be converted because they were addictive personalities to begin with.

What do others think? Can a person who is mentally strong and happy be converted as easily as one who is an addictive personality?

I'm really interested in hearing the views of others.

IMO, the primary trait required to become a religious zealot is the need to follow and belong. Strong willed, Lone Wolf types don't usually become zealots. Next, IMO, comes a lack of education. The well educated, although sometimes spiritual and strong believers in nebulously defined deities, rarely fall for the dogma of ancient myths.

So, it's probably a combination: addictive personality, needy, stupid etc. which drives one to become a religious zealot.
 
IMO, the primary trait required to become a religious zealot is the need to follow and belong. Strong willed, Lone Wolf types don't usually become zealots. Next, IMO, comes a lack of education. The well educated, although sometimes spiritual and strong believers in nebulously defined deities, rarely fall for the dogma of ancient myths.

So, it's probably a combination: addictive personality, needy, stupid etc. which drives one to become a religious zealot.

You bring an important distinction to the table -- "zealot." I probably should have specified that in the OP. Zealots are the ones who feel compelled to convince others that they're right, and that the others are doomed. Zealots feel as though their religion (church) is the only right one and that all others are off-track. They've convinced themselves -- or someone else has convinced them of that.

I also agree that being "needy" and under-educated are contributory factors.

These factors, when combined with an addictive personality, seem to be all that's necessary for someone to come along and offer the person a new addition -- religion. I also think most of the time these folks get inundated in evangelical-type denominations. The Pentecostal ones seem to be about the most indoctrinated.
 
You bring an important distinction to the table -- "zealot." I probably should have specified that in the OP. Zealots are the ones who feel compelled to convince others that they're right, and that the others are doomed. Zealots feel as though their religion (church) is the only right one and that all others are off-track. They've convinced themselves -- or someone else has convinced them of that.

I also agree that being "needy" and under-educated are contributory factors.

These factors, when combined with an addictive personality, seem to be all that's necessary for someone to come along and offer the person a new addition -- religion. I also think most of the time these folks get inundated in evangelical-type denominations. The Pentecostal ones seem to be about the most indoctrinated.

Ironically, I am not a strict atheist. Although, I certainly do not believe any of the myths and scoff at the dogma of every religion, I can see an avenue where faith can and does make sense, for some. I don't think I hold any delusions of deities with superpowers, but I can get behind some of the ideas that maybe there is something more than material and random energies binding us together. I just don't take any of it all that serious though, and I totally get that there is no evidence supporting such a belief. So, in the end, it's just a case of leaving an open door.

Myth, dogma, ritual, etc.? Meh. That stuff is just not for me.
 
I have a friend who's in AA (13 years now). When she was in her 2nd year some guy came in and basically started trying to recruit people into a nearby Christian church. They put an end to that, but the Christian overtones were there in the program before and after that.

From their page;

THE TWELVE STEPS OF ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS A.A.’s Twelve Steps are a group of principles, spiritual in their nature, which, if practiced as a way of life, can expel the obsession to drink and enable the sufferer to become happily and usefully whole.

https://www.aa.org/pages/en_US/what-is-aa

Like Christianity, the principles of AA are meant to be a way of life, not a religion.
 
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