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Question for people who believe being gay to be wrong

Hoplite

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This is something I've been confused about for a while and I haven't really received an answer to it.

I dont understand WHY being gay is wrong, I dont understand why the bible prohibits it. There are no medical or psychological reason for it being wrong, we are obviously socially flexible enough to incorporate the gay community into our society, our society hasnt collapsed, we dont really need to "go forth and multiply" anymore.

So, why is being gay a sin?
 

CriticalThought

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In the Biblical sense, the Old Testament was against it because it was seen as a pagan practice and it was contrary to replenishing the population, which was a necessity when you were a militaristic society. Paul revised it in the New Testament by borrowing teleological philosophy from Aristotle and Plato to argue that homosexual behavior goes against God's design and that any sexual act outside of marriage is sinful. Laymen utilize variations of this to argue against certain sexual practices by asserting things like, "the anus is not a reproductive organ". Existential theists argue that homosexuality serves no purpose to society and is only a deficit due to health costs.
 
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It's not. I'm a Christian, and I don't believe that it is.
 

Josie

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This is something I've been confused about for a while and I haven't really received an answer to it.

I dont understand WHY being gay is wrong, I dont understand why the bible prohibits it. There are no medical or psychological reason for it being wrong, we are obviously socially flexible enough to incorporate the gay community into our society, our society hasnt collapsed, we dont really need to "go forth and multiply" anymore.

So, why is being gay a sin?

Because He said so. :shrug:
 

Josie

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It's not. I'm a Christian, and I don't believe that it is.

How do you reconcile that belief with scriptures against homosexuality? Do you just dismiss them?
 

niftydrifty

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This is something I've been confused about for a while and I haven't really received an answer to it.

I dont understand WHY being gay is wrong, I dont understand why the bible prohibits it. There are no medical or psychological reason for it being wrong, we are obviously socially flexible enough to incorporate the gay community into our society, our society hasnt collapsed, we dont really need to "go forth and multiply" anymore.

So, why is being gay a sin?

Hoplite, I don't think we've discussed anything before, and I hope you won't mind me being frank with you. Your question is all over the place. To find out why many believe homosexuality is a sin, according to the bible, you need to look at what the bible says, not medicine, psychology or modern day culture. And whether or not we need to procreate anymore is irrelevant.

Basically, the bible is clear as mud about it: if you read the Bible in English, it states that being gay is really bad. But if you look at the Greek or Hebrew that the bible came from, you might see that what is bad was a non-consensual temple practice, or a made-up word in the letters of Paul, that we only guess the meaning of, and that may or may not refer to what people did to slave boys or what-have-you. So like most things, people believe whatever they want to.
 
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How do you reconcile that belief with scriptures against homosexuality? Do you just dismiss them?

No, I researched them, and looked what the word "homosexual" actually means in the Bible, and into the original text, and how the original text translates into english, and I have come to the conclusion that homosexuality is not a sin. For example when you see the term homosexual in the Bible it is talking about temple prostitution, or homosexual acts(mainly anal sex), preformed in the worship of an idol. Also the infamous Leviticus passage, doesn't say it is a sin. It say's it is an abomination, which just means that it is against the norms of society, and doesn't mean that it is bad.
 

Josie

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No, I researched them, and looked what the word "homosexual" actually means in the Bible, and into the original text, and how the original text translates into english, and I have come to the conclusion that homosexuality is not a sin. For example when you see the term homosexual in the Bible it is talking about temple prostitution, or homosexual acts(mainly anal sex), preformed in the worship of an idol. Also the infamous Leviticus passage, doesn't say it is a sin. It say's it is an abomination, which just means that it is against the norms of society, and doesn't mean that it is bad.

Could you post your research here please? I'd like to see it.
 

ptif219

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But WHY did he say so?

There seems to be no logical reason anymore for being gay to be considered wrong

God created man a help mate. God meant man to be with woman

Matthew 19:4-6 (New King James Version)

4 And He answered and said to them, “Have you not read that He who made[a]them at the beginning ‘made them male and female,’ 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’?[c] 6 So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”
 

ptif219

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But WHY did he say so?

There seems to be no logical reason anymore for being gay to be considered wrong

God created man a help mate. God meant man to be with woman

Matthew 19:4-6 (New King James Version)

4 And He answered and said to them, “Have you not read that He who made[a]them at the beginning ‘made them male and female,’ 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’?[c] 6 So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”
 

Hoplite

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God created man a help mate. God meant man to be with woman

Matthew 19:4-6 (New King James Version)

4 And He answered and said to them, “Have you not read that He who made[a]them at the beginning ‘made them male and female,’ 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’?[c] 6 So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”

Ok, so why is this intended to be the norm? I can see why it might be a problem with a small population that doesnt live very long and needs all the children it can get, but I think we've gone beyond that and we dont need to worry about reproduction anymore.

So why does man NEED to be with woman anymore?
 

OscarB63

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the only thing I can see is that the anus did not evolve (or was not created) as a reproductive organ. unprotected anal sex is much more likely to pass along STDs. but that, in and of itself, is not an indictment of homosexuality in general
 

MKULTRABOY

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the only thing I can see is that the anus did not evolve (or was not created) as a reproductive organ. unprotected anal sex is much more likely to pass along STDs. but that, in and of itself, is not an indictment of homosexuality in general

It is not a reproductive but is arguably a sexual organ, note, the interesting and fantastic placement of the prostate, the potential for anal orgasms and so on.

I hope the conversation ends there. :D
 

Hoplite

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the only thing I can see is that the anus did not evolve (or was not created) as a reproductive organ. unprotected anal sex is much more likely to pass along STDs. but that, in and of itself, is not an indictment of homosexuality in general
You also need to consider that sex serves a much greater role than just reproduction to human society
 

OscarB63

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You also need to consider that sex serves a much greater role than just reproduction to human society

it's not about reproduction, it's about the design of the anus making it more prone to transmitting disease when used sexually.
 

friday

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This is something I've been confused about for a while and I haven't really received an answer to it.

I dont understand WHY being gay is wrong, I dont understand why the bible prohibits it. There are no medical or psychological reason for it being wrong, we are obviously socially flexible enough to incorporate the gay community into our society, our society hasnt collapsed, we dont really need to "go forth and multiply" anymore.

So, why is being gay a sin?

Biblically speaking, for the same reason that lust, fornication, and any other form of impurity is sin. As far as homosexuality not causing any medical or psychological harm whatsoever, unfortunately we will never have an unbiased study done by either side of the issue confirming or denying that assumption. But that is irrelevent. Sins in the Bible are anything that misses God's holiness. Homosexuality isn't more sinful than lying, hating someone, being jealous of your neighbor, losing your temper, getting drunk, etc. But anyone who says homosexuality isn't a sin is either trying to sell you something or get you to vote for him/her.

Although, even most Democrats (including John Edwards, Barack Obama, and many others) have indicated that they believe homosexuality is a sin and that marriage should be between one man and one woman, and sofar their policies have beared this opinion out as well.
 

Hoplite

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it's not about reproduction, it's about the design of the anus making it more prone to transmitting disease when used sexually.
Easily circumventable when one practices sex responsibly by using condoms, being aware of your own and your partner's sexual health, and being cautious about the selection of sexual partners.
 

Goshin

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No, I researched them, and looked what the word "homosexual" actually means in the Bible, and into the original text, and how the original text translates into english, and I have come to the conclusion that homosexuality is not a sin. For example when you see the term homosexual in the Bible it is talking about temple prostitution, or homosexual acts(mainly anal sex), preformed in the worship of an idol. Also the infamous Leviticus passage, doesn't say it is a sin. It say's it is an abomination, which just means that it is against the norms of society, and doesn't mean that it is bad.



Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.


Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

Rom 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

Rom 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

Rom 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

*********

Seems pretty clear to me. I research Hebrew and Greek also, and it still seems crystal clear that homosexuality is, Biblically, a sin.

***********




1Cr 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Cr 6:10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.


1Cr 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

***************************


Again, seems quite clear in both English and Greek.

The word some dispute is arsenokoites. It is a term generally considered to be coined by Paul to refer to homosexual practices, by referring to the common homosexual practice of the time.

Strong's Concordence defines arsenokoites as: one who lies with a male as with a female, sodomite, homosexual
Thayers Lexicon says the same.

The word is also used in context in 1st Timothy 1:10

The first rule of Hermaneutics is to interpret scripture with more scripture.

While Christians under grace are no longer subject to OT law, nonetheless OT scripture may be used for clarification of the meaning of NT passages that are in dispute.

OT:
Lev 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it [is] abomination.

This seems to reinforce that arsenokoites refers to homosexuality.

I've heard all the counterarguments, and frankly they all seem very specious to me... like deliberately going ten miles out of your way to avoid seeing something plain.

My 0.02 and I'm done...
 

Alex

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The Bible is full of silly things. I find it hypocritical that people pay so much attention to the homosexual aspects of it, yet they ignore everything else.

"Dear Dr. Laura,

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind him that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the specific laws and how to best follow them.

a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord (Lev. 1:9). The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanness (Lev. 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence.

d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

e) I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an Abomination (Lev. 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

g) Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27. How should they die?

i) I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them (Lev.24:10-16)? Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws (Lev. 20:14)?

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging. Your devoted disciple and adoring fan."

That is just a very small sample of the silliness in the Bible. There is also this: “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body be thrown into hell. 30And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body go into hell."

I think there are a lot of heterosexuals who should be walking around with one eye.

I have to go now, Santa Clause and the Tooth Fairy are here for tea.

Matthew 5 ESV
Open Letter to Dr. Laura Schlessinger
 

cpwill

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This is something I've been confused about for a while and I haven't really received an answer to it.

I dont understand WHY being gay is wrong,

being gay in the sense that one wishes to have sexual relations with someone of the same gender isn't wrong, just as me being attracted to other women isn't wrong.

acting out those temptations is what is wrong.
 

Hoplite

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Seems pretty clear to me. I research Hebrew and Greek also, and it still seems crystal clear that homosexuality is, Biblically, a sin.
WHY is it a sin though, that's my question. There's no logical reason for it.
 
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