Political ideal that is most out of touch with reality

[ksu_aviator]

To correct the ill conceived poll in this sub forum, I have proposed the above poll. Vote as you may.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

There is no such thing as an absolute freedom.

 

[ksu_aviator]

There is no such thing as an absolute freedom.

Meh, it wouldn't let me put my original point which was religious freedom shouldn't be usurped for popular secular belief. That was to long.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Meh, it wouldn't let me put my original point which was religious freedom shouldn't be usurped for popular secular belief. That was to long.

Okay. Even had you phrased it that way, I would've voted for it.

 

[ksu_aviator]

Okay. Even had you phrased it that way, I would've voted for it.

So you think it is crazy for people of any religion to say "I don't believe the secular views on abc"? Are you for repealing the freedom of religion clause in the first amendment?

 

[Carjosse]

I don't know it is a tie between religious freedom is absolute and abortion is killing a human as they are both incredibly incorrect. No right or freedom is absolute.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

So you think it is crazy for people of any religion to say "I don't believe the secular views on abc"? Are you for repealing the freedom of religion clause in the first amendment?

No. I don't think that religious freedom gives anyone a license to violate anyone else's rights, which in my mind qualifies as religious freedom being usurped by popular secular belief.

 

[Neomalthusian]

There is no such thing as an absolute freedom.

In the case of religion there is. You can believe any crazy ass thing imaginable. There's no way to stop you from believing it (except by involuntary medication, but that is somewhat rare).

The idea that is most out of touch with reality is the notion that taxing some people at higher rates helps the poor. In reality, the things that help the poor (including government spending on such) are not funded by income taxes. That money is spent irrespective of taxes. Essentially, government spending is the deposit of money into the economy, and taxation is the withdrawal of money from the economy. One does not pay for the other anymore.

It's kind of a technicality. I almost chose "global warming is 100% man-made," but I didn't because I'm not sure anyone actually believes that.

 

[Paschendale]

"R-Religious freedom is absolute (i.e. traditional marriage, creationism, young Earth)" is the most out of touch. Religious freedom doesn't mean any of those things. Religious freedom means you CAN'T force only a specific form of marriage, because other religious perspectives have different ideas about it. Imposing a certain Christian view of marriage means discriminating against Reform Judaism, for example, which embraces SSM. Religious freedom also does not mean that you get to have the state teach your religion as truth to children. Creationism is one particular religious idea and it cannot be elevated above other ones. What science classes teach is the facts. You can apply your religion and interpret them any way you want, but facts are facts. A religious perspective can claim that we have iron in our DNA instead of Thymine, but that's simply not true.

But religious freedom in this country already is absolute. You can think whatever you want. You can pray to whoever or whatever you want. You can live your life according to your faith and your ideals... up until you start limiting someone else's ability to do that. That ideal already exists, and it is the reason why things like enforcing heterosexual only marriage and teaching non-science in science classrooms is not acceptable.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

In the case of religion there is. You can believe any crazy ass thing imaginable. There's no way to stop you from believing it (except by involuntary medication, but that is somewhat rare).

Religion is not merely about belief, it also involves action. When that action violates the rights of others, the freedom to practice must be superseded by the rights of others.

 

[brothern]

Oof, I voted for 'Global Warming is not man made'. Evidence contradicts this ideal, and even if it didn't, both climate change and environmental problems are a threat to our lifestyles and the stability of America society.

 

[ksu_aviator]

No. I don't think that religious freedom gives anyone a license to violate anyone else's rights, which in my mind qualifies as religious freedom being usurped by popular secular belief.

So it is ok for secularism to be forced on religion, but not religion to be forced on secularism? Not that that's what is happening, but I want to see what your line of thinking is.

 

[Redress]

Almost every option is built off an extreme that almost no one believes.

Even most on the right know that human activity has some level of affect on the environment. Most on the left know that other factors than humans affect climate change.

Both your abortion options are vastly oversimplified.

Your tax options are oversimplified and not exclusive.

You immigration options are almost parodies of the actual positions.

Your religious freedom options, the examples have nothing to do with religious freedom, and the left tends to be the ones most supportive of civil liberties(outside of guns).

Based on that, I cannot answer your poll since I am not going to try and misrepresent what those on the right think.

 

[Neomalthusian]

Your tax options are oversimplified and not exclusive.

I thought the tax options represented what a lot of people think, actually.

 

[Medusa]

There is no such thing as an absolute freedom.

but absolute justice

 

[shrubnose]

So you think it is crazy for people of any religion to say "I don't believe the secular views on abc"?

Are you for repealing the freedom of religion clause in the first amendment?

We could make it just a little more clear that NO religion has any right to try to shove its ideas down anyone's throat.

 

[Cephus]

So you think it is crazy for people of any religion to say "I don't believe the secular views on abc"? Are you for repealing the freedom of religion clause in the first amendment?

No, but freedoms are always, by their very nature, limited. Just because you have freedom to believe something doesn't mean you have freedom to act on that belief.

 

[Cephus]

It's kind of a technicality. I almost chose "global warming is 100% man-made," but I didn't because I'm not sure anyone actually believes that.

Unfortunately, I've run into some who think that if humans would just quietly go extinct, everything will be fine.

 

[Gipper]

L-Higher taxation for certain tax brackets is fair because it helps the poor

This one...

 

[justabubba]

that campaign bribes ... "contributions" = free speech

 

[EdwinWillers]

Might we get a few more opinions from which to choose?

 

[Cephus]

Might we get a few more opinions from which to choose?

Polls only permit 10 options.

 

[EdwinWillers]

Polls only permit 10 options.

Yeah, I know. I was sorta making another point.

 

[sangha]

Every single one of your "liberal ideals" is out of touch with reality because liberals do not believe those things

L-Global Warming is 100% man made
L-Unborn human rights are trumped by a woman's right to choose
L-Higher taxation for certain tax brackets is fair because it helps the poor
L-Immigration laws should not be enforced
L-Secular values trump religious freedom (i.e. gay marriage, evolution, big bang)

GW is not 100% man made
The unborn have no rights under our constitution
Progressive income taxes are justified because they are good for everyone, not just the poor
Immigration laws should be changed, not ignored
Secular values don't trump religious freedom, but religious freedom does not justify breaking the law.

 

[ksu_aviator]

No, but freedoms are always, by their very nature, limited. Just because you have freedom to believe something doesn't mean you have freedom to act on that belief.

Freedoms and rights are not the same. We are talking about rights.