President Trump named ‘pro-life person of the year’ for 2017

[yankintx]

True, you didn't actually say Christian. You said "hypocrisy like the American Right." I will amend that to say there are no Christians on the left. It is impossible to be faithful to the Democratic ideology and be a Christian at the same time. I was incorrect to assume you were including Christians among the hypocritical on the right.

kind of you to apologize for assuming. By the way, I am not a Dem

 

[1751Texan]

Is it crass to wonder how many women connected to Donald Trump have aborted pregnancies.

 

[TrumpTrain]

Is it crass to wonder how many women connected to Donald Trump have aborted pregnancies.

If they did then that's on them, isn't it.

What amazes me is the Rights pro capital punishment stance.......

This false comparison gets real old.

1) Criminals who murder people pay for their crime with their life.

2) Innocent babies should not be murdered.

How the hell can anybody compare the two as somehow being the same.

I would like to nominate Trump most likely to send out his fixer to force his one night stand to have an abortion,

That is a truly disgusting post based on sheer hate. You are the sort of person who makes it impossible to have a civil conversation

 

[Scrabaholic]

What amazes me is that the liberals will go all out to save dogs and cats from being euthanized at the kennel but when it comes to the abortion clinic,cut,snip and scrape away.

I am not a liberal, but you are comparing apples to oranges (born to unborn).

 

[TrumpTrain]

I am not a liberal, but you are comparing apples to oranges (born to unborn).

A human being is a human being, regardless of their stage of development. Thats a scientific fact. Are you a science denier?

A baby and a 100 year old person, vastly different as they are, are still both human beings, as is the baby in the womb. They are all just in different stages of development. Killing a babe in the womb is murder.

 

[Scrabaholic]

Where did you get that idea? Who can know that? Have you see the ultrasound images of twins where one is hugging the other? It sounds to me like you are stuck in the old analog science. Scientists are making new discoveries which supercede and render their old theories obsolete. We are learning the world in which we live is not what we thought it was and teach everyone to believe. Your problem is you do not believe an omniscient, omnipotent Supreme Being reins over every individual person and even the entire universe. You believe if there is no God then you are free to assume godship over your life and decide whatever you want according to the desires of your flesh. Your flesh is your god and you live daily to serve only your flesh.

My god is pro choice.

We know the first trimester zef, when most abortions occur (92%) is not sentient.



https://www.researchgate.net/public...ience_Acquired_During_Human_Fetal_Development

 

[Scrabaholic]

there are no Christians on the left. It is impossible to be faithful to the Democratic ideology and be a Christian at the same time.

Sez who?

 

[Lursa]

Where did you get that idea? Who can know that? Have you see the ultrasound images of twins where one is hugging the other? It sounds to me like you are stuck in the old analog science. Scientists are making new discoveries which supercede and render their old theories obsolete. We are learning the world in which we live is not what we thought it was and teach everyone to believe. Your problem is you do not believe an omniscient, omnipotent Supreme Being reins over every individual person and even the entire universe. You believe if there is no God then you are free to assume godship over your life and decide whatever you want according to the desires of your flesh. Your flesh is your god and you live daily to serve only your flesh.

I work in the ultrasound field...and they arent hugging. That is an incredibly uneducated, emotionally-based comment.

And doctors have done the research for decades and know that there is no pain and awareness in the 97.5% of all abortions where the pea-sized unborn is flushed from the womb. THat's how 'we know.'

You are 'choosing' to grasp to a nonsense hope in order to force your agenda down other people's throats. Basically, I can invent the same thing: "scientists are learning new things everyday, they may still find unicorns in the jungle somewhere," and it's still complete nonsense.

Also, I am a practicing Christian, so of course I believe in God and I am not the one 'assuming godship' over anyone...YOU are...over women with your desire to force them to remain pregnant against their wills.

 

[TrumpTrain]

My god is pro choice.........

Then you worship an idol, a god of your own making.

 

[Lursa]

That was in the past, this is now. What if sometime afterwards a remorseful Donald Trump fell on his knees with a contrite heart and asked God to forgive his sin? You don't know.

Our Lord in Heaven will forgive him. He will forgive anyone that asks and comes to accept His Word.

I do know that.

 

[TrumpTrain]

I try not to bring God or religion into the discussion, because not everyone shares the same belief. Its best to keep it on a scientific level.

 

[Lursa]

True, you didn't actually say Christian. You said "hypocrisy like the American Right." I will amend that to say there are no Christians on the left. It is impossible to be faithful to the Democratic ideology and be a Christian at the same time. I was incorrect to assume you were including Christians among the hypocritical on the right.

Still wrong. Since I am a Christian and you in your arrogance seem to think you can usurp God's authority and declare I'm not. Who are you to decide who's a good Christian and who isnt? Only God can see what's in another's heart.

Democrats are the party that supports the welfare and food stamps that help families feed and clothe their children when they cannot afford it. The Republican party continually tries to reduce funds to these programs that help families. There's one good example for you. And the true hypocrisy there is that while they would choose to *deny* those families financial support, they would also still demand they have the kids they cant afford :doh

Your words and actions however, are strong evidence that you are one lousy, hateful Christian.

 

[Lursa]

I try not to bring God or religion into the discussion, because not everyone shares the same belief. Its best to keep it on a scientific level.

Yes, science and the law.

Because no changes to the status of abortion or women's rights can take place without change to the law that *conforms to our Constitution.*

 

[Scrabaholic]

A human being is a human being, regardless of their stage of development. Thats a scientific fact. Are you a science denier?

Human being is a social construct, not a scientific one. Where do you see the phrase human being here?:

https://www2.palomar.edu/anthro/animal/table_humans.htm

Killing a babe in the womb is murder.

Murder is the ILLEGAL killing of a person. Even IF zefs were persons (and they aren't), if abortion is legal, it CANNOT be murder.

Your image does not sway me at all.

 

[Scrabaholic]

Then you worship an idol, a god of your own making.

Incorrect. You have no idea who or what I worship. Please do not make assumptions about me.

 

[TrumpTrain]

A human being is a human being, regardless of their stage of development. Thats a scientific fact. Are you a science denier?

A baby and a 100 year old person, vastly different as they are, are still both human beings, as is the baby in the womb. They are all just in different stages of development. Killing a babe in the womb is murder.

Human being is a social construct, not a scientific one. Where do you see the phrase human being here?.......

Don't play word tricks with me. Feel free to insert whatever word you want to. Homo Sapien? Man? Woman? Whatever. A man or a woman is a man or a woman, regardless of their stage of development. Thats a scientific fact.

 

[Lursa]

Don't play word tricks with me. Feel free to insert whatever word you want to. Homo Sapien? Man? Woman? Whatever. A man or a woman is a man or a woman, regardless of their stage of development. Thats a scientific fact.

No one denies that the unborn are Homo sapiens. That is scientific fact...and science is objective and applies no value.

The law however, is subjective and is tasked with finding a balance for society under the Constitution.

The born and unborn cannot be treated equally under the law. One or the has/would have rights that supersede those of the other.

And the US has made that decision. SCOTUS examined women decades ago and decided that we were equal and recognized our rights. They did the same for blacks and determined the same thing. Women and blacks are no longer legally considered 2nd class citizens.

Then SCOTUS examined the unborn for the same reason and did NOT find them equal and did not recognize any rights for the unborn. What legal basis would you offer for them to reconsider that decision?

And of course, here's another US legal decision:

U.S. Code § 8 - “Person”, “human being”, “child”, and “individual” as including born-alive infant

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/1/8

(a) In determining the meaning of any Act of Congress, or of any ruling, regulation, or interpretation of the various administrative bureaus and agencies of the United States, the words “person”, “human being”, “child”, and “individual”, shall include every infant member of the species homo sapiens who is born alive at any stage of development.

(b) As used in this section, the term “born alive”, with respect to a member of the species homo sapiens, means the complete expulsion or extraction from his or her mother of that member, at any stage of development, who after such expulsion or extraction breathes or has a beating heart, pulsation of the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary muscles, regardless of whether the umbilical cord has been cut, and regardless of whether the expulsion or extraction occurs as a result of natural or induced labor, cesarean section, or induced abortion.

 

[Scrabaholic]

Don't play word tricks with me. Feel free to insert whatever word you want to. Homo Sapien? Man? Woman? Whatever. A man or a woman is a man or a woman, regardless of their stage of development. Thats a scientific fact.

Actually, it isn't. A man is a human being (as he's been born) who is an adult. Same for a woman.

 

[Rusty34]

No one denies that the unborn are Homo sapiens. That is scientific fact...and science is objective and applies no value.

The law however, is subjective and is tasked with finding a balance for society under the Constitution.

The born and unborn cannot be treated equally under the law. One or the has/would have rights that supersede those of the other.

And the US has made that decision. SCOTUS examined women decades ago and decided that we were equal and recognized our rights. They did the same for blacks and determined the same thing. Women and blacks are no longer legally considered 2nd class citizens.

Then SCOTUS examined the unborn for the same reason and did NOT find them equal and did not recognize any rights for the unborn. What legal basis would you offer for them to reconsider that decision?

And of course, here's another US legal decision:

U.S. Code § 8 - “Person”, “human being”, “child”, and “individual” as including born-alive infant

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/1/8

I am sure you are well aware all of that could be revisited in the not too distant future while we consider this:

 

[Lursa]

I am sure you are well aware all of that could be revisited in the not too distant future while we consider this:

View attachment 67244078

Well SCOTUS was primarily conservative back when they decided Roe v Wade and it was decided 7-2.

So I'm not too worried.

OTOH, if you have some legal basis that you think they'll consider that will change their decision, I'd love to read it. They cannot, of course, initiate anything that will cause egregious violations of women's Constitutional rights...and they are already tasked with protecting our rights.

 

[minnie616]

Trump encourages adoption: It ‘signals every child – born or unborn – is wanted and loved’
...

Adoption is not an alternative to abortion.

Only about 1 percent of US women give a newborn up for adoption.

Adoption Agents will noteven discuss adoption with a pregnant woman until her last trimester of pregnancy which is after viabilty and past the time elective abortions are legal.

 

[TrumpTrain]

Adoption is not an alternative to abortion........

I disagree. If a woman cannot take care of a baby, then adoption is a much better option than abortion

 

[minnie616]

Then you worship an idol, a god of your own making.

False.

The vast majority of the Jewish faith and a large portion of Protestants also sincerely believe that life begins with the breath of when God breaths the holy spirt ( the soul) into the new born with the first breath which is also known as the breath of life.

The Supreme Court Justices took their sincerely held beliefs into concideration when deciding Roe.

From Part IX of Roev Wade :

There has always been strong support for the view that life does not begin until live' birth. This was the belief of the Stoics. [Footnote 56] It appears to be the predominant, though not the unanimous, attitude of the Jewish faith. [Footnote 57] It may be taken to represent also the position of a large segment of the Protestant community, insofar as that can be ascertained; organized groups that have taken a formal position on the abortion issue have generally regarded abortion as a matter for the conscience of the individual and her family. [Footnote 58]

 

[minnie616]

I disagree. If a woman cannot take care of a baby, then adoption is a much better option than abortion

It does not matter that you disagree, since
99 percent of US women choose to keep their newborn and not give them up for adoption.

 

[Scrabaholic]

I disagree. If a woman cannot take care of a baby, then adoption is a much better option than abortion

I am adopted. I would never do that to a child.