Police told not to pursue Orlando shooter for ‘15 or 20 minutes--

[MickeyW]

— could’ve been longer’ until SWAT arrived

ORLANDO — After an initial burst of fire between Omar Mateen and a security guard at the Pulse nightclub, a group of five to six police officers arrived on the scene within minutes, broke through a large glass window and entered the club as the killing of 49 people was underway inside, according to a Belle Isle police officer who was among the first responders.
In the first public accounting of those critical early minutes by an officer who actually went inside the club, Belle Isle police officer Brandon Cornwell, 25, said the ad-hoc team spent the first seconds inside “trying to locate exactly where the shooter was — we kept hearing people scream and shots fired.”

He said he arrived “in 38 seconds.” “We just basically stayed there, waited for movement, and we just held our position until SWAT got there,” said Cornwell, 25, who never fired his weapon.

Police told not to pursue Orlando shooter for ‘15 or 20 minutes — could’ve been longer’ until SWAT arrived

 

[MickeyW]

Sooo....even if the police do arrive in a short amount of time, doesn't mean they are going to save your ass!

Goes to show it doesn't always end with police rushing in to save you within minutes. Sometimes they're right outside your door listening to you die. Evil triumphs when good men do nothing.

Get training, be armed, and be prepared for anything. Knowing your surroundings is just the preliminary

prep.

Taking care of number one is always a better choice then been in a "nanny state of mind"!

 

[Thoreau72]

The longer this goes the more suspicious the story becomes.

I am curious as to how and why this murder became a federal case instead of a state case?

 

[reinoe]

He said he arrived “in 38 seconds.” “We just basically stayed there, waited for movement, and we just held our position until SWAT got there,” said Cornwell, 25, who never fired his weapon.

Police told not to pursue Orlando shooter for ‘15 or 20 minutes — could’ve been longer’ until SWAT arrived

Since Omar Mateen wasn't an unarmed Black man the police were scared ****less and had to wait for SWAT to arrive.

 

[Tigerace117]

Since Omar Mateen wasn't an unarmed Black man the police were scared ****less and had to wait for SWAT to arrive.

Or, you know, they were waiting for the guys who are specially trained for these exact situations to show up.

Even more so then the usually officer, anyway.

 

[jimbo]

The longer this goes the more suspicious the story becomes.

I am curious as to how and why this murder became a federal case instead of a state case?

That's a valid point. The only reason the feds should be involved is if they considered it a hate or discrimination crime. Something the feds have refused to do.

 

[countryboy]

Or, you know, they were waiting for the guys who are specially trained for these exact situations to show up.

Even more so then the usually officer, anyway.

And how many people had to die during this wait?

 

[Tigerace117]

And how many people had to die during this wait?

How many people could have died if the police officers had tried to pull a Rambo and engage the guy with their sidearms?

 

[mak2]

What? No stand down order?

 

[_Sal]

So was that not the right thing to do?

The 20 minutes doesn't bother me but the three hour wait, I certainly couldn't have lasted that long, the fear would have killed me. In a situation such as this each minute must seem like an eternity

 

[Μολὼν λαβέ]

"We just basically stayed there, waited for movement, and we just held our position until SWAT got there,” said Cornwell, 25, who never fired his weapon. “Once SWAT got there they told us to retreat, that they’d take over because we were not really in tactical gear — we were just in our police uniforms.”

Makes sense to me, establish a perimeter and wait.

Specially trained officers were sent to deal with a situation that could have possibly gotten those not specifically trained for this situation killed.

Police can't be there to protect people but rather respond. The type of response depends on the situation.

Police told not to pursue Orlando shooter for ‘15 or 20 minutes — could’ve been longer’ until SWAT arrived

 

[RogueWarrior]

The doctrine that many police forces train for is to engage the active shooter.
This especially true of forces where mass shootings have happened.
This wasn't a hostage taking. Waiting will definitely get more people killed.


People often say that bad people with guns are only stopped by good people with guns. This is only true the good guys have a spine instead of just being bullies with badges.
Until police value the lives of the people more than their own, they should take 'To Serve and Protect' off their cars or add 'Ourselves'.

 

[Bodi]

How many people could have died if the police officers had tried to pull a Rambo and engage the guy with their sidearms?

Nobody is saying that they had to go in like Rambo but they could have at least gone in...

 

[mak2]

Direct frontal assault like John Wayne? I think the first 15 or 20 minutes those people were locked in the bathroom, we probably wont know exactly what happened when for a long time, but I think it is a bit to early to blame the police for anything. And I seriously doubt Obama did it, ordered it done, or is trying to cover up anything about it.

Nobody is saying that they had to go in like Rambo but they could have at least gone in...

 

[Bodi]

Direct frontal assault like John Wayne? I think the first 15 or 20 minutes those people were locked in the bathroom, we probably wont know exactly what happened when for a long time, but I think it is a bit to early to blame the police for anything. And I seriously doubt Obama did it, ordered it done, or is trying to cover up anything about it.

Obama? Where the hell is that coming from? All I said is that they could have gone in. The cops have guns after all...

 

[Tigerace117]

Direct frontal assault like John Wayne? I think the first 15 or 20 minutes those people were locked in the bathroom, we probably wont know exactly what happened when for a long time, but I think it is a bit to early to blame the police for anything. And I seriously doubt Obama did it, ordered it done, or is trying to cover up anything about it.

Nobody is saying that they had to go in like Rambo but they could have at least gone in...

mak2 sums it up pretty well I think.

 

[Bodi]

mak2 sums it up pretty well I think.

I wasn't blaming the cops or Obama or calling for a John Wayne direct frontal assault so I don't think mak came anywhere near summing it up well...

 

[Tigerace117]

I wasn't blaming the cops or Obama or calling for a John Wayne direct frontal assault so I don't think mak came anywhere near summing it up well...

What else are they going to do? What's the point of going inside just to say you went inside?

 

[Bodi]

What else are they going to do? What's the point of going inside just to say you went inside?

Going inside little by little in order to stop the shooter. If he is blasting at them then maybe they don't but if he is in the back a few rooms away why can't they go in to secore more of the place? If that was not possible I understand. The argument I am countering simply is that they did not try.

 

[Tigerace117]

Going inside little by little in order to stop the shooter. If he is blasting at them then maybe they don't but if he is in the back a few rooms away why can't they go in to secore more of the place? If that was not possible I understand. The argument I am countering simply is that they did not try.

It's a little hard to secure a night club when you only have a couple guys and dozens of people are stampeding out of every exit.

My guess is that they decided that setting up a perimeter in order to prevent the shooter from escaping or anybody from bringing in more ammo and firearms in to him was higher priority.

They were also outgunned which in my guess probably was the deciding factor.

But these are just guesses, so idk.

 

[Bodi]

It's a little hard to secure a night club when you only have a couple guys and dozens of people are stampeding out of every exit.

My guess is that they decided that setting up a perimeter in order to prevent the shooter from escaping or anybody from bringing in more ammo and firearms in to him was higher priority.

They were also outgunned which in my guess probably was the deciding factor.

But these are just guesses, so idk.

IDK either. It is a tough situation and I am sure that they did their best (cops). Time for new training because this is not the last time something like this will happen.

 

[Tigerace117]

IDK either. It is a tough situation and I am sure that they did their best (cops). Time for new training because this is not the last time something like this will happen.

Very true, unfortunately. No shortage of maniacs.

 

[Patrickt]

The longer this goes the more suspicious the story becomes.

I am curious as to how and why this murder became a federal case instead of a state case?

In the last forty years almost everything has become a federal case. When President Kennedy was assassinated it was a state case because there was no federal violation. Now, almost everything is a federal offense.

A dark club, 300 people without guns, one guy with guns, and some people think five cops should have been sent running in to start shooting. If the police went in and 100 people went running outside, how would you make sure the shooter wasn't in the group? When the police are facing thirty people in a dark room and one of the police officers is shot, what should they do?

Remember, nothing is difficult for the person who doesn't have to do it.

 

[roughdraft274]

And how many people had to die during this wait?

Cornwell said they never saw Mateen; he said the shooter had vanished inside the dimly lit club as Cornwell and the other officers followed the sounds of screams and echoing gunfire to the bathroom area where they presumed the gunman was now holed up. He said they aimed their assault rifles toward that area as the sounds of gunfire stopped. He said that they then followed orders to hold their position for what he described as “15 or 20 minutes — could’ve been longer” until the SWAT team arrived.

They didn't just stand there and let people die. He went in to the bathroom and the gunfire stopped. There's no reason to rush the door if he isn't hurting anybody at that point, so they waiting on swat.

 

[jonny5]

— could’ve been longer’ until SWAT arrived

ORLANDO — After an initial burst of fire between Omar Mateen and a security guard at the Pulse nightclub, a group of five to six police officers arrived on the scene within minutes, broke through a large glass window and entered the club as the killing of 49 people was underway inside, according to a Belle Isle police officer who was among the first responders.
In the first public accounting of those critical early minutes by an officer who actually went inside the club, Belle Isle police officer Brandon Cornwell, 25, said the ad-hoc team spent the first seconds inside “trying to locate exactly where the shooter was — we kept hearing people scream and shots fired.”

He said he arrived “in 38 seconds.” “We just basically stayed there, waited for movement, and we just held our position until SWAT got there,” said Cornwell, 25, who never fired his weapon.

Police told not to pursue Orlando shooter for ‘15 or 20 minutes — could’ve been longer’ until SWAT arrived

Im unclear. At this point had the shooting stopped?