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Pope issues mission statement for papacy

Hatuey

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Pope issues mission statement for papacy

Pope Francis denounced the global financial system that excludes the poor as he issued the mission statement for his papacy on Tuesday, saying he wants the Catholic Church to get its hands dirty as it seeks to bring solace and mercy to society's outcasts.







In a 224-page document, Francis pulled together the priorities he has laid out over eight months of homilies, speeches and interviews, pushing to shift the church away from a focus on doctrine to one of joyful welcome in a bid to draw in believers in a world marked by secularization and vast income inequalities.


The document, Evangelii Gaudium, (The Joy of the Gospel), is the second major teaching document issued by Francis, but is the first actually written by him since the encyclical "The Light of Faith," issued in July, was penned almost entirely by Pope Benedict XVI before he resigned.

....


"Money must serve, not rule!" he said in calling for political leaders to reform the system. "The Pope loves everyone, rich and poor alike, but he is obliged in the name of Christ to remind all that the rich must help, respect and promote the poor."


In a direct challenge to the focus of the past two popes, he also decried the church's "obsession" with rules and doctrine and said in some cases, the church's old customs can be cast aside if they no longer serve to communicate the faith.

I'm by no means a fan of the Catholic Church. It's a corrupt group of old men presiding over who gets rich from the poor. However, I'm definitely an ideological fan of this pope. Though I doubt he'll restore the church in his lifetime, I do find him to be far more open to change than his predecessors. He's tackling internal issues. He's attacking a society that sees wealth as a goal and not a means. I definitely like him.
 
He probably has good intentions but sounds like he doesn't understand economics.
 
The Pope isn't an economist. He may have good intentions (or maybe ulterior motives) but he's naive on this issue. It's one thing to denounce and say something, but to be productive he should offer his own economic plan or one that's feasible. I'm not Catholic nor do I respect the Pope's position from a religious perspective, but I like some of what he does.
 
I don't think that's the point. I don't think he is promoting himself as an economist. The point is that caring for our fellow man and not just ourselves should be central to our policies and our thinking. Odd that you could read something so profound and only get out of it a criticism because it does not promote capitalism. Good grief.
 
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He probably has good intentions but sounds like he doesn't understand economics.

it is clear he understands economics as he shows with this statement:
“As long as the problems of the poor are not radically resolved by rejecting the absolute autonomy of markets and financial speculation and by attacking the structural causes of inequality, no solution will be found for the world’s problems or, for that matter, to any problems,”


here he took direct aim at saint ronnie reagan's trickle down theory of economics:
“Some people continue to defend trickle-down theories which assume that economic growth, encouraged by a free market, will inevitably succeed in bringing about greater justice and inclusiveness in the world. This opinion, which has never been confirmed by the facts, expresses a crude and naïve trust in the goodness of those wielding economic power and in the sacralized workings of the prevailing economic system.”


oh yea, is this fellow truly economically sophisticated. he is revamping the vatican bank, preventing it from continuing to laundry dirty money

i would say he understands economic so well, and wants to impose reasonable limits on unbridled capitalistic forces that he needs to use the bullet-proof bubble when traveling the popemobile:
“This imbalance [between rich and poor] is the result of ideologies which defend the absolute autonomy of the marketplace and financial speculation. Consequently, they reject the right of states, charged with vigilance for the common good, to exercise any form of control. A new tyranny is thus born, invisible and often virtual, which unilaterally and relentlessly imposes its own laws and rules.”

here is where i believe your statement should be found most absurd:
“The thirst for power and possessions knows no limits. In this system, which tends to devour everything which stands in the way of increased profits, whatever is fragile, like the environment, is defenseless before the interests of a deified market, which become the only rule.”


clearly, the pope understands where the economic power lies:
“How can it be that it is not a news item when an elderly homeless person dies of exposure, but it is news when the stock market loses two points? This is a case of exclusion. Can we continue to stand by when food is thrown away while people are starving? This is a case of inequality. Today everything comes under the laws of competition and the survival of the fittest, where the powerful feed upon the powerless. As a consequence, masses of people find themselves excluded and marginalized: without work, without possibilities, without any means of escape.”

and the zinger:
“It is no longer simply about exploitation and oppression, but something new. Exclusion ultimately has to do with what it means to be a part of the society in which we live; those excluded are no longer society’s underside or its fringes or its disenfranchised – they are no longer even a part of it. The excluded are not the ‘exploited’ but the outcast, the ‘leftovers.’”


this Pope is a breath of - much needed - fresh air. may he continue to breathe long and well
 
The Pope is making a mistake by trying to subtly adopt the agenda and talking points of the American left. In the long run, this will greatly weaken the Catholic Church.
 
Like I said, he doesn't understand economics-the basic economics laws as they apply to the macro. But those laws don't fit the good vs. evil storybook narrative, are thus viewed as "boring", so they are often thrown aside.

Evil will occur under any economic system on the micro level, but I don't think that is what the Pope is focusing on.
 
The Pope is making a mistake by trying to subtly adopt the agenda and talking points of the American left. In the long run, this will greatly weaken the Catholic Church.


He's not talking from the left, but what some call the "red" right...

For those with the time and inclination...

Leo XIII - Rerum Novarum
 
The Pope is making a mistake by trying to subtly adopt the agenda and talking points of the American left. In the long run, this will greatly weaken the Catholic Church.

Yeah... it's not like christianity was founded on principles of sharing wealth, renouncing materialism and caring for the poor. Those are all 20th century leftist principles. :lol:
 
Yeah... it's not like christianity was founded on principles of sharing wealth, renouncing materialism and caring for the poor. Those are all 20th century leftist principles. :lol:

As is antipathy and dislike of organized religion as well as disgusting ridicule of the Holy Trinity itself. To attempt to appeal to those who will not accept your Grace while at the same time turning from the hopeful and waiting faithful is a serious mistake that your infantile sarcasm only reinforces.
 
As is antipathy and dislike of organized religion as well as disgusting ridicule of the Holy Trinity itself. To attempt to appeal to those who will not accept your Grace while at the same time turning from the hopeful and waiting faithful is a serious mistake that your infantile sarcasm only reinforces.

Somebody's been hitting the thesaurus hard and yet can't manage to make a complete sentence. The only mistake here is your claim that rejection of wealth, materialism and helping your fellow man are "talking points of the American left".
 
he also decried the church's "obsession" with rules and doctrine and said in some cases, the church's old customs can be cast aside if they no longer serve to communicate the faith.

I always thought this was a strong asset to the Church. It can retain what traditions and rituals it finds are needed and then calculate when it's no longer necessary, relevant, or is preventing them from gaining a great collection of followers.

It's own theology I have less concern over. I just wish them good luck in being masters of conversion, hope they retain their institutional hierarchy, and survive through time.
 
He's attacking a society that sees wealth as a goal and not a means. I definitely like him.
This is ironic in that to many people, promoting the poor and attacking wealth is seen as a goal and not a means.
 
The Pope is making a mistake by trying to subtly adopt the agenda and talking points of the American left. In the long run, this will greatly weaken the Catholic Church.

On the contrary, if it is done correctly, it can strengthen the Church. You don't want to give into every temptation, surely, but adapting to the times is necessary. The Catholic Church is a remarkable calculating group. I think that's rather admirable.
 
He probably has good intentions but sounds like he doesn't understand economics.

Granted, but his position is largely to remind people of the fictitious nature of it and return people to another mode of thought.
 
Yeah... it's not like christianity was founded on principles of sharing wealth, renouncing materialism

The inherent conflict between these principles gives rise to a lot cognitive dissonance in the church. "It's not about money! But please, oh pretty please will you share some of your money?"

The Pope is calling for positive social and economic rights, and promoting the notion that governments should institute them. Positive social and economic rights are the main differentiations between western constitutions and soviet constitutions. Our nation was founded on negative political rights (freedoms/protections), not positive social/economic rights (entitlements).
 
Granted, but his position is largely to remind people of the fictitious nature of it and return people to another mode of thought.

Wasn't that 'other mode of thought' intended towards the spiritual side of mankind? Economics is not really their specialty.
 
I don't think that's the point. I don't think he is promoting himself as an economist. The point is that caring for our fellow man and not just ourselves should be central to our policies and our thinking. Odd that you could read something so profound and only get out of it a criticism because it does not promote capitalism. Good grief.

This os why we have a seperation of church and state. The only thing worse than greedy politicians are greedy priests who are authoritated by a greedy government.
 
Wasn't that 'other mode of thought' intended towards the spiritual side of mankind? Economics is not really their specialty.

Yes, which includes reminding people that their systems of economics must bow to greater purposes, which includes throwing aside notions of malthusian or ricardo constructs and a hands-off approach to dealing with the poor and the destitute.
 
This os why we have a seperation of church and state. The only thing worse than greedy politicians are greedy priests who are authoritated by a greedy government.

A truly unholy alliance is when religion gets involved with the state, the state with crony capitalism, and all three with the military.
 
A truly unholy alliance is when religion gets involved with the state, the state with crony capitalism, and all three with the military.

Is this cat the National Socialist, or was tthat the last dude?
 
Yeah... it's not like christianity was founded on principles of sharing wealth, renouncing materialism and caring for the poor. Those are all 20th century leftist principles. :lol:

Yes it was, but this is the responsibility of the church and not the government. It's a personal thing done within the church, not a compulsory thing forced upon by the government. The main focus is using wealth to glorify God and realize that this life is temporary with heaven being eternal. The principals are in line with Christian theology, but if the pope is pushing for government enforcement of this then he's mistaken and isn't properly understanding the role the church and individual Christian's life play when it comes to charity, caring for the poor, and living a non-materialistic life.
 
Pope issues mission statement for papacy



I'm by no means a fan of the Catholic Church. It's a corrupt group of old men presiding over who gets rich from the poor.
However, I'm definitely an ideological fan of this pope. Though I doubt he'll restore the church in his lifetime, I do find him to be far more open to change than his predecessors. He's tackling internal issues. He's attacking a society that sees wealth as a goal and not a means. I definitely like him
.




I agree. Pope Francis is a welcome change from what we have seen in the past.

Like you I doubt that he will make all of the changes that need to be made, but every journey starts with the first step and he has taken that step.
 
Is this cat the National Socialist, or was that the last dude?
The present dude-in-chief is involved in Crony Capitalism and social experiments with the Military but his religion is still open to question.
 
Yes it was, but this is the responsibility of the church and not the government. It's a personal thing done within the church, not a compulsory thing forced upon by the government. The main focus is using wealth to glorify God and realize that this life is temporary with heaven being eternal.The principals are in line with Christian theology, but if the pope is pushing for government enforcement of this then he's mistaken and isn't properly understanding the role the church and individual Christian's life play when it comes to charity, caring for the poor, and living a non-materialistic life.

There are so many fallacies in this post I simply highlighted them in different colors. Red is strawman 1. Blue is a nonsequitur. Green is strawman 2.
 
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