Presidential candidate and his ties to a terrorist. No, not that one.

Iriemon said:

McCain palls with free convicts and terrorist plotters. Good for him.

I'm pretty sure that when Obama met with Ayers he was free too.

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Tell you what, I'm pretty sure Mccain did something wrong when he left his
first wife. He admits the marriage fell apart and it was his fault..so there...I can say that I belive McCain did something wrong....

Can you give me one thing that you think Bahama did wrong????
Didn't think so.....you're BLIND...BLIND....it's a liberal thing..
With no morals it's impossible to see the wrong!!

Repub2thabone said:

Tell you what, I'm pretty sure Mccain did something wrong when he left his
first wife. He admits the marriage fell apart and it was his fault..so there...I can say that I belive McCain did something wrong....

Can you give me one thing that you think Bahama did wrong????
Didn't think so.....you're BLIND...BLIND....it's a liberal thing..
With no morals it's impossible to see the wrong!!

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Off the top of my head, I've said many times here I think his tax policy is wrong. With $10 trillion in debt, nobody should be getting tax cuts right now.

Iriemon said:

Off the top of my head, I've said many times here I think his tax policy is wrong. With $10 trillion in debt, nobody should be getting tax cuts right now.

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Sorry, $10.2 trillion. It's hard to keep up with it.

Is Liddy at least apologetic?

Neither Ayers or his wife or other "associates" are.

In fact, now we know that Michelle Obama palled around with Ayers wife...

Peas in a pod, eh?

JMak said:

Is Liddy at least apologetic?

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Not that I know of. Is he?

Neither Ayers or his wife or other "associates" are.

In fact, now we know that Michelle Obama palled around with Ayers wife...

Peas in a pod, eh?

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Obama finished off his term on the committee and then stopped associating with Ayers after his comments about not regretting his activities.

Iriemon said:

Not that I know of. Is he?

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It would seem incumbent upon those wishing to draw an equivalency between McCain's relationship with Liddy and Obama's relationship with Ayers to find out. I mean, the right's problem with the Ayer's association is that Obama not only associated with a terrorist, but with a unrepentent terrorist who is frustrated that he couldn't do more damage, i.e., kill more soldiers and their girlfriends.

Obama finished off his term on the committee and then stopped associating with Ayers after his comments about not regretting his activities.

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Not according to Obama's own campaign who statements this week indicated that Obama continued to have contact with Ayers even after 9/11. See Obama's tenure on the Woods board.

But even if Obama totally severed contact after the Woods tenure, it still means that Obama had a long-time relationship with a known, unapologetic, and unrepentent terrorist...

I had found other more recent examples of lack of contrition yesterday, but I haven't been able to dig them up, and am about to run out the door but here is one for starters:

His public persona is brash, abrasive and combative. But there is a quiet, reflective side.

"I have no remorse," he said. "I stood for my principles."

Any regrets?

"I would do it all over again."

Living | G. Gordon Liddy Puts The Blame On John Dean | Seattle Times Newspaper

JMak said:

It would seem incumbent upon those wishing to draw an equivalency between McCain's relationship with Liddy and Obama's relationship with Ayers to find out. I mean, the right's problem with the Ayer's association is that Obama not only associated with a terrorist, but with a unrepentent terrorist who is frustrated that he couldn't do more damage, i.e., kill more soldiers and their girlfriends.

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Doesn't seem that way to me.

Not according to Obama's own campaign who statements this week indicated that Obama continued to have contact with Ayers even after 9/11. See Obama's tenure on the Woods board.

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I could have sworn that is what I said, let's see....

Obama finished off his term on the committee and then stopped associating with Ayers after his comments about not regretting his activities.

Yep.

But even if Obama totally severed contact after the Woods tenure, it still means that Obama had a long-time relationship with a known, unapologetic, and unrepentent terrorist...

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He wasn't a known, unapologetic, and unrepentent terrorist before 9/11.

marduc said:

I had found other more recent examples of lack of contrition yesterday, but I haven't been able to dig them up, and am about to run out the door but here is one for starters:

His public persona is brash, abrasive and combative. But there is a quiet, reflective side.

"I have no remorse," he said. "I stood for my principles."

Any regrets?

"I would do it all over again."

Living | G. Gordon Liddy Puts The Blame On John Dean | Seattle Times Newspaper

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Doesn't seem very apologetic to me.

Ayers: bombed our Pentagon and US capitol. Planned to bomb army barracks to kill troops and their girlfriends. Bombmaking led to death of co-conspirators. Unrepetent domestic terrorist.

Liddy: planned to kidnap anti-war protestors who sought to disrupt GOP convention, went off at the mouth about headshots following the branch Davidian (and subsequently backpedaled on that).

Am I missing something?

I don't see the equivalency here.

I'm open to being persuaded on this point. With only this information, McCain shuld not have had a relationship with this guy and seems to be in a similar position as Obama in terms of his political career requiring a relationship with Liddy...

Iriemon said:

Doesn't seem that way to me.

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Of course it would not. You're an intellectually dishonest poster who apparently believes it's not his obligation to make his case but someone else's. Look, you guys are the ones claiming that this relationship with Liddy is equivalent to Obama's relationship with Ayers. Well, how so? It's your premise, not mine.

I could have sworn that is what I said, let's see....

Obama finished off his term on the committee and then stopped associating with Ayers after his comments about not regretting his activities.

Yep.

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Well, one, it's an unsubstantiated assertion, two, it wasn't clear what "board" you were referring to which is important because they served on multiple boards together, and three, the Obama campaign's own statements contradict your unsubstantiated assertion. Obama's campaign stated that Obama and Ayers "have not spoken by phone or exchanged e-mail messages since Mr. Obama began serving in the United States Senate in January 2005."

:3oops:

He wasn't a known, unapologetic, and unrepentent terrorist before 9/11.

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No one knew he was such prior to 9/11? Ayers has been bragging about not being convicted because of a technicality (one of the perks of belonging to a wealthy family and deciding to terrorize that nation which has enriched you) long before 9/11.

Do you have any idea what you're talking about??

JMak said:

Ayers: bombed our Pentagon and US capitol. Planned to bomb army barracks to kill troops and their girlfriends. Bombmaking led to death of co-conspirators. Unrepetent domestic terrorist.

Liddy: planned to kidnap anti-war protestors who sought to disrupt GOP convention, went off at the mouth about headshots following the branch Davidian (and subsequently backpedaled on that).

Am I missing something?

I don't see the equivalency here.

I'm open to being persuaded on this point. With only this information, McCain shuld not have had a relationship with this guy and seems to be in a similar position as Obama in terms of his political career requiring a relationship with Liddy...

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I am wanting to respond to you; however, this post seems to be contradicting itself and I am not sure what exactly I am supposed to respond to.

Perhaps firebombing the Brookings Institute? Plotting the murder of a journalist?? I'll let you research that yourself if you are open to persuasion, I am tired of being a one man research team (I am still trying to cross reference the entirety of wikipedia so I don't get accused of reading the WHOLE article, apparently the "discussion" section is completely factual, and not actually discussion).

JMak said:

Of course it would not. You're an intellectually dishonest poster who apparently believes it's not his obligation to make his case but someone else's. Look, you guys are the ones claiming that this relationship with Liddy is equivalent to Obama's relationship with Ayers. Well, how so? It's your premise, not mine.

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Damn and I could have sworn it was you trying to distinguish Liddy from Ayers.

Please state what have I been intellectually dishonest about, if you are going to hurl personal insults and accusations.

Repub2thabone said:

G. Gordan Liddy I will give you is a little strange, maybe even more that a little. However, I believe it's the Constituition, Bill of Rights..or you know one of those old documents up there in the big house that they keep under glass...that say's if you're convicted, served your time, and paid your dues then you have....let me see..this may be the part where someone who is on the left doesn't understand...you are FREE......it's called FREEDOM...

If G. Gordon, or even Rev Wright for that matter want to have a radio show, can get sponsors to foot the bill then they can do it...tell you one thing...G. Gordon couldn't do that in Iran, Russia, or numerous other countries...why don't you go live in one of those......

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Ridiculous. Liddy was part of a scheme, like Lerxst said, to actually subvert the democratic process Americans take part in to elect their leaders.

Think about the level of that crime. What craven need does John McCain have in 'palling' around with G. Gordon Liddy?

JMak said:

Ayers: bombed our Pentagon and US capitol. Planned to bomb army barracks to kill troops and their girlfriends. Bombmaking led to death of co-conspirators. Unrepetent domestic terrorist.

Liddy: planned to kidnap anti-war protestors who sought to disrupt GOP convention, went off at the mouth about headshots following the branch Davidian (and subsequently backpedaled on that).

Am I missing something?

I don't see the equivalency here.

I'm open to being persuaded on this point. With only this information, McCain shuld not have had a relationship with this guy and seems to be in a similar position as Obama in terms of his political career requiring a relationship with Liddy...

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Your description of Liddy's criminal intent is really oversimplified, and wrong. It went a lot further than that.

Another thing about Liddy, while I'm at it. Not only was he a megalomaniacal crook, but he was also a bumbling one. All that evil intent, wasted on an inept stooge.

Iriemon said:

Damn and I could have sworn it was you trying to distinguish Liddy from Ayers.

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After you refused to actually present an argument to support your contention that McCain's relationship with Liddy should be considered as equivalent to Obama and Ayers.

Something that needs to be raised about this assertion you guys are making...you're effectively conceding that Obama and Ayers had a relationship and that fact is a troublesome one. Otherwise, you need not accuse McCain of engaging in the same type of relationship with Liddy.

Please state what have I been intellectually dishonest about, if you are going to hurl personal insults and accusations.

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Posting unsubstantiated assertions and then demanding that the person calling you out on it prove you wrong. I call that intellectual dishonesty as you're shifting responsibility for your argument to someone else and demanding they prove a negative.

marduc said:

I am wanting to respond to you; however, this post seems to be contradicting itself and I am not sure what exactly I am supposed to respond to.

Perhaps firebombing the Brookings Institute? Plotting the murder of a journalist?? I'll let you research that yourself if you are open to persuasion, I am tired of being a one man research team (I am still trying to cross reference the entirety of wikipedia so I don't get accused of reading the WHOLE article, apparently the "discussion" section is completely factual, and not actually discussion).

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Well, I laid out what I know of Liddy's past activities and expression of remorse against Ayers record and lack of remorse to conclude that these are not equivalent situations.

Did Liddy firebomb Brookings? I didn't see that in my reading of him...maye I just missed it.

JMak said:

After you refused to actually present an argument to support your contention that McCain's relationship with Liddy should be considered as equivalent to Obama and Ayers.

Something that needs to be raised about this assertion you guys are making...you're effectively conceding that Obama and Ayers had a relationship and that fact is a troublesome one. Otherwise, you need not accuse McCain of engaging in the same type of relationship with Liddy.

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It shows the hypicracy of McCain supporters who engage in this kind of deceptive smear, some of whom on this forum have started numerous threads about Ayers, but blithely excuse McCain for essentially the same kind of association.

Posting unsubstantiated assertions and then demanding that the person calling you out on it prove you wrong. I call that intellectual dishonesty as you're shifting responsibility for your argument to someone else and demanding they prove a negative.

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Denied. You are the one asserting Liddy is materially different from Ayers by suggesting Liddy he was repenatent (which it has been shown he was not). I had said nothing about it one way or another.

If people make factual assertions, they should be prepared to back them up. They have no obligation to look up something they didn't, much less proving a negative.

I back up my facts, as you have seen in the http://www.debatepolitics.com/us-elections/37517-question-obama-supporters-8.html thread in which you accused me of "playing stupid" and whether I was "f'ing stoned," and then promptly disappeared when I backed up each of my assertions.

I never made any assertion about whether Liddy was repenatent or not, and have no obligation to look up something I didn't claim.

We are seeing in your short time here that you are great at making accusations, calling people dishonest and names and ridiculing others. But not so good when called out on it.