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Priests, Muslims, Military, Police – Connecting The Dots?

Dragonfly

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The vast majority of people on this planet are good people, regardless of religious beliefs, race, culture, gender, or profession.
Correct? Can we agree to start there, or is that general statement wrong from the get-go?

The vast majority of priests, Muslims, military, and police are good people as well. Correct?

However, like anywhere and everywhere there are a subset of people who are dangerous, destructive, and non-representative of the overall group. For example, pedophile priests, Islamic terrorists, those in the military that prey upon their subordinates, and police officers that do not conform to the laws they are sworn to uphold. The percentage of those who fit this description are very low, but due to the level of “power” and/or “trust” they hold, the destructiveness of their deeds has far reaching effects over the rest of society.

Isn't a huge part of the problem lying in how the larger organizations “police” themselves? I think this is where the larger problem rests within broader communities. The pedophile priest catastrophe wouldn’t have reached such lofty proportions had the Catholic Church reacted much differently to the situation than they originally did.

Many suggest the “peaceful Muslims” are not making a strong enough stand against the violent Muslims. Or that their voice needs to be magnitudes louder.

The cover-up and/or protections offered within the organizations in question are a bigger part of the problem isn’t it?
How often do we hear about police officers being convicted of actual crimes? Does it happen often and we just don’t read about it? Flip side would be how often do we hear about police officers being exonerated/absolved of any wrong doing even when it appears something very wrong has occurred?

Same thing regarding rape in the military. It’s bad that it happens, but what’s worse is how it has been handled. We know it’s going to happen. There are bad people in and from all walks of life, and in all professions and cultures.

How it’s handled is the biggest part of the problem isn’t it?

Is anybody shocked there was a swift and deadly “counter attack” on police in Dallas?(That it happened in Dallas as opposed to some other city might be a shock, but that's not the point.) Or was it inevitable? Was it so much because one man killed another, or was it more about the idea that "once again", the police officer more than likely won’t even be put on trial for what happened? I’m not justifying anything that happened in Dallas, but I am suggesting that there is a systemic problem in larger organizations.

Individual accountability, but also a broader organizational accountability. How do we hold the larger organizations more accountable for things individuals within the organization do that harm the greater community? People don’t counter-attack because one person kills another. Counter-attacks happen because specific people, due to their position within an organization, can literally get away with things the regular folks can’t.

Unique protections that average folks don’t have.

How can “we” address that?
 

joG

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The vast majority of people on this planet are good people, regardless of religious beliefs, race, culture, gender, or profession.
Correct? Can we agree to start there, or is that general statement wrong from the get-go?

The vast majority of priests, Muslims, military, and police are good people as well. Correct?

However, like anywhere and everywhere there are a subset of people who are dangerous, destructive, and non-representative of the overall group. For example, pedophile priests, Islamic terrorists, those in the military that prey upon their subordinates, and police officers that do not conform to the laws they are sworn to uphold. The percentage of those who fit this description are very low, but due to the level of “power” and/or “trust” they hold, the destructiveness of their deeds has far reaching effects over the rest of society.

Isn't a huge part of the problem lying in how the larger organizations “police” themselves? I think this is where the larger problem rests within broader communities. The pedophile priest catastrophe wouldn’t have reached such lofty proportions had the Catholic Church reacted much differently to the situation than they originally did.

Many suggest the “peaceful Muslims” are not making a strong enough stand against the violent Muslims. Or that their voice needs to be magnitudes louder.

The cover-up and/or protections offered within the organizations in question are a bigger part of the problem isn’t it?
How often do we hear about police officers being convicted of actual crimes? Does it happen often and we just don’t read about it? Flip side would be how often do we hear about police officers being exonerated/absolved of any wrong doing even when it appears something very wrong has occurred?

Same thing regarding rape in the military. It’s bad that it happens, but what’s worse is how it has been handled. We know it’s going to happen. There are bad people in and from all walks of life, and in all professions and cultures.

How it’s handled is the biggest part of the problem isn’t it?

Is anybody shocked there was a swift and deadly “counter attack” on police in Dallas?(That it happened in Dallas as opposed to some other city might be a shock, but that's not the point.) Or was it inevitable? Was it so much because one man killed another, or was it more about the idea that "once again", the police officer more than likely won’t even be put on trial for what happened? I’m not justifying anything that happened in Dallas, but I am suggesting that there is a systemic problem in larger organizations.

Individual accountability, but also a broader organizational accountability. How do we hold the larger organizations more accountable for things individuals within the organization do that harm the greater community? People don’t counter-attack because one person kills another. Counter-attacks happen because specific people, due to their position within an organization, can literally get away with things the regular folks can’t.

Unique protections that average folks don’t have.

How can “we” address that?

I agree with most of that. Where I am not so sure is that the problems arise only in large organizations. I suspect that it is a trait in humans to use violence, when they see their own or their group's existential or high priority goals systematically at risk by others. After all, even small bands of chimps wage wars and kill.
 

Dragonfly

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I agree with most of that. Where I am not so sure is that the problems arise only in large organizations. I suspect that it is a trait in humans to use violence, when they see their own or their group's existential or high priority goals systematically at risk by others. After all, even small bands of chimps wage wars and kill.

I agree, but the resources a larger organization has to protect its interests are far greater aren't they?

A pedophile within the westboro baptist organization couldn't be hidden as easily as a pedophile within the catholic church. Right?
 

joG

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I agree, but the resources a larger organization has to protect its interests are far greater aren't they?

A pedophile within the westboro baptist organization couldn't be hidden as easily as a pedophile within the catholic church. Right?

As far as I have looked at that particular issue, it appears that an awful lot of the pedophile activities take place in small family structures, where sometimes wider groups connect in. The second area seems to be sports groups that are also not so very large.
 

Dragonfly

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As far as I have looked at that particular issue, it appears that an awful lot of the pedophile activities take place in small family structures, where sometimes wider groups connect in. The second area seems to be sports groups that are also not so very large.

That's part of my thought process though. There are pedophiles in all areas of life/profession.
Covering up, hiding, or "protecting" those individuals is the systemic problem I'm referring to.

A large school like Penn State can cover up and/or protect the Sandusky.

How do we hold the organization accountable enough so that if something similar happens in the future, and the odds are it will at some point (maybe not at Penn State but somewhere else), that they'll react to it far differently than Penn State did?
 

Dragonfly

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As far as I have looked at that particular issue, it appears that an awful lot of the pedophile activities take place in small family structures, where sometimes wider groups connect in. The second area seems to be sports groups that are also not so very large.

By the way, highly appreciate your helping me walk through this thought process in a reasonable and calm manner. :cheers:
 
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