Pick a Major while a minor (1 Viewer)

[DeeJayH]

http://www.sptimes.com/2006/02/26/State/Pick_a_major_while_yo.shtml

TALLAHASSEE - Under Gov. Jeb Bush's proposed makeover for middle and high schools, students would begin tailoring their course selections to their future career as early as sixth grade.
Tenth-graders would pick majors and minors, just like in college.

Like Jeb
dont like this plan
like kids really have a clue

but maybe if they haVE more of a say in what they study, they may do better in whatever field they land later on in life

 

[RightinNYC]

I think that's an amazing idea. It's definitely an improvement. Of course kids won't always know exactly what they want to do, but most kids have a general idea. By 10th grade, kids who wanted to go into art were already taking 2 or 3 art courses at a time, kids who wanted to go into languages were taking a couple languages, kids who wanted to go into math were taking advanced math courses, and kids who werent planning on going to college were taking afternoon training for trades.

This will do nothing but help.

 

[FallingPianos]

if a kid wants all of their elective courses to be in math, thats fine, but a kid shouldnt be forced to have their elective in one topic if they dont want to.

 

[DeeJayH]

yet most kids cant think about anything besides today
so many college bound seniors are riddled with angst trying to figure out what to study in college
isnt a broader range of studies in jr/sr high schools better by giving them more tastes of what is out there
*and i know they are already underfunded, and programs are being cut left and right*

arent kids dealing with enough pressures without having to figure out what they are going to do with the rest of their life
I know i wanted to be an astronaut my whole childhood
didnt quite work out since i now sell real estate
but not everybody knows what they want
and i think it may be more important for the kids to be exposed to more, so they can better determine what is the best fit

if a kid likes something, it does not mean he will succeed at it
and what he can succeed at, he may not like

so wouldn't it make more sense to have the kid experience as many possibilities as possible
than make the decision of
this is what i am good at, this is what i will do for a career
this is what i like, this is what i will do on the side

most people i meet are not happy about what they do
they are doing what they have to do, usually due to poor life decisions

and this is a bit of a stretch, but it doesnt seem to me, at first glance, that this idea of 'pick a major while a minor' is that far from USSRs early testing that Determined What a person would do the rest of their life
:twocents:

 

[::Major_Baker::]

Bad idea. Education needs to be broad and unfocused during these years, in my opinion. That's what college is for, narrowing it down.

Besides, the average college student changes their major many times---how indecisive are high school students??@?!?!?
How much have you changed since high school, for those of you beyond..?

 

[MrFungus420]

I think that it would be a better use of time, effort and funds to try to do a better job of teaching the basics, giving children a broad knowledge base.

We now have a life expectancy in excess of 70 years, so why would we want to force a major life choice on young children?

From what I've seen, American students are continuing to fall farther behind many other developed countries. Now, here we have a suggestion to reduce what our children are learning?

 

[RightinNYC]

I think people are missing the point. It's not an effort to reduce what children are learning, or to force them into a field. It's simply an opportunity for those who choose to exercise it to gain extra experience in areas that interest them.

Honestly, most countries that have better education systems do this.

Think about it: If you're a sophomore in High School, you have certain subjects that you're good and and certain ones that you're not. If you're a math genius, but terrible at languages, should you be forced to take that extra year of spanish, or should you be allowed to take advanced Calculus? Which one will be better for you?

If you're a great writer, but cant do science to save your life, should you be forced to take physics, even after taking chem, bio, and geology? Or would your education be better served by taking a literature course?

Kids are always going to change their minds, but the only way you learn what you do and dont like is by being exposed to it. Maybe it's just me, but I'd prefer to realize that I didn't like a subject while in high school, rather than after wasting 45,000 on a year of college learning it.

And not everyone changes majors, I've had the same majors/career plan since I was 6.

 

[Willow]

The country I went to high school in did this and it worked out fine for me because I didnt' know what I wanted so I took everything. But it didn't work out so well for many others. I had several friends who had to go back and take summer courses so they could take the college course they wanted . The problem is if you focus too much on one specific thing then you don't have the option of changing your mind when you get to college and have a little more maturity to think about what you are really going to be doing for the rest of your life. My son always wanted to be a doctor, loved it all, sciences, biology, then passed out cold the first day they dissected something and that was it for him. He totally changed his carreer goals. If he had geared all his studies towards that specific goal he would have had to spend an extra year in highschool making up for it or would have had to switch all his course in the middle of the year.

 

[RightinNYC]

My son always wanted to be a doctor, loved it all, sciences, biology, then passed out cold the first day they dissected something and that was it for him. He totally changed his carreer goals. If he had geared all his studies towards that specific goal he would have had to spend an extra year in highschool making up for it or would have had to switch all his course in the middle of the year.

In high school, there was plenty of dissection in higher level science courses. Think about it this way, would you prefer your son to graduate high school, spend a year at college, and THEN realize that he didn't like dissection, or to be exposed to it in high school, realize he didn't like it, and then change his focus.

One costs a LOT more than the other...

 

[Stace]

I dunno, I always thought my high school was pretty good already in regards to this. There were certain classes you HAD to take each year, though after 9th grade, I was no longer required to take a science course, and after 10th grade, I was no longer required to take a math course - and I definitely took that option, because those were my two least favorite subjects. I took almost every English course offered by my school, also took most of the child development courses we had, as well as business courses, including being released early my senior year to go to work. Will those courses serve me well when I do finally go back to school? I'm fairly certain they will, as right now, I plan on getting a degree in English, early childhood education, or social work. But see, there's the thing right there - I'm 23 and STILL don't know for certain what I want to do, when I do go back to school and pursue a career again (after my kids are in school themselves). Required courses are a good thing....just because you don't like something/aren't good at it, doesn't mean that you shouldn't have that knowledge. Besides, there's required courses in college that fall outside of what actually applies to your chosen major, anyway, so it's better to get all of the knowledge you can in all of the subjects you can.

 

[Stace]

The idea of required courses would be better if high school GPA didn't mean anything. As is, though, being forced to take certain classes that you know you suck at and you know will carry little to no relevance in what career that you want to go to, then you will, more than likely, do poorly in that class, and that will hurt your GPA and effect what colleges you can get into.

As a personal example, my high school required 2 years of foreign languages. I can barely speak english, so learning another language has never been an option to me. Now, in the careers that I've planned to go into, sure knowing a foreign language might help, but it has never been essential (namely because I have no desire to learn a foreign language, and thus I have no desire to do anything that would require me to do so).

So I took it. I got a D in german, 1 C, 2 D's, and 1 F in Latin (since a lot of state schools require 2 years of 1 language), and in the end it really ****ed my GPA.

And that's the problem. That doesn't say anything else about me other than the fact that I suck at foreign languages, yet those grades reflected on me as a student just as much as those classes that are relevent to the careers that I've considered (math, social sciences, etc.)


I think learning other things is a really good thing to do, because you never know when knowing something about anthrapology and philosophy might be relevant in law, or when knowing calculus or accounting might be important in politics.
But, in requiring this **** you just increase the beurocracy, when we need to realize some people don't need to know some things, and they shouldn't be penalized because they're being forced to study something that they don't give a **** about, and probably still won't understand afterwards.

Yeah, there are certain things that shouldn't be a requirement, and foreign languages is one of them. My school only offered Spanish and German, and since it was a requirement for sophomores, I took Spanish 'cause I figured that be a lot more useful to me than German, what with all of the Latinos in this country...and it did help a little when my husband and I went to Acapulco a couple of years ago. But I hated taking the course, and while I did decent in it, I didn't excel like I did in my English courses. But things like math, science, history, and English should be required at least through 9th grade, if not 10th. Math and English are used every day, and while science and history may not apply to everyone's chosen careers, it's not bad stuff to just know.

 

[Willow]

In high school, there was plenty of dissection in higher level science courses. Think about it this way, would you prefer your son to graduate high school, spend a year at college, and THEN realize that he didn't like dissection, or to be exposed to it in high school, realize he didn't like it, and then change his focus.

One costs a LOT more than the other...

Of course they should do dissections in high school. I was surprised his school didn't do them till grade eleven. My point was that he discovered that in high school and was able to adjust. But had he geared his whole high school years up to that point around the sciences leaving out Languages, History and English, he would have had to change all of his courses and play catch up. Now because of the way the school has next years schedule set up he has to choose between Advanced Physics and Advanced English. He's been agonizing over this one choice for weeks.
(By they way he did finish biology with a 98%, the teacher allowed him to do an online dissection, I think it was actually the formaldehyde that made him pass out.)
I personally think they need to have some required course in the basics, English, Math, History and English and then let them choose the others. that way they have a solid rounded base but still have some freedom to decide what other courses they want. High schools students aren't old enough to have total freedom but aren't young enough to have none. They need a middle ground so they can make a mistake and learn from it but not have it be a huge one that would take an extra year to correct.

 

[DeeJayH]

Yeah, there are certain things that shouldn't be a requirement, and foreign languages is one of them. My school only offered Spanish and German, and since it was a requirement for sophomores, I took Spanish 'cause I figured that be a lot more useful to me than German, what with all of the Latinos in this country...and it did help a little when my husband and I went to Acapulco a couple of years ago. But I hated taking the course, and while I did decent in it, I didn't excel like I did in my English courses. But things like math, science, history, and English should be required at least through 9th grade, if not 10th. Math and English are used every day, and while science and history may not apply to everyone's chosen careers, it's not bad stuff to just know.

and yet isnt that a fine lesson for life in general
you are not going to like everything you HAVE to do to get ahead in life
but just because you dont like it, does not mean you do not try your best at it
taking all the easy classes is a cop out and will only hurt a person in the long run
I went to a private school where you had 9 classess a day, and you took 4 years of EVERYTHING
on top of that there was no D
passing grade was a 75
you took everything
you passed
or you were kicked out
just like in the real world

i, like most, are guilty of exceling in the classes that came easy
and got by in the classes that did not interest me, or did not come easy to me
but being required to do, what i did not like to do, was an excellent thing to learn
as a result, contrary to popular belief here probably , i was a much more well rounded student than all my friends who went to public school, and only took the minimum required courses, for the minimum required years of said class, so they could just graduate
now most of them are doing jobs they hate, for less money than they think they deserve
One of the most successful people i know, is my oldest friend. Dumb as a rock, but talented with mechanical things
he sucked it up
he got his diploma
and through some sick twisted turn of fate
is a millionaire due to his persistence and personality
He is an Investment Banker, aka stock broker

why are so many people so anxious to make kids grow up faster than they already do
you are only a child once, and they are under enough pressure as it is
they dont need more

 

[DeeJayH]

Of course they should do dissections in high school. I was surprised his school didn't do them till grade eleven. My point was that he discovered that in high school and was able to adjust. But had he geared his whole high school years up to that point around the sciences leaving out Languages, History and English, he would have had to change all of his courses and play catch up. Now because of the way the school has next years schedule set up he has to choose between Advanced Physics and Advanced English. He's been agonizing over this one choice for weeks.
(By they way he did finish biology with a 98%, the teacher allowed him to do an online dissection, I think it was actually the formaldehyde that made him pass out.)
I personally think they need to have some required course in the basics, English, Math, History and English and then let them choose the others. that way they have a solid rounded base but still have some freedom to decide what other courses they want. High schools students aren't old enough to have total freedom but aren't young enough to have none. They need a middle ground so they can make a mistake and learn from it but not have it be a huge one that would take an extra year to correct.

some twisted SOB put the fetal pig from dissection class into the bowl of ketchup on Burger day
boy was i glad my family was poor and I had to brown bag lunch everyday :2razz:
believe that happened in 10th grade

 

[Stace]

and yet isnt that a fine lesson for life in general
you are not going to like everything you HAVE to do to get ahead in life
but just because you dont like it, does not mean you do not try your best at it
taking all the easy classes is a cop out and will only hurt a person in the long run
I went to a private school where you had 9 classess a day, and you took 4 years of EVERYTHING
on top of that there was no D
passing grade was a 75
you took everything
you passed
or you were kicked out
just like in the real world

i, like most, are guilty of exceling in the classes that came easy
and got by in the classes that did not interest me, or did not come easy to me
but being required to do, what i did not like to do, was an excellent thing to learn
as a result, contrary to popular belief here probably , i was a much more well rounded student than all my friends who went to public school, and only took the minimum required courses, for the minimum required years of said class, so they could just graduate
now most of them are doing jobs they hate, for less money than they think they deserve
One of the most successful people i know, is my oldest friend. Dumb as a rock, but talented with mechanical things
he sucked it up
he got his diploma
and through some sick twisted turn of fate
is a millionaire due to his persistence and personality
He is an Investment Banker, aka stock broker

why are so many people so anxious to make kids grow up faster than they already do
you are only a child once, and they are under enough pressure as it is
they dont need more

Ya know, DeeJayH, this is probably the first time I've agreed with you. I hated math and science in school, but I sucked it up and did the best I could...science wasn't really hard, I just didn't like it, but Algebra II/Trig was a bitch for me. But you're absolutely right, there are tons of things in life that you have to do even when you don't want to, that's just how it is, and kids need to learn early on that just because you don't like something, that doesn't mean you shouldn't try your hardest at it.

 

[RightinNYC]

Ya know, DeeJayH, this is probably the first time I've agreed with you. I hated math and science in school, but I sucked it up and did the best I could...science wasn't really hard, I just didn't like it, but Algebra II/Trig was a bitch for me. But you're absolutely right, there are tons of things in life that you have to do even when you don't want to, that's just how it is, and kids need to learn early on that just because you don't like something, that doesn't mean you shouldn't try your hardest at it.

I dunno, the way I look at it is that we should be teaching kids that if they work hard in the things they excel at, then they wont necessarily find themselves stuck doing something they hate later in life. While I think there should obviously be core requirements, I don't think that "While, life sucks and you have to do things you hate, so get used to it now" is a good message to pass onto kids.

I think forcing students to take courses that are irrelevant/boring/do not contribute to a career is one of the main reasons we have such student apathy. I absolutely love learning, love school, and look forward to several more years of it. But that's because I am taking the courses that I want to take now. If next semester, I had to take courses on Literature, Spanish, Biology, and Calculus, I'd probably drop out of college.

 

[Stace]

I dunno, the way I look at it is that we should be teaching kids that if they work hard in the things they excel at, then they wont necessarily find themselves stuck doing something they hate later in life. While I think there should obviously be core requirements, I don't think that "While, life sucks and you have to do things you hate, so get used to it now" is a good message to pass onto kids.

I think forcing students to take courses that are irrelevant/boring/do not contribute to a career is one of the main reasons we have such student apathy. I absolutely love learning, love school, and look forward to several more years of it. But that's because I am taking the courses that I want to take now. If next semester, I had to take courses on Literature, Spanish, Biology, and Calculus, I'd probably drop out of college.

See, that's why in my scenario, you only have certain requirements through 10th grade at the most. I had a couple of requirements my junior and senior years as well, but for the most part, my schedule was almost all electives. It's not so much about teaching kids that life sucks, it's more about teaching them to take responsibility and do their best, even when it comes to something they don't necessarily enjoy. Even if they get a great job in some field that they excel at, there's still going to be things they're going to have to deal with that they don't like and/or don't excel at.....it's a fact of life.

 

[DeeJayH]

I dunno, the way I look at it is that we should be teaching kids that if they work hard in the things they excel at, then they wont necessarily find themselves stuck doing something they hate later in life. While I think there should obviously be core requirements, I don't think that "While, life sucks and you have to do things you hate, so get used to it now" is a good message to pass onto kids.

I think forcing students to take courses that are irrelevant/boring/do not contribute to a career is one of the main reasons we have such student apathy. I absolutely love learning, love school, and look forward to several more years of it. But that's because I am taking the courses that I want to take now. If next semester, I had to take courses on Literature, Spanish, Biology, and Calculus, I'd probably drop out of college.

my focus in school was to become an astronaut
i went to college for Aerospace Engineering
since then i have owned/operated a courier company
been a stock broker
a mortgage agent
and am currently a Realtor
children need a broad base of education, because most people do not end up in the job they thought they would spend their entire adult life doing

I love my job.
but there is a lot of mundane B.S. work i have to do to build a business
it is not all showing houses and collecting $1000's in commissions

some kids want to become doctors
some because a doctor made a huge difference in their life personally
others to save lives
yet when they become doctors they realize, unless they work in the ER, the majority of the beginning years of their careers is paperwork, and mundane client checkups
Not everything a child dreams a job will be, is what it turns out to be
and NOBODY knows where their life will end up

 

[RightinNYC]

my focus in school was to become an astronaut
i went to college for Aerospace Engineering
since then i have owned/operated a courier company
been a stock broker
a mortgage agent
and am currently a Realtor
children need a broad base of education, because most people do not end up in the job they thought they would spend their entire adult life doing

I love my job.
but there is a lot of mundane B.S. work i have to do to build a business
it is not all showing houses and collecting $1000's in commissions

some kids want to become doctors
some because a doctor made a huge difference in their life personally
others to save lives
yet when they become doctors they realize, unless they work in the ER, the majority of the beginning years of their careers is paperwork, and mundane client checkups
Not everything a child dreams a job will be, is what it turns out to be
and NOBODY knows where their life will end up

But the question is, do you actually think that the things you learned in your core required classes in grades 10-12 actually helped you with your Courier business, becoming a stock broker, or a mortgage agent? Or was the reason you were able to function in those areas simply because you worked at it, and had an ability to pick it up as you went along?

 

[DeeJayH]

But the question is, do you actually think that the things you learned in your core required classes in grades 10-12 actually helped you with your Courier business, becoming a stock broker, or a mortgage agent? Or was the reason you were able to function in those areas simply because you worked at it, and had an ability to pick it up as you went along?

i would say it has more to do with the values i was brought up with
work hard
suck it up when things suck
keep moving forward

my school only reinforced that, by not only requiring you to take 4 years of all classess picked, no matter how hard they were, no matter how irrelevant they were to your chosen profession,
and also that you had to get a higher grade just to pass
not to mention we had, on average, 3 hours of homework per night
nothing in this life comes easy, least of all success
unless you want to be a yes man or welfare mom

 

[Tashah]

Perhaps it depends on each individual. I always knew that I wanted to explore the cosmos. I was able to leapfrog some years in elementary school and my high school syllabus was very heavy in the sciences and math. Thus when I entered the university, I was light years ahead of the pack. This preparation served me extraordinarily well as my chosen university had an extremely accelerated pace of learning. At midterm, we were usually taking our course finals. In simple terms, about six years of university education was compressed into a four year span. I have serious doubts about whether I could have maintained this pace without the knowledge cushion and learning skills I acquired due to a highly focused high school curriculum.