reasons women get abortions (1 Viewer)

[FallingPianos]

I found this to be pretty interesting:

REASONS FOR ABORTIONS: COMPILED ESTIMATES

rape 0.3 % (0.2-0.6 %)
incest 0.03 % (<0.1 %)
physical life of mother 0.2 % (0.1-0.3 %)
physical health of mother 1.0 % (0.1-3 %)
fetal health 0.5 % (0.1-1.0 %)
mental health of mother: depends on definition
"personal choice" 98% (78-99 %)
--too young/immature/not ready for responsibility (32 %)
--economic 25% (21-28 %)
--to avoid adjusting life (16 %)
--mother single or in poor relationship (12-13 %)
--enough children already (4-8 %)

I find it odd that so much of the abortion debate is focused on what accounts for about 2% of all abortions.

 

[Jerry]

Also from your link:

*not using contraception 4,957 46.40%
*forced to have relations ~64 0.6%
*using contraception 5,726 53.60%
*contraceptive failed despite proper use ~1,808 16.9%

...so, 2,577 more abortions occur while using contraception correctly then when not using any contraception at all. What does this say for the opinion that mandatory sex-ed in school will reduce teen pregnancy?

 

[Spartacus FPV]

I find it odd that so much of the abortion debate is focused on what accounts for about 2% of all abortions.

Well when its an issue of individual rights, it matters not how small the minority is.

 

[CoffeeSaint]

Also from your link:

*not using contraception 4,957 46.40%
*forced to have relations ~64 0.6%
*using contraception 5,726 53.60%
*contraceptive failed despite proper use ~1,808 16.9%

...so, 2,577 more abortions occur while using contraception correctly then when not using any contraception at all. What does this say for the opinion that mandatory sex-ed in school will reduce teen pregnancy?

What is the percentage of sex acts with contraception that led to pregnancy, versus sex acts without contraception that led to pregnancy? Answer that question, and you'll answer yours, as well.


As for the reasons women get abortions, I personally don't care at all why a woman chooses to have an abortion. It will be a good reason or a bad one; if it is a bad one, she may feel guilty. Why should that affect the laws concerning the right to choose? For me, then, the debate does not center on 2%; 100% of women should be allowed the freedom to choose.

 

[Topsez]

Isn't odd that only men are responding to this post? How should a man know why women choose to end pregancy... My guess is that the pregnancy was unwanted at the time it happened and little more.

I have known three women who decided to have abortions... one in Germany that went for a very late term abortion and each told me later they had very bad feelings afterwards. I'm a man so I can't even come close to using logic or rational to say why.

I don't think abortion should be routine, I know I'm a man, but I say that because of what women that have had one told me they feel.

 

[FallingPianos]

Also from your link:

*not using contraception 4,957 46.40%
*forced to have relations ~64 0.6%
*using contraception 5,726 53.60%
*contraceptive failed despite proper use ~1,808 16.9%

...so, 2,577 more abortions occur while using contraception correctly then when not using any contraception at all. What does this say for the opinion that mandatory sex-ed in school will reduce teen pregnancy?

nothing, because the question still stands how many teenagers are capible of using contraceptives correctly, and how many teenagers would have sex even if contraceptives were unavailable.

but, for the hell of it, I did a bit of statistical analysis. I looked at the failure rates of different contraceptives, and the percentage of women who use a given contraception as their first method. these are for women of all ages, not just teenagers.

amoung sexually active women who do not want to become pregnant, 11% are not practicing contraception. the details of what methods women do use, and how effective they are can be found here

what I found, is that with typical use of contraception at current use rates, one would expect 42% of unintended pregnancies to occur after contraceptive use. so really, those numbers are not surprising.

if all women used their contraceptives perfectly it would be 8% this number would go down further if more women used more highly effective methods.

again, this isnt enough information alone to make any determanations about sex ed, but I was just musing...

 

[teacher]

Read my sig. Put an anti-semite on ignore.

Abortion, hmm, touchy subject, I'll think more about it.

 

[taxedout]

Well when its an issue of individual rights, it matters not how small the minority is.

Especially the tiny life.

 

[Rammstein]

who cares why women abort a child. The important thing to remember is that it is their choice (as long as it is early enough in the pregnancy, I am against late abortions). It is a woman's choice to determine that, she is boss in her own womb and that choice should not be down to politicians or moral/religious pullpit preachers but to the conscience of the woman in question.

It is their body and I think most don't make this choice easily. It is a very tough decision for most women I think.

 

[taxedout]

It is their body

Actually it is the baby's body.

 

[CoffeeSaint]

Actually it is the baby's body.

Not as long as the baby lives off of the mother, it ain't. When you cannot maintain a thing, you do not possess that thing: if I can't feed my dog, then he is not my dog. He will either be a runaway dog, or he will be a dead dog. A fetus cannot support its own life, so how can it be said to possess that life?

 

[FallingPianos]

Actually it is the baby's body.

what is the moral difference between removing it alive knowing that it will die, and killing it before removing it?

 

[Real Korimyr #9]

I find it odd that so much of the abortion debate is focused on what accounts for about 2% of all abortions.

It's because the other 98% raises some very uncomfortable questions about our society-- like why women are sexually mature at fifteen, but not considered adults until eighteen and not expected to have children until they're thirty. (That's thirty-two percent right there.)

Or why the idea of aunts, uncles, and grandparents helping to support and raise their own flesh and blood has become so alien to us. Figure that's a pretty good chunk of "financial" right there-- another twenty-five percent.

Why being a parent and raising good children isn't considered as "noble" an aspiration as career or educational goals. How much of the sixteen percent of "adjustment" do you think that counts for?

Of course... it also side-steps the nasty segment of our population that, for some reason, believes that consensual sex is something that women ought to be punished for-- and that forcing them to bear and raise a child is an appropriate punishment.

 

[taxedout]

Of course... it also side-steps the nasty segment of our population that, for some reason, believes that consensual sex is something that women ought to be punished for-- and that forcing them to bear and raise a child is an appropriate punishment.

Rather, the creation of a baby is something that women should take responsibility for. Casual sex is their business. Bearing the consequenses of this action, of which pregnancy is only one of many, is the issue.

 

[Rammstein]

Actually it is the baby's body.

not in the early parts of the pregnancy it isn't, but that is most likely the issue partly.

 

[Jerry]

Not as long as the baby lives off of the mother, it ain't. When you cannot maintain a thing, you do not possess that thing: if I can't feed my dog, then he is not my dog. He will either be a runaway dog, or he will be a dead dog. A fetus cannot support its own life, so how can it be said to possess that life?

Then since you can not maintain your body, it belongs to Earth. By your reasoning, a woman's body is not her own, it belongs to the planet since she feeds off the planet.

You’re silly.

 

[Real Korimyr #9]

Rather, the creation of a baby is something that women should take responsibility for.

Making the decision not to carry the child to term, and then following through on that decision, is taking responsibility for their actions.

 

[Conservanator]

Abortion is just a way out, its a shame that in modern times we have had to resort to the killing of a child when "mommy" or "daddy" doesn't really feeling like taking responibility over their actions.

Step up and take responibility, seriously.

 

[CoffeeSaint]

Then since you can not maintain your body, it belongs to Earth. By your reasoning, a woman's body is not her own, it belongs to the planet since she feeds off the planet.

You’re silly.

Sure, I can accept that: we all rely on Earth for our continued survival, and so, if Earth decides to remove us, it has the right to do so. Unless we can find a different planet that could sustain our lives, in which case, we would have the right to leave Earth and go live there, instead. Then I would picket the earth for all the hurricanes that it has killed us with. Stupid irresponsible planet, not taking care of the creatures it allowed to evolve.

Do you believe the earth does not control us? I don't think it exerts conscious control, but I can't deny that it has power over our lives. Do you deny that? If you own yourself and the earth does not own you, I suggest you divest yourself from the earth and become emancipated. And bring all the fetuses with you.

 

[CoffeeSaint]

Rather, the creation of a baby is something that women should take responsibility for. Casual sex is their business. Bearing the consequenses of this action, of which pregnancy is only one of many, is the issue.

Pregnancy is not simply a consequence of the choice to have sex, because one can have sex and not become pregnant. There are other factors involved, and so it should not be considered a simple cause and effect relationship -- therefore "If you have sex you should give birth" should not be seen as the simple answer. It isn't.

 

[FallingPianos]

Pregnancy is not simply a consequence of the choice to have sex, because one can have sex and not become pregnant. There are other factors involved, and so it should not be considered a simple cause and effect relationship -- therefore "If you have sex you should give birth" should not be seen as the simple answer. It isn't.

I disagree, pregnancy is a possible consequence of having sex, however getting an abortion is one possible way of taking responsibility for it.

the irresponsible thing to do, would be to try to raise a child when you know that you are not capible financially or emotionally of doing so.

 

[Jerry]

Sure, I can accept that: we all rely on Earth for our continued survival, and so, if Earth decides to remove us, it has the right to do so. Unless we can find a different planet that could sustain our lives, in which case, we would have the right to leave Earth and go live there, instead. Then I would picket the earth for all the hurricanes that it has killed us with. Stupid irresponsible planet, not taking care of the creatures it allowed to evolve.

Do you believe the earth does not control us? I don't think it exerts conscious control, but I can't deny that it has power over our lives. Do you deny that? If you own yourself and the earth does not own you, I suggest you divest yourself from the earth and become emancipated. And bring all the fetuses with you.

I don’t accept your premise that feeding establishes ownership, so I can not answer your question in that context.

Assuming that the planet has consciousness at some level, it does not have any right to eliminate life on it arbitrarily. Even the Earth must comply with God’s Natural Law and first have Just Reason for doing so before even the option exists.

btw, I belong to God, as everything belongs to God.

 

[Jerry]

I disagree, pregnancy is a possible consequence of having sex, however getting an abortion is one possible way of taking responsibility for it.

the irresponsible thing to do, would be to try to raise a child when you know that you are not capible financially or emotionally of doing so.

By definition abortion is the surrendering of responsibility, as death does not fulfill any of the unborn's needs for life.

Abortion is walking away from an obligation, the unfulfilling of a duty as a mother and the alleviation of the burden of providing for a child.

The responsible thing to do would be to not place yourself at risk of pregnancy until you are ready for such duties and obligations. When in a situation where that duty and obligation is present and you are not ready is to pass that child on to people who can bear that burden, as that fulfills the child's needs for life.

 

[FallingPianos]

Abortion is walking away from an obligation, the unfulfilling of a duty as a mother and the alleviation of the burden of providing for a child.

ah ha. but this requires that pregnancy be what establishes that duty in the first place. something which I cannot agree with you on. I believe that the duty to provide for the child (or find someone else via adoption) is established at birth.

*edit*

actually I should change that. I havent decided yet exactly where that duty is established. birth would be the latest, and somewhere mid to late pregnancy would be the earliest. I'm still working that out.

 

[Jerry]

ah ha. but this requires that pregnancy be what establishes that duty in the first place.

That's right.