• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

trfjr

Banned
Joined
Feb 27, 2013
Messages
3,114
Reaction score
1,004
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
A Newport, Rhode Island police sergeant reported Navy Yard shooter Aaron Alexis to naval station police last month after the suspect told cops he was “hearing voices” through his hotel room wall and that three people were following him and sending vibrations into his body, according to a police report obtained by FoxNews.com.

Read more: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says | Fox News

50 years ago the police would have been allowed to involuntary commit Aaron Alexis to a mental facility for at least a 2 week evaluation. he could have gotten the help he needed and saved the public from his mental breakdown that led to the shooting
 
Yep, but nut control is neither Feinstein's nor Obama's priority. ;)

feinstien.jpg

obama.jpg
 
Read more: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says | Fox News

50 years ago the police would have been allowed to involuntary commit Aaron Alexis to a mental facility for at least a 2 week evaluation. he could have gotten the help he needed and saved the public from his mental breakdown that led to the shooting

So it seems like there was negligence as well. Psychotropic drugs people, another common denominator in the last four mass shootings. And like others, warnings ignored!
 
Last edited:

So it seems like there was negligence as well.

not by the police in Rhode Island they are not allowed to involuntary commit any one unless they are a immediate threat to him self or the public
 
not by the police in Rhode Island they are not allowed to involuntary commit any one unless they are a immediate threat to him self or the public
As they shouldn't be.
 
So they are giving security clearances to known nutjobs and people are worried about what they are doing with all the raw data the government is gathering :doh

On a more serious note, I have had to deal with mental people. It can be hard. They can be normal when they are on the meds and in a stable life situation and be bat poot crazy if they are not taking their meds properly or life becomes too stressful for them.
 
As they shouldn't be.

even if it would have saved the lives of 12 including his own
how is it ok to infringe on the rights of the millions of gun owners for so called public safety, but not to do the same of the mentally ill for the same reason
 
So they are giving security clearances to known nutjobs and people are worried about what they are doing with all the raw data the government is gathering :doh

On a more serious note, I have had to deal with mental people. It can be hard. They can be normal when they are on the meds and in a stable life situation and be bat poot crazy if they are not taking their meds properly or life becomes too stressful for them.

If Aaron Alexis was a Tea Party member he would have never gotten his clearance he would be on some government terrorist watch list
 
Read more: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says | Fox News

50 years ago the police would have been allowed to involuntary commit Aaron Alexis to a mental facility for at least a 2 week evaluation. he could have gotten the help he needed and saved the public from his mental breakdown that led to the shooting

Maybe the police should have warned the Navy that Aron Alexis was a liberal and an Obama supporter.

Now that's a dead giveawy of mental instability.
 
not by the police in Rhode Island they are not allowed to involuntary commit any one unless they are a immediate threat to him self or the public

Sure I know that, I didn't mean by them.
 
So should mental hospitals be a state issue or federal issue?

Over the last 20 or 30 years many states cut funding for mental institutions by as much 50% to 80% and many state mental hospitals closed down completely leaving community centers and jails to pick up the slack. But they don't have much funding either and often times the mentally ill are just given a quick check over and a prescription and sent on their way or they spend a night in jail and released the next day.
 
So should mental hospitals be a state issue or federal issue?

Over the last 20 or 30 years many states cut funding for mental institutions by as much 50% to 80% and many state mental hospitals closed down completely leaving community centers and jails to pick up the slack. But they don't have much funding either and often times the mentally ill are just given a quick check over and a prescription and sent on their way or they spend a night in jail and released the next day.

Your right and its a huge problem!
 
So they are giving security clearances to known nutjobs and people are worried about what they are doing with all the raw data the government is gathering :doh

On a more serious note, I have had to deal with mental people. It can be hard. They can be normal when they are on the meds and in a stable life situation and be bat poot crazy if they are not taking their meds properly or life becomes too stressful for them.

He was given clearance before hand.. about 5 years ago.. he got a 10 year clearance. Recent stuff wouldn't become official or even known until much later if at all due to patient rights and DoD policy.
 
even if it would have saved the lives of 12 including his own
how is it ok to infringe on the rights of the millions of gun owners for so called public safety, but not to do the same of the mentally ill for the same reason

How are you a libertarian? You can't hold a person against their will because you assume something or presume something. That would be holding someone against their will, infringement.
 
If the shooter had been white this probably wouldn't have happened as authorities would have acted on all the red flags present on this guys.. In the world we live in today these things get overlooked by most government entities because they do not want to face a race issue if they "handle it".
 
Your right and its a huge problem!

It's sad that Alexis tried to get help for himself from the police and the VA hospital and then just sent on his way. Everybody seems to agree that mental illness is an issue, but nobody seems to be doing anything about it. A couple weeks from now people will hardly give it a second thought....until another mass shooting happens again and again like some "macabe ritual" that US society has just resigned itself to. With each mass killing the public seems to become more and more jaded.
 
Last edited:
not by the police in Rhode Island they are not allowed to involuntary commit any one unless they are a immediate threat to him self or the public

Yeah, but we could stop people who hear voices in their heads and show clear signs of mental illness, violence, and are a pretty clear time bomb ready to explode from owning guns. Responsible people will occasionally lose it and that is a risk many seem willing to take, but there are nutbars who we know are not safe with weapons and I think it is about time we stop allowing them to get one.

oh, and an added benefit is that if a person is seeing a shrink who thinks they are disabled mentally and need to go onto social security disability and psych meds we can keep them from getting guns. That might lower the people conning the system about mental disability and perhaps slow down the over prescription of psych medication to people who do not need it. One might be a little less willing to get a psych med prescription so they can sell it for profit if they would have to give up their ability to legally own a gun because they are evaluated as nutbars by a "professional" shrink.
 
How are you a libertarian? You can't hold a person against their will because you assume something or presume something. That would be holding someone against their will, infringement.

no im just pointing out the hypocrisy. I'm all for civil rights but also I draw a line when it comes to public safety
 
Yeah, but we could stop people who hear voices in their heads and show clear signs of mental illness, violence, and are a pretty clear time bomb ready to explode from owning guns. Responsible people will occasionally lose it and that is a risk many seem willing to take, but there are nutbars who we know are not safe with weapons and I think it is about time we stop allowing them to get one.

oh, and an added benefit is that if a person is seeing a shrink who thinks they are disabled mentally and need to go onto social security disability and psych meds we can keep them from getting guns. That might lower the people conning the system about mental disability and perhaps slow down the over prescription of psych medication to people who do not need it. One might be a little less willing to get a psych med prescription so they can sell it for profit if they would have to give up their ability to legally own a gun because they are evaluated as nutbars by a "professional" shrink.

that would require the mentally ill to be registered as such it would require doctors to release patient information to law enforcement. are you willing to go there?
 
If the shooter had been white this probably wouldn't have happened as authorities would have acted on all the red flags present on this guys.. In the world we live in today these things get overlooked by most government entities because they do not want to face a race issue if they "handle it".

Right, because no mass shooters have been white. My eyes are rolling to far back in my head I can see my own brain stem.
 
So should mental hospitals be a state issue or federal issue?

Over the last 20 or 30 years many states cut funding for mental institutions by as much 50% to 80% and many state mental hospitals closed down completely leaving community centers and jails to pick up the slack. But they don't have much funding either and often times the mentally ill are just given a quick check over and a prescription and sent on their way or they spend a night in jail and released the next day.

they lost their funding because most patients were released because they wasn't allowed to be held against their will anymore unless they where an immediate threat to themselves or the public and that isn't decided upon unless they commit a crime that is why they end up in jail
 
It's sad that Alexis tried to get help for himself from the police and the VA hospital and then just sent on his way. Everybody seems to agree that mental illness is an issue, but nobody seems to be doing anything about it. A couple weeks from now people will hardly give it a second thought....until another mass shooting happens again and again like some "macabe ritual" that US society has just resigned itself to. With each mass killing the public seems to become more and more jaded.

if he would have asked for help from the police they would have taken him to a mental facility for an evaluation they are not allowed to make that determination on their own
 
they lost their funding because most patients where released because they wasn't allowed to be held against their will anymore unless they where a immediate threat to themselves or the public and that isn't decided upon unless they commit a crime that is why they end up in jail

It doesn't appear to be working. It's like a one size fits all treatment....take a pill and check iback next month....and hope the patients take their medication in the meantime.
 
It doesn't appear to be working. It's like a one size fits all treatment....take a pill and check iback next month....and hope the patients take their medication in the meantime.

so what are you suggesting go back to they way it was? instead of waiting them to commit a violent crime and lock them up in jail forcibly lock them up in a mental institution drug them before they commit a violent crime?
 
that would require the mentally ill to be registered as such it would require doctors to release patient information to law enforcement. are you willing to go there?

I am willing to say if a person is declared mentally unstable they should not be allowed a gun. And do not think those records are not out there. They just are not allowed to be released to the public. They could certainly keep them private and out of the public's hands while allowing them to refuse a gun sale via national database because of it.

But let us see what road you are going down. You want a guy who hears voices in his head and has been in a few violent scuffles, and was tossed out of the military for his psych issues to be handed any gun he wants without any problem. You want a kid who has severe mental problems so much so he cannot go to school, and has a mental problem which makes him prone to fits where he is uncontrollable whos own mother wanted to have him committed to have access to assault rifles. You want a guy who thinks he is the god damned joker who has been evaluated by a school shrink to be psycho to be able to stockpile weapons and bombs. You want a certifiably crazy asian kid to be able to get guns. This is where your path leads. Oh, and ihn case you missed it I am talking about this shooter, the sandyhook shooter, the batman movie shooter, and the VA tech shooter. There are other instances of single or multiple serial killers which we could have at least hindered some by saying no to their legal purchase of a gun. That is not to mention the ones who have been evaluated as suicidal and clinically depressed who get guns and kill themselves.

This is why the gun nuts get a bad rep. it is because they do not want to discuss any reasonable and good restriction on the ownership of a deadly weapon. I think it is quite reasonable to say if you are psychologically a nutbar it is time we at least keep you from buying a legal firearm. At least sending them to a criminal dealer runs the risk of a sting bust, or in the case of severe aspergers renders it near imkpossible because someone like Adam Lanza did not have the social skills necessary to go hunting for an illegal firearm.
 
Back
Top Bottom