• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every persons position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!
  • Welcome to our archives. No new posts are allowed here.

Rabbi Lapin.

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
So according to conservative Jewish commentator Rabbi Daniel Lapin, atheists are a "parasite" on American politics and culture.

Nice.

But no one on the right has any interest in establishing an American theocracy...
 

Goshin

Burned Out Ex-Mod
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
Messages
45,511
Reaction score
50,111
Location
Dixie
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
So according to conservative Jewish commentator Rabbi Daniel Lapin, atheists are a "parasite" on American politics and culture.

Nice.

But no one on the right has any interest in establishing an American theocracy...



Just because some Rabbi doesn't think much of atheists, doesn't mean someone wants to establish a theocracy.

Disliking a class of people and wanting to send them to the Gulag are not the same.
 

RightinNYC

Girthless
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Messages
25,893
Reaction score
12,484
Location
New York, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
So according to conservative Jewish commentator Rabbi Daniel Lapin, atheists are a "parasite" on American politics and culture.

Nice.

But no one on the right has any interest in establishing an American theocracy...

Strawman much?

I don't think anyone has argued that no one on the right has any interest in "establishing an American theocracy." The fact that one guy (who I doubt most have ever heard of) says something controversial means as much about the right as one asshole on the left means about the left as a whole.
 

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Strawman much?

I don't think anyone has argued that no one on the right has any interest in "establishing an American theocracy." The fact that one guy (who I doubt most have ever heard of) says something controversial means as much about the right as one asshole on the left means about the left as a whole.

Well, he was on Fox News when making the quote, so it's not exactly some far-right crank blogging to an audience of 8 from his mother's basement. He's also closely connected to Tom DeLay, Karl Rove, and GWB, as in, has/had regular meetings with them, was often invited to the White House, etc. Again, not exactly on the fringe.

Think Jeremiah Wright.
 

RightinNYC

Girthless
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Messages
25,893
Reaction score
12,484
Location
New York, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
Well, he was on Fox News when making the quote, so it's not exactly some far-right crank blogging to an audience of 8 from his mother's basement. He's also closely connected to Tom DeLay, Karl Rove, and GWB, as in, has/had regular meetings with them, was often invited to the White House, etc. Again, not exactly on the fringe.

Do you have a link for this?

Either way, the broader point still stands.


Think Jeremiah Wright.

So you're saying that it's reasonable for conservatives to make a big deal about Wright and tar all liberals by association?
 

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Do you have a link for this?

Either way, the broader point still stands.

No, it was just on like half an hour ago. And Fox never posts their video online anyway. But I assure you, I'm not making this up. You just have to take my word on it. If you're really interested, watch the re-airing of Beck tonight (dammit, I really wanted to keep his name out of this. The fact that it was his show is irrelevant).


So you're saying that it's reasonable for conservatives to make a big deal about Wright and tar all liberals by association?

No, but I'll make conservatives a deal. Stop bringing Rev. Wright/Van Jones/Bill Ayers/etc. up, and we won't go looking for crazy **** conservatives have said.
 

RightinNYC

Girthless
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Messages
25,893
Reaction score
12,484
Location
New York, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
No, it was just on like half an hour ago. And Fox never posts their video online anyway. But I assure you, I'm not making this up. You just have to take my word on it. If you're really interested, watch the re-airing of Beck tonight (dammit, I really wanted to keep his name out of this. The fact that it was his show is irrelevant).

I'm just saying that I have a hard time taking this at face value, and I'm betting there was some additional context that has been ignored.

No, but I'll make conservatives a deal. Stop bringing Rev. Wright/Van Jones/Bill Ayers/etc. up, and we won't go looking for crazy **** conservatives have said.

So because some conservatives make stupid generalizations, you thought that the best way to deal with that was to do the same thing?
 

rathi

Count Smackula
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 10, 2006
Messages
7,890
Reaction score
4,730
Location
California
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
The chances of a Jewish theocracy in a country that is 2% Jewish is non-existent. One rabbi making some noise is entirely irrelevant.
 

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
The chances of a Jewish theocracy in a country that is 2% Jewish is non-existent. One rabbi making some noise is entirely irrelevant.

Oh, he'd be happy with a Christian theocracy. As long as gays, women, and apparently atheists, don't have any rights.
 

Goshin

Burned Out Ex-Mod
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
Messages
45,511
Reaction score
50,111
Location
Dixie
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
No, but they tend to start out the same way...



Hm. I had previously mistook you for a serious poster... shall we make it illegal to say bad things about X class of people?

"Theocracy!" is rapidly becoming the next Chicken Little "sky is falling!" phrase.
 

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Hm. I had previously mistook you for a serious poster... shall we make it illegal to say bad things about X class of people?

"Theocracy!" is rapidly becoming the next Chicken Little "sky is falling!" phrase.

Who said anything about making anything illegal? Obviously I think the good Rabbi should be able to say whatever stupid thing he wants. But I have an equivalent right to call him out for it.
 

Josie

No Day But Today
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
38,942
Reaction score
20,792
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Oh, he'd be happy with a Christian theocracy. As long as gays, women, and apparently atheists, don't have any rights.

What is your source showing that he wants a theocracy and no rights for any of those groups?
 

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
What is your source showing that he wants a theocracy and no rights for any of those groups?

"Every culture that adopts abortion and homosexuality as normal is a culture that begins to decline and eventually vanish off the stage of world history - that is God acting."

"America's Rabbi" Warns: "Enormous, Humanic and Historic Upheaval" Rapidly Approaching

A particularly good quote as it addresses his homophobia, opposition to women's reproductive rights, and threatens us with a wrathful god.
 

Josie

No Day But Today
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
38,942
Reaction score
20,792
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
"Every culture that adopts abortion and homosexuality as normal is a culture that begins to decline and eventually vanish off the stage of world history - that is God acting."

"America's Rabbi" Warns: "Enormous, Humanic and Historic Upheaval" Rapidly Approaching


A particularly good quote as it addresses his homophobia, opposition to women's reproductive rights, and threatens us with a wrathful god.

I agree with him. Now how does that equate that he doesn't think women, gays and atheists should have any rights?
 
Last edited:

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
I agree with him. Now how does that equate that he doesn't think women, gays and atheists should have any rights?

My purpose with this post wasn't to debate same-sex marriage and abortion, but...

As with most on the religious right, Lapin doesn't think you should have the freedom to marry the person you love if they happen to be of the same sex, and he would like a return to the days of unsafe, back-alley abortions, which killed hundreds of women pre-1973.

You obviously don't agree, but marriage and the ability to make one's own reproductive decisions are rights. Rights that Lapin would deny.

And just for the record, he's wrong. The decline of the Greek and Roman civilizations of antiquity actually occured after stringent restrictions on sexual freedom were instituted. The more "liberal" periods tended to coincide with the periods when these civilizations were at their strongest and most dynamic.
 

Josie

No Day But Today
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
38,942
Reaction score
20,792
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
My purpose with this post wasn't to debate same-sex marriage and abortion, but...

As with most on the religious right, Lapin doesn't think you should have the freedom to marry the person you love if they happen to be of the same sex, and he would like a return to the days of unsafe, back-alley abortions, which killed hundreds of women pre-1973.

You obviously don't agree, but marriage and the ability to make one's own reproductive decisions are rights. Rights that Lapin would deny.

Where does he say anything about government or politics?

I do not think mothers should be able to kill their children because I call that murder. I'm okay with gay marriage, but I still think homosexuality is a sin.
 

WilliamJB

Active member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
314
Reaction score
59
Location
Albany, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Where does he say anything about government or politics?

"the principles of the Republican Party and the convictions of our president more closely parallel the moral vision of the God of Abraham than those of anyone else."

- The Republicans' Rabbi-in-Arms - washingtonpost.com

Political enough for you?

I do not think mothers should be able to kill their children because I call that murder. I'm okay with gay marriage, but I still think homosexuality is a sin.

And if Lapin kept his theological positions separate from his political positions, as you seem capable of doing, at least as they relate to same-sex marriage, I'd have no problem with him.
 

MKULTRABOY

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
10,621
Reaction score
2,104
Location
In your dreams...
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Independent
Hm. I had previously mistook you for a serious poster... shall we make it illegal to say bad things about X class of people?

"Theocracy!" is rapidly becoming the next Chicken Little "sky is falling!" phrase.

Didnt George W Bush meet with evangelical leaders on a weekly basis to put their faith into action in american government?
 

Josie

No Day But Today
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
38,942
Reaction score
20,792
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
"the principles of the Republican Party and the convictions of our president more closely parallel the moral vision of the God of Abraham than those of anyone else."

- The Republicans' Rabbi-in-Arms - washingtonpost.com

I agree.


"And if Lapin kept his theological positions separate from his political positions, as you seem capable of doing, at least as they relate to same-sex marriage, I'd have no problem with him.

Obama is also against same-sex marriage. I think it's fine if you want to vote against it, but don't think it's actually going to change anything spiritually.
 

Josie

No Day But Today
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
38,942
Reaction score
20,792
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Didnt George W Bush meet with evangelical leaders on a weekly basis to put their faith into action in american government?

Obama does too.

How is that creating a theocracy?
 

Barbbtx

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 7, 2010
Messages
8,467
Reaction score
1,993
Location
W'Ford TX
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Conservative
I think I saw him on Fox. He did say that. He also said he has athiest friends. They stay friends with him for some reason I guess.
 

Josie

No Day But Today
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
38,942
Reaction score
20,792
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Source please.

Is your tune going to change now?

Barack Obama on Gay and Lesbian Rights - Where does Barack Obama Stand for Gays and Lesbians

Although Barack Obama has said that he supports civil unions, he is against gay marriage. In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, "I'm a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman."
 
Top Bottom