Prosecutors Say Trump Directed Illegal Payments During Campaign

[Cattle Company]

Supported a Republican president at near 40% approval without wavering, is what they did, and it factually matters.

The Senate who lives and breathes on public party support, to do the will of the people who elected them, may choose to accept that support. It's a loophole. They can vote away criminal behavior with public support, it's as simple as that. They know it, you know it, and they feel no shame or ethical compunction to do to do otherwise. Just the opposite, they feel it's righteous and warranted and good for the nation. Senate didn't want to hear Garland, so they didn't, and they were rewarded, and their voters were rewarded. House didn't want to uncover what happened in the Russian interference in our election, so they didn't. And they won support for doing the will of the people.

Epstein and all his co-conspirators got immunity for child sex trafficking, likely hundreds of young girls...and he doesn't have the power of the presidency, nor does he have 40% public support. What do you think is really gonna happen?

They need to get hard evidence of multiple felonies, including obstruction, and likely conspiracy against the Untied States, to have a chance of getting him out of office, and that's entirely up to what actually happened, and what Mueller finds. Anything lesser may result in impeachment, with no removal. Which may be the right play to send a message, but think about where that leaves us.

Then we enter the next 2 years leading up to the 2020 election with a self-proclaimed, vindicated Trump, immune from prosecution, "cleared" by the Senate, and no Mueller investigation to slow him down, and this sort of behavior will have been rewarded in the biggest way. Rig elections, collude with Russia, break the law, gain support.

People thought he could shoot someone in the middle of the street and get away with it. That's not accurate, people were being too modest.
He can shoot someone in the middle of the street, and his support will *intensify*.

Don't forget that now any future democrat POTUS will also be subject to unlimited investigations. Even if they're as phony and bogus as the current Mueller probe is. PAYBACK!

 

[JasperL]

GOP voters are putting Chris Collins and Duncan Hunter back in office, and voted for a dead pimp in another state. I think they won't have a problem with Trump.

Don't forget Rep. DesJarlais, from down the road from me. He's a doctor, admitted to multiple affairs, including with his patients, his wife getting two abortions, him urging a mistress to get an abortion in Atlanta (this is in court records or on audio tapes) and he still got elected as a family values Republican, then reelected. The GOP is like the honey badger these days - they don't care, whatever it takes to own the libs.

 

[Cardinal]

Supported a Republican president at near 40% approval without wavering, is what they did, and it factually matters.

The Senate who lives and breathes on public party support, to do the will of the people who elected them, may choose to accept that support. It's a loophole. They can vote away criminal behavior with public support, it's as simple as that. They know it, you know it, and they feel no shame or ethical compunction to do to do otherwise. Just the opposite, they feel it's righteous and warranted and good for the nation. Senate didn't want to hear Garland, so they didn't, and they were rewarded, and their voters were rewarded. House didn't want to uncover what happened in the Russian interference in our election, so they didn't. And they won support for doing the will of the people.

Epstein and all his co-conspirators got immunity for child sex trafficking, likely hundreds of young girls...and he doesn't have the power of the presidency, nor does he have 40% public support. What do you think is really gonna happen?

They need to get hard evidence of multiple felonies, including obstruction, and likely conspiracy against the Untied States, to have a chance of getting him out of office, and that's entirely up to what actually happened, and what Mueller finds. Anything lesser may result in impeachment, with no removal. Which may be the right play to send a message, but think about where that leaves us.

Then we enter the next 2 years leading up to the 2020 election with a self-proclaimed, vindicated Trump, immune from prosecution, "cleared" by the Senate, and no Mueller investigation to slow him down, and this sort of behavior will have been rewarded in the biggest way. Rig elections, collude with Russia, break the law, gain support.

People thought he could shoot someone in the middle of the street and get away with it. That's not accurate, people were being too modest.
He can shoot someone in the middle of the street, and his support will *intensify*.

What I mean by the statement that their opinions don't matter is that if they are unwavering regardless of the facts at hand then the rest of us can move forward with the knowledge that there is no point in seriously engaging them. Their position is a given, for better or worse (it's the latter).

Also, if there was a standard of evidence that would persuade them they would have told it to you be now. Instead, after the DOJ has concluded trump broke laws their go-to response has been that the investigators are untrustworthy democrats and the laws broken weren't real laws anyway. That should tell you something about the futility of engaging them.

It's like the Dead Boy Scout theory: there is a home owner and police find a dead boy scout in his basement. You try to convince someone that the home owner is a murderer, so police keep finding more and more bodies of dead boy scouts, and the person you're trying to convince remains unpersuaded. The problem is twofold:

1)The person you're trying to convince refuses to tell you how many dead boy scouts is enough to persuade them, and
2)The person you're trying to convince refuses to tell you if dead boy scouts are even a problem to begin with.

Reverse the question. What have you done?

That is the point ; you don't get to screw people out of their opinion because of arrogant self righteousness.

To hell with your judgmental attitude. It's the antithesis of what you should be about.

To make sure you get it, it makes you sound like Trump at his worst.

Sent from my SM-S727VL using Tapatalk

I never said you weren't entitled to your opinion, only that your opinion has no value.

 

[Cardinal]

Don't forget that now any future democrat POTUS will also be subject to unlimited investigations. Even if they're as phony and bogus as the current Mueller probe is. PAYBACK!

Proof that Republicans are certain that the investigations into Trump are fake because they know that's what they would do to their political opponents.

 

[Kobie]

Gotta remember it was hateful envious leftie investigators doing the investigating. And they were desperate to come up with a crime so they may well have invented crimes that really are not crimes. I certainly don't trust those clowns. I believe its all just a scam. The bottom line here is the fact that leftwing credibility is always suspect at best. I don't believe anything that they say. Period!

And there it is. Nothing they have on Trump is valid, because “leftie.”

 

[Cattle Company]

Proof that Republicans are certain that the investigations into Trump are fake because they know that's what they would do to their political opponents.

The democrat crooks have opened a can of worms. These worms will come back to eat them.

 

[Cattle Company]

And there it is. Nothing they have on Trump is valid, because “leftie.”

True. The left has zero credibility.

 

[Kobie]

True. The left has zero credibility.

You have zero credibility.

It must be incredibly relaxing to live in such an intellectual bubble.

 

[Cardinal]

The democrat crooks have opened a can of worms. These worms will come back to eat them.

Republicans want to throw Hillary Clinton in prison without even giving her a trial. We're well aware of their tactics.

 

[Cattle Company]

What I mean by the statement that their opinions don't matter is that if they are unwavering regardless of the facts at hand then the rest of us can move forward with the knowledge that there is no point in seriously engaging them. Their position is a given, for better or worse (it's the latter).

Also, if there was a standard of evidence that would persuade them they would have told it to you be now. Instead, after the DOJ has concluded trump broke laws their go-to response has been that the investigators are untrustworthy democrats and the laws broken weren't real laws anyway. That should tell you something about the futility of engaging them.

It's like the Dead Boy Scout theory: there is a home owner and police find a dead boy scout in his basement. You try to convince someone that the home owner is a murderer, so police keep finding more and more bodies of dead boy scouts, and the person you're trying to convince remains unpersuaded. The problem is twofold:

1)The person you're trying to convince refuses to tell you how many dead boy scouts is enough to persuade them, and
2)The person you're trying to convince refuses to tell you if dead boy scouts are even a problem to begin with.



I never said you weren't entitled to your opinion, only that your opinion has no value.

PROBLEM: When the one desperately trying to convince people is on the criminal minded leftist side and the leftist side is well known for their honesty evasion, then NOBODY LISTENS!!!

 

[Cattle Company]

Republicans want to throw Hillary Clinton in prison without even giving her a trial. We're well aware of their tactics.

Nice honesty evasion.

 

[Mach]

Don't forget that now any future democrat POTUS will also be subject to unlimited investigations. Even if they're as phony and bogus as the current Mueller probe is. PAYBACK!

No one cares, Republicans have been doing this for years to poor effect. Republicans failed to evidence crimes to team Obama, and with Hillary, but boy did they try.

So Republicans will keep up with emails and lock her up? Oh wow, that's news! Thanks for admitting what we already know, that Republicans can't govern for ****, and hate America.

 

[Cattle Company]

You have zero credibility.

It must be incredibly relaxing to live in such an intellectual bubble.

Lame response. You desperate?

 

[bubbabgone]

According to the former chairman of the FED, it's not a campaign contribution.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/29365/former-fec-chairman-mark-levin-stormy-daniels-jacob-airey

He said, “And the FEC standard for that is you can’t use your campaign money for personal use. What they mean by that is you can’t use that for something you’d have to pay anyway that’s not directly for your campaign. The question is, ‘is this really a campaign obligation?’”

Right.
See #25.
There appears to be some people who simply will not accept that as a possibility.

 

[Cattle Company]

No one cares, Republicans have been doing this for years to poor effect. Republicans failed to evidence crimes to team Obama, and with Hillary, but boy did they try.

So Republicans will keep up with emails and lock her up? Oh wow, that's news! Thanks for admitting what we already know, that Republicans can't govern for ****, and hate America.

I'm not impressed with how the liar leftie democrat crooks run things either.

 

[Mach]

What I mean by the statement that their opinions don't matter is that if they are unwavering regardless of the facts at hand then the rest of us can move forward with the knowledge that there is no point in seriously engaging them. Their position is a given, for better or worse (it's the latter).
I never said you weren't entitled to your opinion, only that your opinion has no value.

Are you saying there is good evidence that not challenging lies, unreasonable arguments, absurd arguments, unethical claims, etc., results in the national discourse, more people opposing those things?
Or are you really saying this faith-like support Trump has, has no value...because clearly it does in a very real (and harmful) sense.

I've seen some people take the first approach, a few forum posters names come to mind. But I think that's a fatalist/lazy rationalization. But I'd be interested to hear if there is evidence to support it not being the case. It's certainly a helluva lot less work.

 

[Mach]

I'm not impressed with how the liar leftie democrat crooks run things either.

Crime-free?

 

[Roadvirus]

There's a very good reason why Conservatives haven't answered one fundamental question for the past two years: "What would have to happen for you to withdraw support for Trump?" Their silence has itself always been the answer: there isn't anything Trump could do to lose their support.

I'll tell you what...this Conservative will give you his answer:

If he did anything illegal with regards to the Russia thing, then i'll support legal action. Mucking with our elections is unacceptable

 

[Roadvirus]

Sigh.

Cohen borrowed $130,000 from his HELOC, washed it through a bogus corporation, paid Stormy Daniels. Then he went back to the Trump Organization, submits a bill for campaign expenses. He also submitted a $50,000 bill for campaign related IT expenses. The company then pays him $180,000, rounds it up so he breaks even on taxes (to $360,000), THEN kicks in a $60,000 bonus for $420,000. To disguise the nature of the payment - one massive payout in an illegal campaign contribution from Trump Organization - they break it up into multiple payments distributed over the year of $35,000 each. This is conspiracy, money laundering, campaign finance violations, fraud and, depending on the accounting, tax fraud.

You simply have no idea what you're talking about.

That's all Cohen's bag. Trump didn't do any of that. He told him to give Stormy some shut-up money and that was it.

 

[Fishking]

Ordering somebody to commit a federal crime is itself a federal crime. If you feel the laws are unfair then I suggest writing your congressman asking him to change the laws.

Unfortunately for you, and the partisan federal prosecutors, there are no laws against paying people hush money. It actually happens all the time. They'll push forward with this and lose.

 

[Deuce]

Don't forget that now any future democrat POTUS will also be subject to unlimited investigations. Even if they're as phony and bogus as the current Mueller probe is. PAYBACK!

So you're motivated by "get the other guy" instead of justice? Interesting admission.

Mueller is a career law enforcement agent. He got John Gotti. He's a Republican. When he was appointed, Republicans were falling over themselves to praise the man. I trust him to do a thorough investigation and await the evidence he gathers before deciding guilt. Isn't that what you want?

 

[Helix]

It is the justice departments policy not to indict a siting president.. that goes back to when Nixon was president. Mueller is a very 'by the book' person, and won't go against the DOJ's policies.

i'm aware that he won't. however, if a sitting president committed a crime, he or she should not be above the law.

 

[Cardinal]

Are you saying there is good evidence that not challenging lies, unreasonable arguments, absurd arguments, unethical claims, etc., results in the national discourse, more people opposing those things?
Or are you really saying this faith-like support Trump has, has no value...because clearly it does in a very real (and harmful) sense.

I've seen some people take the first approach, a few forum posters names come to mind. But I think that's a fatalist/lazy rationalization. But I'd be interested to hear if there is evidence to support it not being the case. It's certainly a helluva lot less work.

The bolded is closer to what I mean, but not quite it. Challenging lies and being sure to create a narrative that counters their nihilistic world view is of course very important. If you don't form a counter narrative then the false narrative is the one that takes hold. And that false narrative has in a way taken hold anyway because we've allowed ourselves to be strung along like fools for the last two years believing that there was a legal or moral standard we could achieve that would convince them of the error of their choice. But when you re-examine the facts it's easy to see that that was never possible because their choice was based on was a protest and hatred of liberals.

Also, we've allowed ourselves to be strung along like fools because we've chased after their ever-changing standards for what constitutes, say, an impeachable offense. This was most clearly demonstrated when after demanding evidence of crimes, the crimes were belittled as "process crimes." And like fools we chased after bigger crimes, and when we found those they were called fake crimes or the result of a Democrat conspiracy. This will keep happening, and the end result is that morality and the rule of law will atrophy until they are nothing. What we have to do is reverse time and take back the moral and legal standards that existed before Trump was sworn into office.

So when I say that their opinions don't matter, I mean that in the sense that persuading them is a fool's errand because their views are fixed and based in a kind of rage that can't be broken through. By all means, counter their narrative and don't let their lies take hold. But stop pretending that their standards have ever had standards that are higher than what they really are, and stop chasing ever moving goal posts.

Remember: they've never told us how many dead boy scouts are enough or that dead boys scouts are even a problem. That in itself is a brutally clear communication.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

That's all Cohen's bag. Trump didn't do any of that. He told him to give Stormy some shut-up money and that was it.

It's boring to watch you deny reality. Sad that you couldn't be bothered to read what the DOJ put out about this.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

So you're motivated by "get the other guy" instead of justice? Interesting admission.

Mueller is a career law enforcement agent. He got John Gotti. He's a Republican. When he was appointed, Republicans were falling over themselves to praise the man. I trust him to do a thorough investigation and await the evidence he gathers before deciding guilt. Isn't that what you want?

There are no phony and bogus investigations going on concerning Trump.

Do you know what those words mean?