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Privatized Social Security

JoeTheEconomist said:
Millennials are turning 40, and they have done nothing for 20 years. They have blame. You have blame. There is a lot of blame to go around when the shortfall is closing in on a year's GDP. We have done nothing for 80 years. What are you doing this year?
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You blame us for what previous generations screwed up and kept screwing up for decades? And you think we’re actually dumb enough to believe and accept that? They literally never paid enough in and expect us to pay it. [emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787]

That tactic should work real well at the ballot box.
 
vegas giants said:
Dude current benefits are paid by current contributors.

I can link 5 more cites. Everyone knows this. You have to be kidding
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Yes current retirees are paid by the current workers. On the other hand, the page is wrong about the cause of Social Security's problems. It is wrong about the normal retirement age. It is wrong about the exaustion point of the Trust Fund. It is wrong about the program being "bankrupt", a word that tells you that the page is more ideology than fact. The working population is rising. It is rising more slowly than the population of beneficiaries.

It isn't a page that I would cite - go with the other 5 next time.
 
JoeTheEconomist said:
Yes current retirees are paid by the current workers. On the other hand, the page is wrong about the cause of Social Security's problems. It is wrong about the normal retirement age. It is wrong about the exaustion point of the Trust Fund. It is wrong about the program being "bankrupt", a word that tells you that the page is more ideology than fact. The working population is rising. It is rising more slowly than the population of beneficiaries.

It isn't a page that I would cite - go with the other 5 next time.
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Dude that is the opposite of what you said earlier. You are all.over the map
 
vegas giants said:
Dude current payments are made by current contributors. You have to be kidding
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You might be socked at how few people understand how Social Security works.

Guys like me who understand how deeply moderns suck at even the basics are not shocked.
 
Aberration said:
You blame us for what previous generations screwed up and kept screwing up for decades? And you think we’re actually dumb enough to believe and accept that? They literally never paid enough in and expect us to pay it. [emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787]

That tactic should work real well at the ballot box.
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I think the Boomers are going to get killed whether they deserve it or not. They are a great scapegoat. All I am telling you that you have done the same thing that Boomers did. That means yes you have some blame. The Boomers have some blame. Maybe I am wrong. What have you done personally to help promote some end result.

Just for a fact check. The Boomers are the first generation that actually did contribute enough to pay for its benefits; thanks to rising payroll tax rates and rising retirement age. I would suggest that you look at the data from the Urban Institute or the Money's Worth Studies from the SSA. When you look at the UI data, you have to understand that the data assumes that you get to retirement age. It assumes that you do not pay taxes. And it assumes that the program will fix itself. The problem is the 7 decades of retirees before them.
 
vegas giants said:
Dude that is the opposite of what you said earlier. You are all.over the map
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Maybe it was a typo. Let me rephase : Your link is cliched, out-dated, and nearly worthless. It does say correctly that current workers pay for current retirees. The rest of the link is worthless. I meant to say I wouldn't use that link again. The probability of it being right seems to be close to random chance.
 
vegas giants said:
Dude current payments are made by current contributors. You have to be kidding
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Not according to the SSA. Dude.

“Money to cover expenditures (mainly benefit payments) from the trust funds comes from the redemption or sale of securities held by the trust funds. When "special-issue" securities are redeemed, interest is paid. In fact, the principal amount of special issues redeemed, plus the corresponding interest, is just enough to cover an expenditure.”
 
JoeTheEconomist said:
The problem is the 7 decades of retirees before them.
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That’s it. That’s all that needed to be said. As for trying to claim I got blame? You won’t ever find me having supported the program. So no, just like slavery, I had no part.
 
Aberration said:
Not according to the SSA. Dude.

“Money to cover expenditures (mainly benefit payments) from the trust funds comes from the redemption or sale of securities held by the trust funds. When "special-issue" securities are redeemed, interest is paid. In fact, the principal amount of special issues redeemed, plus the corresponding interest, is just enough to cover an expenditure.”
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He is right.

The meaning of this sentence is : When payroll taxes collected by Social Security are insufficient...

You will be interested to know that the bond redemption policy - ie the process that selects bonds for redemption - does not pick the bond with the lowest interest rate. It is picked by maturity date by interest rate. In a world of falling interest rates we are redeeming at par bonds at that would sell at a premium. It is going to cost the program about $1B this year in lost interest.
 
Aberration said:
Not according to the SSA. Dude.

“Money to cover expenditures (mainly benefit payments) from the trust funds comes from the redemption or sale of securities held by the trust funds. When "special-issue" securities are redeemed, interest is paid. In fact, the principal amount of special issues redeemed, plus the corresponding interest, is just enough to cover an expenditure.”
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Those are iou's the government took out based on revenue from current payers. Dude this is ridiculous.


Social Security benefits are considered a “pay as you go” system. This means that the money that comes in from taxes today goes out to pay retirees today. For example, the taxes that I pay in right now also go out right now — and they pay for my dad’s benefits.

These 7 Social Security myths just aren’t true, no matter how often you hear them - MarketWatch
 
JoeTheEconomist said:
He is right.

The meaning of this sentence is : When payroll taxes collected by Social Security are insufficient...

You will be interested to know that the bond redemption policy - ie the process that selects bonds for redemption - does not pick the bond with the lowest interest rate. It is picked by maturity date by interest rate. In a world of falling interest rates we are redeeming at par bonds at that would sell at a premium. It is going to cost the program about $1B this year in lost interest.
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No, the meaning of the sentence is what it says, not what you want it to say. What you say the meaning is now, is actually what happens in 2034 when the funds are depleted.

The interest rates for the Treasuries SS has invested in are not falling. They are already and have been lower than the market anyways...
 
vegas giants said:
Those are iou's the government took out based on revenue from current payers. Dude this is ridiculous.


Social Security benefits are considered a “pay as you go” system. This means that the money that comes in from taxes today goes out to pay retirees today. For example, the taxes that I pay in right now also go out right now — and they pay for my dad’s benefits.

These 7 Social Security myths just aren’t true, no matter how often you hear them - MarketWatch
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They are a special class of Treasuries. If they are just IOU’s so is every other investment... [emoji849] Indeed it is ridiculous.

Take it up with the SSA. I posted their explanation.

Which of those myths in your link have I stated? None. [emoji849]
 
Aberration said:
They are a special class of Treasuries. If they are just IOU’s so is every other investment... [emoji849] Indeed it is ridiculous.

Take it up with the SSA. I posted their explanation.

Which of those myths in your link have I stated? None. [emoji849]
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Dude I quoted the section for you. Social security is a pay as you go program. That is a fact everyone but you seems to know
 
vegas giants said:
Dude I quoted the section for you. Social security is a pay as you go program. That is a fact everyone but you seems to know
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Dudes I quoted the section for you. Social Security is paid for from the sale of Treasuries. This is a fact everyone but you seems to know.
 
Aberration said:
Dudes I quoted the section for you. Social Security is paid for from the sale of Treasuries. This is a fact everyone but you seems to know.
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You make me laugh
 
Aberration said:
No, the meaning of the sentence is what it says, not what you want it to say. What you say the meaning is now, is actually what happens in 2034 when the funds are depleted.

The interest rates for the Treasuries SS has invested in are not falling. They are already and have been lower than the market anyways...
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The government redeeming bonds at 4%+ while holding bonds that yield 1.375%. Here is the effective yield curve of the Trust Fund. Yes interest rates are falling. The bonds that we are redeeming now were purchased 15 years ago, when interest rates were much higher.

Social Security Interest Rates

Vegas says that payroll tax revenue is used to pay beneficiaries. You seem to think that the money held in the Trust Fund is used to pay beneficiaries. I am curious... what do you think happens to the payroll taxes that are collected?
 
JoeTheEconomist said:
The government redeeming bonds at 4%+ while holding bonds that yield 1.375%. Here is the effective yield curve of the Trust Fund. Yes interest rates are falling. The bonds that we are redeeming now were purchased 15 years ago, when interest rates were much higher.

Social Security Interest Rates

Vegas says that payroll tax revenue is used to pay beneficiaries. You seem to think that the money held in the Trust Fund is used to pay beneficiaries. I am curious... what do you think happens to the payroll taxes that are collected?
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Payroll taxes are used to buy new Treasuries.
 
I privatized my Social Security at age 13 when I first began to earn some income from working.
I also, by no choice of my own, had FICA taxes withheld from my pay check all my working life.
The Federal government is highly unlikely to give up a revenue stream resulting in 12.4% of all income earned up to $137,700 and if anything at all will do all it can to maintain a surplus by increasing the tax rate and/or raising the maximum income upon which the tax is applied.
Our life choices as I see them range from allowing ones self to become totally dependent upon government, which a large number of persons appear to have chosen, partially dependent upon government by acceptance of the many government social programs we may or may not benefit from personally but allow our income to be taxed for their application, or take whatever actions we find most beneficial for our economic freedom accepting the risks resulting in reward or loss.
It's YOUR life, live it to the best of your abilities through your own actions or give in to government actions wholly/partially.
 
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